Racing platform for Season 10

[Peter Marshall]

In the first part everybody need to say what car they prefer, and (vital) how important it is for them that they get it their way (e.g. David saying that he will not participate if we choose f3000 and Peter the opposite). Maybe someone will race either way but still prefer one alternative greatly for some reasonable reason.

I would NOT worry about what decision I might take regarding racing this season.

Ever since Andy retired, I have felt it was also time for me to go. I don't love the F1 Mod and personally have always thought that the F3000 felt far more real to drive and setup. I have only ever driven/ raced with PrestoGP so it would have been very difficult for me to not say yes to a F3000 season; for nostalgic reasons.

Edit: I don't have rF1 or rF2 or any other race sim unless you still consider GTR2 one.

 

[Nicolai Nicholson]

I would NOT worry about what decision I might take regarding racing this season.

That sounds a bit like David, but what you are both forgetting are that you are both part of PrestoGP. See Presto GP as a boat and its members the crew, without enough crew the boat will not sail. If many more than 1 take the season off, then PrestoGP takes the season off (Mika-style)

Nobody can be forced to sail with us, but at this point I see that we can be low on crew and would go for the solution that stands the best chance of Presto GP leaving the harbor for a 10th time.

 

[Reik Major]

I support Nicos suggestion about voting in two steps, because my vote definately depends on which decision would result in the highest amount of participants.

My personal likings about the car (game) we use are very much secondary. I only care about what resource it would require, because my machine is too weak to handle stuff like rF2 and I won't be able to buy a new one in the near future. Otherwise I'm fine with (nearly) everything.

So should we have a new thread about this matter with a headline that catches every old and also potential new members?

 

[Anthony Ishak]

Same here, I really do not mind what we race next year, I will go with any decision that sails the boat and when that happens I know the season will be a Very Successful one regardless of the type of the car we are going to race with..

 

[Henrik Jordfald Olsen]

I am in either way, have not tried out the F3000 yet, but will get down to it sometime next week.
If F3000 means closer racing I gotta admit it sounds more appealing - but like I said, there is no decision that will make me leave.

 

[David Turnbull]

im not going to be part of the reason presto takes a break so im trying my hardest to enjoy driving them, i still dont like practising with them that may come in time i suppose, the racing is good though but then it always was with mmg too so..... will see what happens with the vote but no doubt i'll hang around even if its just to turn up and make up numbers, as long as i feel safe enough with them i'll do it if i must

 

[Valter Ostman]

I

I would NOT worry about what decision I might take regarding racing this season.

Ever since Andy retired, I have felt it was also time for me to go. I don't love the F1 Mod and personally have always thought that the F3000 felt far more real to drive and setup. I have only ever driven/ raced with PrestoGP so it would have been very difficult for me to not say yes to a F3000 season; for nostalgic reasons.

Edit: I don't have rF1 or rF2 or any other race sim unless you still consider GTR2 one.

I like the F3000 for more real life feel. Our F1 cars must have at least +1000 horse power judging from our top speed compared to real F1. On every track a 58 year old idler is faster than Räikkönen. It's not that I don't believe in my self, but there must be a limit for my self deception.

 

[Nicolai Nicholson]

im not going to be part of the reason presto takes a break so im trying my hardest to enjoy driving them, i still dont like practising with them that may come in time i suppose, the racing is good though but then it always was with mmg too so..... will see what happens with the vote but no doubt i'll hang around even if its just to turn up and make up numbers, as long as i feel safe enough with them i'll do it if i must

Thank you for lifting my spirit David

 

[Sean Greenlaw]

I find it funny how some people now think mmg is unrealistic and undriveable lol and f3000 is best example of a sim car, we have used mmg for many seasons in a row and nobody ever complained before.
Its unrealistic as compared to real f1 currently, as current f1 is slower i think most f1 records are from 2004/5 seasons when cars were faster but not any more than f3000 is also.
A quick check on some of the f1 records v 2004/5 times and we are sometimes 4/5 secs and some more secs faster or 2007 f1 q 6 secs, a look at the f3000s real life times and mangy cours we are 6 secs faster and to monaco we are 7 secs faster than real life f3000s times so i would harldy say the f3000 is more accurate using laptimes etc as a guide, if you were you would have to say mmg times are closer most tracks.
So does this mean they are both just as accurate ? lol. Also I think our times are just as fast as compared to Kimi driving a f3000 also

Simracing times will always be faster, with inaccurate tracks and you can always go faster than real life online because we practise many more laps and have a esc button so laptimes never a good comparassin no matter the mod/car.

 

[Valter Ostman]

I find it funny how some people now think mmg is unrealistic and undriveable lol and f3000 is best example of a sim car, we have used mmg for many seasons in a row and nobody ever complained before.
Its unrealistic as compared to real f1 currently, as current f1 is slower i think most f1 records are from 2004/5 seasons when cars were faster but not any more than f3000 is also.
A quick check on some of the f1 records v 2004/5 times and we are sometimes 4/5 secs and some more secs faster or 2007 f1 q 6 secs, a look at the f3000s real life times and mangy cours we are 6 secs faster and to monaco we are 7 secs faster than real life f3000s times so i would harldy say the f3000 is more accurate using laptimes etc as a guide, if you were you would have to say mmg times are closer most tracks.
So does this mean they are both just as accurate ? lol. Also I think our times are just as fast as compared to Kimi driving a f3000 also

Simracing times will always be faster, with inaccurate tracks and you can always go faster than real life online because we practise many more laps and have a esc button so laptimes never a good comparassin no matter the mod/car.

I guess you are right my friend

 

[Bob Miley]

Not keen on F3000.
Not keen on F1 mmg.
Will always be a tin top driver.
Will paticipate with any car chosen.

As far as sims are concerned, will not buy RF2 or any game you only part own unless you pay an online subscription, the same reason I wont by an Xbox just so Microsoft can charge money to play online. If I buy a game I want full functionality offline and online, I know a lot of people don't agree, but as long as people are willing to pay a yearly fee for the odd new track and car package the game engine will never need updating and newer better games will become a thing of the past. Old and set in my ways. When Race does die I will have to see what all the fuss is about this television thingy.

Sorry for the rant, please feel free to ignore everything from line 4.

 

[Sean Greenlaw]

I feel very simaler to with subscriptions, why i got lifetime rf2 no more payments for me, sure its more to start with but if runs aslong as ive played race07/gtr, say 4/5 years i think its well worth the money and in its current state i think its best sim atm easily can only imagine what it will be like in future when released.
Im just off clio club race here on rd with rf2 its was mega fun and feels like throwing my car round knockhill in rl. I think ive had my moneys worth out of rf2 already in adrenaline

 

[Nicolai Nicholson]

I find it funny how some people now think mmg is unrealistic and undriveable lol and f3000 is best example of a sim car, we have used mmg for many seasons in a row and nobody ever complained before.

I think I said in a post last week that I thought the f3000 felt more realistic. When I tried the f3000 last week I had not raced it since season 3 (autumn/fall 2009). My immediate reaction was that it reminded me of the feel of a gokart (which I started racing spring 2011). This was not something I was thinking of before I drove, the feeling just struck me.

It was a general feel that the f3000 reminded me of the gokart, but if I am to mention one concrete thing it is that it takes skills to brake hard but not lock your wheels. And if you happen to lock your wheels it takes skills not to spin around (I found it so difficult with gokart that I rather made sure I never locked my wheels (whimp) ).
However, there are other pro-f3000 arguements I am less sure about, such as it is easier to drive or that it will make the group tighter in lap times.

In my view, the big pros and cons for f3000 are:

pros
-more realistic feel
-more realistic setup
-in-game car
-fresh challenge
-easier for prospective members to find us

cons
-there are only two tires; wet and dry, I thing strategy will be less significant
-we need to spend time re-inventing the setup
-For most it will most likely require more time practicing/preparing
-skins need to be organised
- in terms of race length, pit stops etc. we have "perfected" our race event from season 4 to season 9, with f1 we continue on the same path and possibly improve it, with f3000 we are taking two steps back and need to do some guess work.

 

[Dino Paolini]

I want to give my views on some of the points at Nicolai's pros and cons list My take is written in bold text

pros
-more realistic feel
-more realistic setup
- performance wise mmgF1 is more over the top, because we are talking about higher speeds in this mod. Overall all race07 cars tend to become much faster than their rl-counterparts even when you give them their exact rl performance-specs, due to a higher overall mechanical grip and the fact that you can set the cars up with less aero und much softer than you normaly should be able to (the last point is true for all the gMotor games though)
-easier for prospective members to find us
-in-game car - I don't think that is a difference, since I don't expect several new drivers on this stage of the game anymore and I don't think anyone is currently having a problem with installing the mod
-fresh challenge


cons
-there are only two tires; wet and dry, I thing strategy will be less significant
-we need to spend time re-inventing the setup
-For most it will most likely require more time practicing/preparing
-skins need to be organised
- in terms of race length, pit stops etc. we have "perfected" our race event from season 4 to season 9, with f1 we continue on the same path and possibly improve it, with f3000 we are taking two steps back and need to do some guess work.

Also to Bob's point:

As far as sims are concerned, will not buy RF2 or any game you only part own unless you pay an online subscription, the same reason I wont by an Xbox just so Microsoft can charge money to play online

The one is ~10€ per year (you could more see it as a donation for this price) with the first payment in the middle of 2014 and the other one is ~60€ a year, I think that's quite a difference

 

[Sean Greenlaw]

Id see it like this for f3000 with pro/cons as for more realistic handling im not to sure. Brakes are really quite good though like you say and like gokart/rl etc but i dont think it handles to realistic it feels like weight transfer is slightly off low fuel especially and car should feel alot more direct through your steering and overall more solid especially with high arbs pressures, springs and less of a swing to it. Ive only had slight mess around past few days with setups etc as ive not got old 1s but currently about .7 off old pb atm.

Pros:
-possibly more sign ups: although not sure if this matters vs mmg as we had sign ups last season you could argue some may have stayed if was f3000 but i think same practise/skill for each is needed anyway. People who want to race in a league just do it i think, like nike .
-realistic car setup ranges
-maybe less affected ingame lag : this maybe a good reason if it actually does help

Cons i see it pretty much same as yours Nico, as for race knowledge not known, it may also be a advantage depending on way you look at it. If we all put in practise for each it would probably turn out good, i know for me id be ok for most but some races last season for example i only practised day before event, 1 stint and i dont think id be able to do that if was f3000 without making alot of mistakes etc but everyone is in same boat with that.

 

[Steeve Fournier]

I just want to say that its interesting to read all your posts. For those who dont know, i am new to online racing, got my steering wheel for about 5 months now, so all categories are new to me, all games are new, all tracks are new..... the fun part is I have many new friends

If i am somehow able to participate in some of the prestogp league races i'd be glad, but my day time doesn't allow me so much, i will miss all practices and qualify too probably. If i can be a partial member of that sailing boat crew and help it go better, cool!! But i will not vote. I don't want to be a part of prestogp's decision for season 10.

I have driven a few laps yesterday and today with some presto guys and i really like it. That's enough for me to be satisfied by the driving simulation. See i'm far behind everyones experience here. But dang i like racing

Steeve

 

[Marko Vuori]

What it comes to realism I think F3000 is far more realistic than MMG F1 mod. Of course I have never driven F1 in real life, but I have competed with go-karts and tested racing cars upto Formula Renault 2.0 and Radical PR6 (which have significant aerodynamic forces involved), so I should be able to evaluate simulation realism to a certain degree. As far as I can tell, pretty many "tricks" which improve your lap times with F3000 apply to real world racing driving, whereas those "tricks" that work with MMG F1 don't usually work in real life. When we talk about simulation this is really important. When I have talked with other drivers who have real life racing experience and experience from both MMG F1 and F3000, they do share the same opinion of F3000 being more realistic, so it's not just my own subjective view.

F3000 pros/cons in my opinion:

pros:
- more realistic (to a degree that I think it's justified to talk about simulation)
- more realistic setup
- closer competition with more overtakings
- less serious effects of crashes (you can usually continue your race after a crash)
- less serious effects of lag (has been significant motivation killer with MMG F1)
- higher potential for new league members

cons:
- what is the best race format for this new car (can be taken as new challenge as well)
- what are the best setups for this new car (can be taken as new challenge as well and even default setups with altered wings work reasonably well with F3000)

 

[Nicolai Nicholson]

- closer competition with more overtakings

I still don't understand this arguement, I think it just as easily could be argued the opposite. But if you explain why then maybe I'll learn something and agree. But at the moment I am thinking it will require more practice from me to be as competitive and in control (foundation for close racing) as I was with the f1, and I would expect the same goes for others who know the f1 mod inside out.

In general my experience is that the more skilled we get as a group, the closer racing we get, (it was much closer racing in season 9 relative to seaon 4). Moving to f3000 will in general make us less skilled, at least the first period.

In f1 I am usually very close to Marko's speed and can give him good battles, in f3000 I'm guessing I will be 1 sec slower a lap or something, unless I practice like a mad man (which I do not have the time to do).

EDIT: In terms of those who are trubbling with keeping up with the rest in f1 it could be a positive effect. I do not think they will be any closer to the front runners, but I suspect those of the mid-field runners that have a long learning curve (like myself) might drop down to the back of the field (which does not bother me at all).

 

[Marko Vuori]

I still don't understand this arguement, I think it just as easily could be argued the opposite. But if you explain why then maybe I'll learn something and agree. But at the moment I am thinking it will require more practice from me to be as competitive and in control (foundation for close racing) as I was with the f1, and I would expect the same goes for others who know the f1 mod inside out.

My point about "closer competition with more overtakings" is based on my experience on public and Presto servers with both cars, and on a quick look at historical PrestoGP qualifying results. Your comment about that you need more practice with F3000 than with F1 is funny knowing that you have competed three Presto seasons with F3000 before you moved to MMG F1. Shouldn't it come back quickly like bicycling or skating skills?

 

[Reik Major]

In general my experience is that the more skilled we get as a group, the closer racing we get, (it was much closer racing in season 9 relative to seaon 4). Moving to f3000 will in general make us less skilled, at least the first period.

I also think that this is a very important argument. The close racing is a result of close skills from the drivers.

But it also should be mentioned, that we gained very much (online)racing experience at all, so in general we should know how to behave on track (how much to risk), even with a new car. As an example I had two nice runs last wednesday with cool close racing, even though I'm new to the car. Our general built up attitude to give us the required room seems to allow us close battles even at a very early learning stage on a new car...