'SimShaker - Wheels' support thread

[=Andre=]

Here you can get help with "SimShaker - Wheels" issues and questions.

SimShaker - Wheels is a mediation software between a supported car simulation game and Gametrix JetSeat or well known Buttckicker hardware to provide immersing event driven vibration FXs (special effects).
Currently supported PC titles: iRacing, Assetto Corsa, Automobilista, rFactor 2, DiRT Rally, Project CARS, Project CARS2, ETS2, ATS, F1 2016/2017 and RRRE.
Currently supported console titles: F1 2016.

 

[=Andre=]

In which game(s) do you like it?

 

[scottiedawg66]

Assetto corsa

 

[Mr Latte]

I consider playing wheel slip as a bit tricky. I think slip itself doesn't produces vibration, if the wheel is balanced.
Let's say we are driving an icy road, there will be a lot of slip but very little vibration and wearing tire yelling.
Let's say we are cornering at tarmac, there will be not too much slip, but pretty noticeable yelling and vibration.
I'd prefer to base effect on tire wear data wherever that's possible (Project Cars1/2, RRRE, rFactor2-wise).
I've found tire wear data available only on pit-stops in iRacing what makes them useless for me and weird (poor?) wear data in AC, what makes me to use wheel slip data to play the effect in case of AC.
Currently, if I use slip data, in most cases I flip left and right side of the effect, since while cornering the inner side is unloaded and experiences more slip, but less wear, the outer side is loaded and experiences less slip but more wear.

So, two common instances with track situations regard wheelslip. Firstly with excessive steering input via oversteer or secondly, too much speed entry into a corner and the car understeering and sliding.

Using the right waveform and applying mid-high frequencies for this effect. What I found was its possible to get a character for the effect that feels quite good. I have multiple .wav options already trialed for this. However, we want to avoid it feeling too heavy or producing an unnatural thump, thump, thump sensation yet be more like a coarse sensation. For added grit type feel I could perhaps place some (brown/pink noise) into a waveform to help with this but my queries/concern is more how to bring increased definition to the feel for individual wheels.

However, a major issue with this effect being active for potentially seconds and with TST based units is that when experimenting and using some mid-high bass frequencies it can create issues with the harmonics and depending on the waveform etc bring an audible tone (as these are also like speakers). So when the effect is active, this can generate a very annoying sound which ain't good.

If having fully working "tyre wear" based data then I question how do we bring the sensation of this to feel different with "wheel slip" between each wheel? I don't think amplitude is quite enough with a single .wav being used.

My proposal would be to consider two effects for "wheel slip" and have it operate with a threshold regards its values like previously done for road surface. So by potentially splitting higher/lower values these then can have their own individual waveform that helps bring greater definition between them. The wheel with more load can have more midbass, the wheel with more slip can have more high bass and (grit sensation). I believe I can pull out good effects for this if it's worth doing or even possible.

RTL
I think what most people would want from wheelslip or tyres is an ability to better feel "rear traction loss".

 

[scottiedawg66]

Rear traction loss, and front traction loss are good for immersion.

What would really help lap times is to have vibration effects that correlate to.the audio from the tires. This would help translate feel of the tires before any wear / slip and having a feel of the tire when it is approaching the limit of traction in addition to a unique vibrarion once wheel slip begins.

Being able to feel a distinctive sensation between being near the limit of traction, on the limit of traction and over the limit of traction would be HUGE

Probably a tall order but figired id throw it out there.

 

[=Andre=]

Guys, I think of buying a set of 4 bass-shakers along with amp(s) in order to improve my SSW default samples and 4 wheels processing effects. I'd like to use the most popular hardware to meet the most sim-racers needs.
What do you think is the most popular combination of bass-shakers and amps among sim-racers?

 

[Mr Latte]

I think that's a great idea Andre !

If keeping to a reasonable budget consider Reckhorn or ADX tactile units.
SMSL 160w Stereo amps (tiny but used by many) are decent enough (see ebay/amazon)

If looking more long-term with upgradability in mind and more features then the Behringer iNuke DSP 1000 or 3000 model amps are amongst the best for tactile. These will power 2ohm or 4ohm units and have enough power for the bigger units if you ever decide to purchase them or seek to upgrade later.

The BK Advance is probably one of the best units in terms of performance/price but you then go into much higher price points when considering multiple units.

The BK Mini has more punch than the Reckhorn / ADX but does have issues with piston/pang and high energy being used with frequencies under 35Hz. These can be controlled via iNuke DSP but more troublesome on standard amps or those only with basic crossover controls.

 

[anton_Chez]

Hi guys,

Nice idea Andre I think that would help the software tremendously. I have the SMSL amp that Mr. Latte speaks of and can recommend it highly. I had some doubts about it running 2 mini LFE units but they have power to spare from what I can tell.

I have tried to find ways of curing this annoying pang in the mini, and seem to have done so by using Mr. Latte's recommendation of using a software EQ. However, this does not work in SSW. Could it be that it insisting on using exclusive mode in Windows is preventing the signal from being altered before it reaches SSW? It works in Simvibe and when playing music and general audio through the mini's but has zero effect in SSW.

For what it's worth I think 4 mini LFE's and 2 SMSL 160W amps would not break the bank too much and definitely give you a good impression of what your software is doing/capable of. The pang I speak of is an issue but if we can EQ that out then it negates the need for higher prices amps. We can also cure piston pang via the .wav files but this may be a much bigger job than just slashing the entire range below 35Hz to basically output zero volume.

 

[DanStock]

Ordered the JetSeat and have been playing with it for a few weeks now... and it's amazing! The only negative is that I think one of the vibration motors might be a dud, but the software doesn't seem to isolate (it test by 6 sections, though there at 8 motors), but it really doesn't seem to impact immersion.

I'm using the SimShaker Wheel software and, as advertised, it works "plug and play" with Assetto Corsa (my sim of choice) controlling both the seat vibration and my two Aura bass shakers.

However, I've been unable to get it to work with any other sims (iRacing, rFactor2, F1 2017 and Project Cars 1/2 have been tried). I have read the FAQ and modified the required xml info (for F1 2017) and checked the boxes inside the software for rF2 and inside the settings for PC2. iRacing is supposedly plug and play.

When I boot up Assetto Corsa, the software automatically starts and works perfect - but not with any of these other titles. Any idea what I'm doing wrong here?

 

[Mr Latte]

..

 

[=Andre=]

Ordered the JetSeat and have been playing with it for a few weeks now... and it's amazing! The only negative is that I think one of the vibration motors might be a dud, but the software doesn't seem to isolate (it test by 6 sections, though there at 8 motors), but it really doesn't seem to impact immersion.

I'm using the SimShaker Wheel software and, as advertised, it works "plug and play" with Assetto Corsa (my sim of choice) controlling both the seat vibration and my two Aura bass shakers.

However, I've been unable to get it to work with any other sims (iRacing, rFactor2, F1 2017 and Project Cars 1/2 have been tried). I have read the FAQ and modified the required xml info (for F1 2017) and checked the boxes inside the software for rF2 and inside the settings for PC2. iRacing is supposedly plug and play.

When I boot up Assetto Corsa, the software automatically starts and works perfect - but not with any of these other titles. Any idea what I'm doing wrong here?

Thank you for the feedback, Dan.
I wonder which motor is dud?
I've tested all the motors prior to shipping. May be one could temporarily get stuck.

Regarding other sims (iRacing, rFactor2, F1 2017 and Project Cars 1/2) please try to use Manual Start button and if still no luck please PM me some screenshot of SSW main window when the game is running.

 

[=Andre=]

Hi guys,

I have tried to find ways of curing this annoying pang in the mini, and seem to have done so by using Mr. Latte's recommendation of using a software EQ. However, this does not work in SSW. Could it be that it insisting on using exclusive mode in Windows is preventing the signal from being altered before it reaches SSW? It works in Simvibe and when playing music and general audio through the mini's but has zero effect in SSW.

Actually audio signal doesn't reach SSW, that's not the way it works. I suggest you should select your EQ input in SSW sound card selection drop down in order to include EQ in the sound chain.

 

[DanStock]

Thank you for the feedback, Dan.
I wonder which motor is dud?
I've tested all the motors prior to shipping. May be one could temporarily get stuck.

I’m only basing this on the fact that when I test the 6 sections using the software, the right side of the seat feels weaker than the left. Assuming there’s 4 motors in the bottom part of the seat, it’s the one under my right leg. Left leg/butt motors give a strong sensation, but the right side I only feel it vibrate under my ass.. not my leg. I haven’t taken anything apart to check, but I’m fairly handy and can test it if there’s a way you suggest? Again, it’s just based on “feel” so it could be just fine.

Regarding other sims (iRacing, rFactor2, F1 2017 and Project Cars 1/2) please try to use Manual Start button and if still no luck please PM me some screenshot of SSW main window when the game is running.

Ok, will do! I assume it's some sort of easy fix, since it works perfectly with AC. I'll check this evening and respond. Thanks for the tip!

 

[=Andre=]

I’m only basing this on the fact that when I test the 6 sections using the software, the right side of the seat feels weaker than the left. Assuming there’s 4 motors in the bottom part of the seat, it’s the one under my right leg. Left leg/butt motors give a strong sensation, but the right side I only feel it vibrate under my ass.. not my leg. I haven’t taken anything apart to check, but I’m fairly handy and can test it if there’s a way you suggest? Again, it’s just based on “feel” so it could be just fine.

Please try to give the motor under you right leg some good punches. Sometimes that helps.

 

[DanStock]

Please try to give the motor under you right leg some good punches. Sometimes that helps.

I tested again last night and the motors all definitely work... it just seems the right side seat motors are slightly weaker than the left, creating a sensation that only one of two motors was functioning versus the other side. Curious, but nothing that effects the overall performance. The motor on my left shoulder also makes a bit of whine and isn't as powerful as the right side, too. But, again, nothing that breaks the immersion when in use.

As for getting it to work with the other sims, I guess I just had to restart my PC as, when I went to try them a second time, everything worked perfectly! I tested iRacing, F1 2017, Project Cars 1/2, rFactor 2 with great success. So we're all good! Thanks for the help and the great product/support.

 

[Mr Latte]

Please try to give the motor under you right leg some good punches. Sometimes that helps.

This is how we fix problem on Russian Space Station

 

[=Andre=]

I like the movie but that small part of it looks really stupid.

 

[=Andre=]

As for getting it to work with the other sims, I guess I just had to restart my PC as, when I went to try them a second time, everything worked perfectly! I tested iRacing, F1 2017, Project Cars 1/2, rFactor 2 with great success. So we're all good! Thanks for the help and the great product/support.

Thank you for the update, Dan.

I tested again last night and the motors all definitely work... it just seems the right side seat motors are slightly weaker than the left, creating a sensation that only one of two motors was functioning versus the other side. Curious, but nothing that effects the overall performance. The motor on my left shoulder also makes a bit of whine and isn't as powerful as the right side, too. But, again, nothing that breaks the immersion when in use.

Individual motors vibration strength and sound may be not quite equal, this is considered by the manufacturer as normal.

 

[Mr Latte]

Andre can you shed some more insight into the Wheel/Slip effect please.

Can you confirm:
If we take centered steering as 0% and full lock as 100% turning range
Does having the SSW slider at 100% work in similar fashion to acceleration via a threshold?
What applies here, turning speed, turning %?

For example:
If I tested 2x .wav files (A/B) with the only difference being one was 2x the amplitude of the other.
A = -20dB
B = -10dB

Then if gain is only applied using example "A" with 100% slider gain. It should be the same as example "B" with 50% slider gain?

What I am enquiring, for effects is it better to have a suitable amplitude that allows the user to have upto 100% slider value used. Rather than a higher amplitude with an effect and only use 50% slider value. I seem to be going towards the 100% option.


I have spent a long time creating examples for this effect. To the point that I have combined 6 layers into a MASTER mix effect to be used. Over 9 hours building and testing yesterday at this. The reason for this is that within the individual layers are harmonics of the fundamental frequency used and frequencies that help bring a firm load sensation but also a grittiness for the surface of the tyre. Some attempts felt good but they played havoc with the TST in producing annoying audible tones.

My testing with this, seems to help smooth the thud,thud thud sensation that a single pure tone can cause. With multiple attempts in testing working with the individual layers amplitude within the mix. I believe I have enabled a way for the effect to operate well on the lowest frequencies for big units and still produce enough sensation with the more common models.

This method also seems to work particularly well when also making available different amplitudes for the effect and then 5% steps in frequency shifts to help a user select one that suits their hardware or preference best.

We could never bring this level of detailing or frequency control into Simvibe effects and I feel it is a major advantage to being able to not only create effects with a character we want but also bring a solution for all makes and models of tactile. I think I have cracked this issue.

 

[=Andre=]

Mr Latte in case of AC telemetry I use Physics.WheelSlip data exposed by the game in the shared memory, but not turning rate. As I had mentioned above I flip left-right sides to make the effect more natural in case of turnings.

 

[Mr Latte]

Mr Latte in case of AC telemetry I use Physics.WheelSlip data exposed by the game in the shared memory, but not turning rate. As I had mentioned above I flip left-right sides to make the effect more natural in case of turnings.

So in simple laymans terms (much preferred) based on tactile (not Jetseat) do you recommend for people to use lower amplitude for effects with 100% slider values if possible? I highlighted previously how this affected deceleration operation and not just increased gain, but the reason as nobody or yourself has said anything about how the slider value may also determine what the user feels from the effects operation.

Therefore it would be good without the technicalities of how it works to know what effects this may apply to more. Such will benefit anyone seeking to create their own effects.

Your own effects at 0dB are just crazy, for me, much much too overbearing to get anywhere close to 100% slider value but this may depend on the users own soundcard/amp and volume used.