• Welcome to the largest (sim) racing website in the world!
    Blurring the line between real and virtual motorsports.

Featured F1 Canadian Grand Prix: Vettel Penalty... Deserved or Unfair?

Discussion in 'Formula 1' started by Paul Jeffrey, Jun 9, 2019.

  1. liby88

    liby88

    Messages:
    59
    Ratings:
    +17
    i would say give hamilton 5 secs aswell cause of dangerous driving he saw vettel goin of an he should know that his just can came back were he didi and lewis didn´t slow down so he was takin the risk if he would lift the gas and went of the line with slower speed he could easily overtake him but well this stewards never have been on a race track obviously , and i have to say i don´t like vettel , just in case of fanboi bla bla
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 5
    • Haha Haha x 2
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Kakusso

    Kakusso

    Messages:
    255
    Ratings:
    +214
    Vettel has a tendency to lose the rear of his car under pressure. It happened yet again. A great driver like him should invest in a personal trainer to correct that.
    Regarding the punishment Vettel impeded Hamilton weather it was intentional or not is irrelevant. In any sport the intention when in fault is irrelevant.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 8
    • Agree Agree x 1
  3. Authense

    Authense
    So fast I am slow Premium

    Messages:
    151
    Ratings:
    +53
    There are people who do believe that the rules have been followed and there are other people who don't. Fine. That can be discussed forever but it is what it is.

    But then there are people who believe this has to do with what they call "fairness" nowadays. These are the funny people. Most of the members of this growing group also think that equal opportunities should - correction - must lead to equal outcome and if not I has to be imposed by law. "Why do I get punished for speeding and the other car I saw doesn't? That's not fair, judge!" Imagine!

    Proposal:
    Why don't we debate the paygap in F1 then? Is it "fair" that Hamilton gets so much more money than Lando Norris while taking less risk in a much better car? Let's have as many fairness question as we can make up. With his one hand messed up Kubica should get something extra every race - not fair.

    Let's hear the best driver of today on the radio and then in the drivers waiting room: "Teacher, teacher! He forced me off the track!". Again on the radio "I surely did not want to win this way" but then towards Vettel "that was the teachers decision"...yeah, he is a true gentleman and such a fair sportsman too, an icon for sure, a true idol of today, an example for children.

    Fairness? Really? - ROFL
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  4. RobertGracie

    RobertGracie

    Messages:
    258
    Ratings:
    +56
    Vettel was out of control at the time of the incident and how could he have turned to the left with full opposite right hand lock on? I will tell you how he needed to break the laws of physics to do it, that penalty was pressured from Mercedes, I would quite like to see the FIA review their policy to become more neutral in F1 rather than favouring one team....
     
    • Like Like x 2
  5. Authense

    Authense
    So fast I am slow Premium

    Messages:
    151
    Ratings:
    +53
    I don't think so, Robert. Mercedes will easily win this championship and besides "fairness" the owners of F1 need some "competition", it must not get too boring. So why would they allow the stewards to favor that one team which always wins? Makes no sense at all.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. liby88

    liby88

    Messages:
    59
    Ratings:
    +17
    na payment is such a thing do u really think manager deserve tons of money? most of them not really but they get it anyways. so payment , each team should pay what they think
     
  7. Denis Betty

    Denis Betty
    Staff Premium

    Messages:
    5,117
    Ratings:
    +1,833
    Whether you call it compromising somebodies lap or blocking, it amounts to the same. OK, my choice of words wasn't the best, but Vettel made a mistake and almost came to a stop on the racing line, right in front of the guy he was racing - causing Hamilton to stop. At this point, he has seriously disadvantaged another driver. Keeping the place is just cheating.
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2019
    • Agree Agree x 2
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
    • Haha Haha x 1
  8. mrbungle83

    mrbungle83
    Premium

    Messages:
    258
    Ratings:
    +122
    Don't apply to be a steward its bad enough as it is.
     
    • Haha Haha x 5
  9. Kaygeeoh

    Kaygeeoh
    Premium

    Messages:
    129
    Ratings:
    +95
    When Vettel pressed his brakes on that corner, he knew full well how far HAM was behind him. Did he panic thinking he might lose position when he was grass cutting, probably. He was off track, no longer on the racing line. When he comes back on track, his priority should be to get control of the car, not get back on track and impede the following driver who is still on track and on the racing line. The following driver had to take evasive action to avoid an accident. Had there not been a wall there he would have been pushed off the track. Hence the penalty. He made a mistake that had a cascading effect and led to the penalty. He needs to not make these mistakes, then he would not be in this position.

    That being said, that penalty call was bull from a racing fan point of view. If in his appeal the stewards can put forward evidence that he was unsafe, and did not try to get the car under control before rejoining the track, then so be it. If not, then they should reverse the decision and give the man his dues.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. Fat-Alfie

    Fat-Alfie
    David Pemberton Premium

    Messages:
    1,874
    Ratings:
    +2,667
    I suspect that there is something in Vettel's telemetry that shows he did not use 'slowing down' as a means to regain control of his car. If that is the case, it's a fair penalty - if not, then Vettel should feel hard done by.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  11. Filip Carlén

    Filip Carlén
    Premium

    Messages:
    428
    Ratings:
    +338
    This has had me think quite a lot... Yea, VET did block HAM, but what would have happened if VET tried anything else? Hard on the brake would cause a lock up, making him go in to the wall, or even if he would have made it, HAM would have hit him. Going further to the left? With grassy tires that would probably caused a spin, and HAM would probably hit VET. I think VET did the best thing he could (except for not missing the corner, duh), and got penalized really hard for that. For me, that feels wrong. Five seconds is insanely much in F1, the last car in Q1 was four seconds after the fasted Q3 time. F1 should consider a better way of penalizing minor stuff, maybe like MotoGPs new "penalty zone", a small detour taking a 1-2 seconds (as pictures below). [​IMG]
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
    • Beer Beer x 1
  12. farjam

    farjam

    Messages:
    556
    Ratings:
    +208
    • Like Like x 3
    • Beer Beer x 2
    • Agree Agree x 1
  13. ears

    ears
    Listen, we're bona fide, we're not from London.

    Messages:
    1,033
    Ratings:
    +498
    I don't think it is about safety. Vettel appeared to try and make it about safety. It's not about Hamilton at all.

    Besides, watching the videos again, the car was totally under control way before he drifted to the wall. You see him looking in his mirrors too.

    There's a lot of emotion in this one, probably because of a quite common desire to see a break in Mercedes dominance.

    It would have been interesting to see the reaction had it been the other way around. If Hamilton had made the error, if he'd impeded Vettel, preventing him from taking the lead and if no penalty had been applied.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Love Love x 1
  14. ears

    ears
    Listen, we're bona fide, we're not from London.

    Messages:
    1,033
    Ratings:
    +498


    This quote was found and included in an article on the BBC website by Andrew Benson.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  15. Pawel Ziolkowski

    Pawel Ziolkowski

    Messages:
    224
    Ratings:
    +75
    That was really masterfully done blocking by Vettel. Really enjoyed that.
    And assuming that being fully out of control during that would not be an infraction, it was amazing work/balls of the stewards to notice and apply that penalty.

    But lol at the pool results sitting at only 22% for the penalty. I guess most voted with their hearts. Because I'd too wholeheartedly disagree with the idea of having a penalty after that incident, but i think it was a correct move on behalf of the stewards.

    So tbh it makes this pool really hard to judge (fair to what? fair to rules yes, fair to drivers/spectators? no)
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
    • Love Love x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  16. Flip-Flop Driver

    Flip-Flop Driver

    Messages:
    58
    Ratings:
    +59
    One thing I haven't seen mentioned is how good this generation of drivers is when it comes to play tricks.
    When Schumacher played his tricks he got caught half of the time.
    But Rosberg in Monaco 2014 played it perfectly.
    And Vettel today almost got away with it. Not only he showed a lot of ability in blocking Hamilton in a dubious way he also deserves an Oscar for his acting performance on the radio and after the race.
    Any driver would have resorted to the same bag of tricks.
    But they are getting so good in it that it reminds me of the movie Gone Girl. :roflmao:
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 3
    • Like Like x 2
    • Haha Haha x 2
  17. Minardi10

    Minardi10

    Messages:
    103
    Ratings:
    +15
    Hamilton is to break all records of Michael Schumacher bending and breaking.
    As the officials are all means right.
    And besides,that can then be marketed very well.
     
  18. Ruy Horta

    Ruy Horta

    Messages:
    168
    Ratings:
    +53
    What is F1?

    Boys will be boys, give them some room and you’ll likely see some good action.
    Mistakes are made when you push the limits, that’s what makes it fun.

    If you want robot engineers and safe and flawless driving, just remove the drivers from the car - go AI or if you want to keep human errors in go remote control. All very safe...

    Boys don’t race to play it safe.
    That’s why I always enjoy watching Aus Supercar racing.
    A lot of unforgiving tracks combined with rules that allow some actual racing.
    Cannot remember when I last bothered to schedule watching an F1 race.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  19. ears

    ears
    Listen, we're bona fide, we're not from London.

    Messages:
    1,033
    Ratings:
    +498
    I'm not sure it's been mentioned amongst all the "strong opinions" but Ferrari have submitted an appeal. Should be interesting.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  20. Richard Hessels

    Richard Hessels
    Premium

    Messages:
    1,211
    Ratings:
    +326
    Vettel made a great TV show from it afterwards.
    Was quite impressed he did no slam the wall in front or right after that on the right side.
    He was on full lock, all the time still ahead of Hamilton.
    Sometimes you should for the course of the race and the spectacle see whats fair (still a TV show).
    Previous race with Verstappen, there was contact that could have been avoided.
    Bottas car got damaged on the way, so yes thats 5 seconds well deserved.
    In this case, did the driver do anything to avoid collision, yes.
    Has there been any contact, no. Than just race!!!
    Hamilton could have lived with being second and would happy for Seb, you would have seen satisfied atlethes on the podium. Fans would have loved to see another brand on finishing first.
    This ending was a disgrace to the sports.
    Giving Vettel no penalty was easier to explain than giving it in the end.
     
    • Agree Agree x 3
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.