LG New 45" OLED Ultrawide Monitor

[RasmusP]

if you technically want the "cleanest", you wouldn't want to run DLSS.

Yeah dlss can impact image quality but nvidia also built in some anti aliasing algorithm.
So while you can see some "errors" here and there, the overall image becomes smoother, "cleaner".
I'll always take the slight upscaling errors for getting better anti aliasing!

Finally was able to make DLDSR work on G9 with ACC.
Combined with in game Quality DLSS, the cleanest image I've seen to day. Also updated to the latest dlss dll.
Goodbye TAA.

Hehe yes, that's what I was talking about
I'm not sure how they hook into each other and which part gets what resolution but in the end you have almost the same performance of native resolution + taa but you got rid of taa and got 2x the dlss anti aliasing


How did you get the DLDSR option to show? A friend if mine also has a G9 and even with hdr disabled, the dsr settings are simply not there... Seems like a "bug" or rather nvidia not supporting it for "weird" resolutions. Also not for triples


Btw: although dlss has very little ghosting on monitors, load up a replay and switch the hovering name plates on. They look like shooting stars, lol

 

[gamma123152]

with bigger monitor you will be farther back so effective PPD will change based on that.

Why would you sit further back from a bigger monitor in sim racing? What do you buy a bigger monitor for if you decide to sit further away?

Because effectively you will see the same size with a bigger monitor further away compared to a smaller monitor closer to you. It defeats the whole purpose of switching to a bigger screen. So the PPD will stay as low as it is, it will be a serious downgrade compared to a lower inch screen with similar resolution.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

I had 42' monitor before on my desk, it was pushed back to the very end to be usable. For simming if mounted to rig distance is the same, agree.
LG targets desktop gamers audience, for them the effective PPD will be more than acceptable.

 

[gamma123152]

I had 42' monitor before on my desk, it was pushed back to the very end to be usable. For simming if mounted to rig distance is the same, agree.
LG targets desktop gamers audience, for them the effective PPD will be more than acceptable.

Get it. I thought that we were discussing this screen for simracers since this is racedepartment, so my question is was indeed only regarding sim racing.

But to get to desktop/other game usage: It also depends what desktop games you play. Hell let loose for example is a game where you really want your monitor as close as possible (almost to your face) to spot the enemy. The highest possible PPD is with this game even more relevant as with sim racing titles. This monitor is unusable for this game for example.

I don't agree at all that the PPD is even "more than" acceptable. It's imo outdated on release regarding PPD. So the opposite of more than acceptable.

For pure desktop usage yes, I agree. I also don't have my screen so close to me with desktop use but a 45 inch extremely curved screen isn't a screen that should be used for desktop usage. It's a gaming screen.

 

[Spinelli]

So the PPD will stay as low as it is, it will be a serious downgrade compared to a lower inch screen with similar resolution.

The PPI (pixels per inch) of the monitor will not change but the PPD (pixels per degree) will change. The further away from you, the higher the PPD becomes. That's why, for example, a 50" 1080p TV looks great from 3 metres away but will look terrible from 0.5 m away. Same PPI but much lower PPD the closer you get.

Basically, PPI gets worse the larger the screen size is, PPD gets worse the closer your eye distance is to the screen.

 

[gamma123152]

The PPI (pixels per inch) of the monitor will not change but the PPD (pixels per degree) will change. The further away from you, the higher the PPD becomes. That's why, for example, a 50" 1080p TV looks great from 3 metres away but will look terrible from 0.5 m away. Same PPI but much lower PPD the closer you get.

Basically, PPI gets worse the larger the screen size is, PPD gets worse the closer your eye distance is to the screen.

True that's exactly what I meant. Maybe I should have described it better.

I forgot to say I my previous reply: this LG screen is so extremely curved that you have no other choice then to move it close to you. If you move a extremely curved screen far away from your face then the whole image will be distorted.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

True that's exactly what I meant. Maybe I should have described it better.

I forgot to say I my previous reply: this LG screen is so extremely curved that you have no other choice then to move it close to you. If you move a extremely curved screen far away from your face then the whole image will be distorted.

R800 means radius of full curvature circle, that is at 80cm distance from eye to center and edge of monitor is the same.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

How did you get the DLDSR option to show? A friend if mine also has a G9 and even with hdr disabled, the dsr settings are simply not there... Seems like a "bug" or rather nvidia not supporting it for "weird" resolutions

Few steps:
1) DSR and DLDSR do not work with DSC enabled. You need to go into monitor OSD settings and change to 120hz refresh rate.
2) NVidia scaling settings (GPU/Aspect Ratio/Ignore game settings) featured in the article were not working reliably with ACC, at times it would switch to full non downsampled res and clicking on menu items would trigger different actions as their coordinates are out of whack. The solution I've found on reddit is to match desktop resolution to DLDSR. After that it was rock solid with HDR and everything. But I have second (inactive) monitor in my system, may be it was the culprit of those woes, not sure, some reddit posts suggest that.
3) I have followed article enable G-Sync for Full Screen and Windowed recommendation, not sure if it was necessary, but G-Sync still works.
5) Also with G9 there is a little thing to keep in mind. There is VRR Control settings in OSD/System, for DSC it should be ON but without it will cause micro stutter, so turn it OFF when switching from 240hz mode.

I have not observed any artifacts at all, was using Silverstone as test mule per your recommendation, my settings are 1.78 DLSDSR and Quality DLSS, everything else Epic, but I do not have name tag enabled, should try that.
Also, there is latest version of DLSS dll 2.5.0, you can replace one shipped with ACC, feedback on that version is quite positive on reddit, and as I mentioned it is artifact/ghosting free for me.

 

[gamma123152]

R800 means radius of full curvature circle, that is at 80cm distance from eye to center and edge of monitor is the same.

80cm is adviced as "maximum" from what I understand. It's the lowest R available at 45 inch from what I've seen. So you want this screen closer to your eyes then higher numbered R screens. This makes mixed usage of desktop/gaming also very difficult now that I think about it.

 

[Spinelli]

Few steps:
1) DSR and DLDSR do not work with DSC enabled. You need to go into monitor OSD settings and change to 120hz refresh rate.
2) NVidia scaling settings (GPU/Aspect Ratio/Ignore game settings) featured in the article were not working reliably with ACC, at times it would switch to full non downsampled res and clicking on menu items would trigger different actions as their coordinates are out of whack. The solution I've found on reddit is to match desktop resolution to DLDSR. After that it was rock solid with HDR and everything. But I have second (inactive) monitor in my system, may be it was the culprit of those woes, not sure, some reddit posts suggest that.
3) I have followed article enable G-Sync for Full Screen and Windowed recommendation, not sure if it was necessary, but G-Sync still works.
5) Also with G9 there is a little thing to keep in mind. There is VRR Control settings in OSD/System, for DSC it should be ON but without it will cause micro stutter, so turn it OFF when switching from 240hz mode.

I have not observed any artifacts at all, was using Silverstone as test mule per your recommendation, my settings are 1.78 DLSDSR and Quality DLSS, everything else Epic, but I do not have name tag enabled, should try that.
Also, there is latest version of DLSS dll 2.5.0, you can replace one shipped with ACC, feedback on that version is quite positive on reddit, and as I mentioned it is artifact/ghosting free for me.

Oh wow, I had no idea DSR / DLDSR doesn't work with DSC. I guess DSC does have some limitations after all.

I'm going to re-run tests today but in-terms of pure image quality, I remember 4.00x DSR (AKA 2x2 I think?), which gives a "proper" 1:1 pixel-to-pixel upsacale (eg. 1080p -> 4K, 1440p -> 5K) definitely noticeably produced the best pure image quality (I used no blurring/smoothing). But if DLDSR 2.25x is supposed to give let's say 80-90 % of the image quality of 4.00x DSR but at only 50% of the performance hit then I'll look into it again.

For DX9 games, what do you think of 8x MSAA + 8X SGSSAA (or even 4x + 4x) compared to 4.00x DSR and 2.25x DLDSR? I've been playing GTR 1 recently and, if I rememebr correctly, I think 8x MSAA + 8X SGSSAA looked the best but I'll do some more comparisons later today to confirm.

P.S. The great thing about DSR is that it works with any game (but not Nvidia Surround triple-screens). The great thing about MSAA + SGSSAA is that it works with triple-screens (but no games beyond DX9 I think).

 

[Deleted member 197115]

I'm going to re-run tests today but in-terms of pure image quality, I remember 4.00x DSR (AKA 2x2 I think?), which gives a "proper" 1:1 pixel-to-pixel upsacale (eg. 1080p -> 4K, 1440p -> 5K) definitely noticeably produced the best pure image quality (I used no blurring/smoothing).

Yeah, somehow they got around limitation of integer factor scaling.

Uneven Scaling​

Now, here's the catch. DSR works best when the rendering is done at a resolution that is an integer factor of the monitor's native. When using a 1080p monitor, 4x DSR-Factors is ideal as each pixel of the 1920x1080 grid is produced based on information from a set of 4 pixels of the 4K DSR rendered image. But this as you can imagine requires a powerful enough GPU in the first place to be able to render 4K at a playable framerate. Failing to use an integer factor for DSR causes image artifacts and poor edge anti-aliasing.

In order to counter this Nvidia have implemented a DSR-Smoothness slider (you can find it underneath the DSR-Factors in the image above) to control the intensity of the Gaussian filter that is used. Increasing the amount of smoothness makes those image artifacts less noticeable at the cost of a blurrier image overall.

On the other hand, the machine learning filter used by DLDSR, does not suffer from the uneven scaling issue when using non-integer factors, like 1.78x and 2.25x, and it also seems to fare better as regards to anti-aliasing.

 

[RasmusP]

For DX9 games, what do you think of 8x MSAA + 8X SGSSAA (or even 4x + 4x) compared to 4.00x DSR and 2.25x DLDSR? I've been playing GTR 1 recently and, if I rememebr correctly, I think 8x MSAA + 8X SGSSAA looked the best but I'll do some more comparisons later today to confirm.

P.S. The great thing about DSR is that it works with any game (but not Nvidia Surround triple-screens). The great thing about MSAA + SGSSAA is that it works with triple-screens (but no games beyond DX9 I think).

8x MSAA + SGSSAA will always look better than DLDSR!
But DLDSR works for everything and you get the DLSS Anti Aliasing part, which is the key here
A shame that ngreedia isn't supporting triples

 

[Emery]

Personally, I don't sit further back with a bigger monitor for my simracing setup. I think that defeats the point of getting a bigger monitor.

Ditto! FOV is where it is at!

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Ditto! FOV is where it is at!

That's why we use triples and freakishly wide 32:9 ratio 49" monitors.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

How did you get the DLDSR option to show? A friend if mine also has a G9 and even with hdr disabled, the dsr settings are simply not there... Seems like a "bug" or rather nvidia not supporting it for "weird" resolutions. Also not for triples

@RasmusP, have the instruction in ACC subforum with a little more details and my custom profile.
DLDSR/Better AA with Samsung G9

 

[RasmusP]

@RasmusP, have the instruction in ACC subforum with a little more details and my custom profile.
DLDSR/Better AA with Samsung G9

Thanks mate! Gonna go through this with my buddy!

 

[Durge Driven]

Sorry on topic p
No one has mentioned what I would think is worthwhile besides the obvious image quality. Sims can come down to .001 of a second agreed ( I have dead heated 0.000 online in rF2) So OLED 0.1ms should be an advantage over 1ms.
Obviously depend which controls and who is driving.
I have UW only 34" but I could go to 4K pancake, 0.1ms, best image, full screen movies, no distortion.

BenQ releases EX480UZ 48-inch gaming OLED display

BenQ has introduced the MOBIUZ EX480UZ gaming monitor, which features an organic EL display. ...

www.guru3d.com

 

[Spinelli]

Sorry on topic p
No one has mentioned what I would think is worthwhile besides the obvious image quality. Sims can come down to .001 of a second agreed ( I have dead heated 0.000 online in rF2) So OLED 0.1ms should be an advantage over 1ms.
Obviously depend which controls and who is driving.
I have UW only 34" but I could go to 4K pancake, 0.1ms, best image, full screen movies, no distortion.

BenQ releases EX480UZ 48-inch gaming OLED display

BenQ has introduced the MOBIUZ EX480UZ gaming monitor, which features an organic EL display. ...

www.guru3d.com

Having a pixel response time of 0.3 ms (its usually around there in the real world, or even higher) doesn't mean it'll make a difference in racing some one else just because racing can come down to such small time differences. If I had a 5 ms monitor and you a 1 ms, that doesn't mean you gain 4 ms of laptime on me. Not at all.

 

[Durge Driven]

Faster response time means you see changes to car sooner means the sooner you can react and adjust your steering....am I missing something ?

The actual, realized difference between 4ms and 1ms is extremely low and imperceptible to all but the most elite eSports players.

That is what I said

Obviously depend which controls and who is driving.

I never said it gives advantage over any two people, you just make stuff up.

 

[RasmusP]

Faster response time means you see changes to car sooner means the sooner you can react and adjust your steering....am I missing something ?

Yes, we're missing that the response time is the time until the pixel completed the change, not until it starts.
So you don't really gain "reaction" time, you gain image clarity!

Which is ofc an important factor but not really for racing.
For shooter esports it's important since you want to spot the opponent while doing a quick camera flick.
But for racing, the only scenario this would be important is during a crash/spin.

The actual latency from steering input to physics engine output to seeing your inputs on the screen is a factor higher than pixel response anyway (30ms-100ms).

Summary: pixel response time is about smearing, not input lag.