Debate: The Rights and Wrongs of the Verstappen Penalty

[paracletus]

• Retired F1 drivers (unanimous) : appalling penalty
  
• Video gamers on the internet (majority): great penalty

hmm

 

[cliffanger70]

Max did not crashed Kimi..He is progressing!
May be the next race will stay on the track!

 

[RacingManiacGT1]

I don't want to defend Max, but the inconsistency is the problem. You can't police some instances and let others go. Having an element of subjective judging in that makes black and white rules meaningless. Then you might as well be judging figure skating.

Max "pushed" others off the track, at the same token the other driver might not have stayed in it if there is something that they can't drive on beyond the curbing. As shown people are taking advantage of the runoff and gotten away with it all weekend and you decide to penalize the last one out of what reason?

 

[Davebrave]

I agree with the penalty despite the fact we all want more overtakes in F1, but rules are needed, otherwise, how would Kimi defend his position? going over the kerb as well? Kimi positioned the car in the right place as per the track limits to defend his position but Max used the kerb to take advantage and make the pass, and to me, that's the key difference when you compare others drivers who also drove over the kerbs, they didn't necessarily took advantage, or at least it wasn't completely clear. I'm just guessing, but I think they consider if drivers are really gaining something when they go so wide.

 

[Ole Marius Myrvold]

• Retired F1 drivers (unanimous) : appalling penalty
  
• Video gamers on the internet (majority): great penalty

hmm

So, the retired F1 drivers Brundle, Di Resta (though, might not be completely retired from F1, who knows), Mika Salo don't count?
Or the active driver Hamilton?

btw, we have a bigger percentage of "penalty was wrong" on our forum, than on the autosport-forum. Does that mean that the video gamers are more open to breaking the rules than the non-gamers?

 

[muzikant]

inconsistancy that is what it is FIA

 

[Aki Korhonen]

personally idont understand why verstappen dont understand this penalty..he drove off bottas..if kimi cut corners like perstappi ooh verstappen he maybe win the race.my penalty to verstappen dq and 25 grid penalty because he dont understand rules and dont want to..and of course language..and is this track made by hemlmut something same who did malaysia and others?bad track put grass or sand next to the white line please!maybe wrong place but come on. and no one else didnt cut corners only wide..

 

[Glaurung]

Illegal overtake, sausage kurb for next year's event.

Or just restore (natural) grass outside the tracks like was back in the days that will penalize in real time the track cutters.

 

[Aki Korhonen]

I agree... Drivers will exploit any possible advantage they can, and I think VER should not be penalized by a flaw in the track design.

So what to do for the next race.... remove or reduced the red runoff from the apex curbing would be nice, or regard the red runoff as part of the track.

 

[Boby Kim]

Oh boy, The Netherlands has a new topic to whine about...omg. He got a penalty so what!! It happened, and it will happen again to someone else in the future i can assure you. That's sport period. Stop wining, kiddo does not race for the championship, no harm done. Next...

 

[Mr Turtle]

Let the tracks decide whether a driver should be penalized with at slowdown or similar if that is possible without compromising safety. That is way more consistent and fair compared to the stewards in my opinion.

If grass was put near the other side of the curb Max verstappen would not have made that line on every single lap but he might have risked it in the last lap giving us a great race.

Is this a reasonable view, or am I missing something?

 

[WOKOWEN1]

Wow...everything was fine with track limits until Max decides to question it!!!! The kid should be running for president soon or something

 

[Ensi Ferrum]

Max was way off track while overtaking Kimi. The video shows it very well.
In this case the stewards decided how they should decide! Off track? Advantage? Guilty!
I voted for the stewards took the right decision.
BUT:
What about T19? I have seen no driver in T1, T3, Q1, Q2, Q3 and the race (in german TV coverage) staying on track. All have been off track (all 4 wheels on the wrong side of the white line). And I never heard of a single complaint about it by the stewards.
Going off track and not getting penalised is one of the main concerns in modern F1, at least in my kind of view.
The solution might be easy, at first look. Keep 2 wheels on the track and you are fine. 3, or 4, wheels off track and you're in trouble.
But how can the stewards judge this in a fast way? Technical possibilities are endless, but to discuss all of them we need another thread, I think ;-)
To come to an end:
- The stewards decision was right (in this case)
- The stewards decision was wrong (in many other cases, T19)
- Max has well known he overtook Kimi way off the track
- FIA has to find a safe(!) way to keep drivers stay on track

 

[Aki Korhonen]

oliver panis jos verstappen antas!

 

[Appie Kuipers]

So simracers think the 5sec are ok, real racefans think it is bloody stupid, this is the end for real racing, that only Max can. All other drivers and most of you are DRS racers.
My first visit to F1 was at Zandvoort, the Day sadly Piers Courage died. Seen more F1 races then You All. In other words F1 is sick and very boring. Happy racing to All boring racing lovers behind your screen and wheel. And yes I'am Dutch.

 

[FernandoAFM]

Penalty was well-deserved.

Imagine two kids designing a track around a backyard (as I did with my sister several times with our radio control cars). Both accepted the track limits before the race started! "Why did you not circle that rock??"

Inconsistency is the problem here.

 

[Patrik Marek]

as others said, problem is the inconsistency

 

[Nick Hill]

And in meantime in Maxland...
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/verstappen-idiot-remark-not-meant-to-hurt-anyone-970053/
A "mongol", really Max ?

He's Dutch - "idiot" and "Mongol" are probably the cleaned up versions of what he really wants to say!

 

[InsaneOzzie]

I disagree with "It's about FIA inconsistency" Can you imagine the fight if the marshals penalized every breech of track limits. The drivers, teams and near on every F1 fan would be screaming blue bloody murder at the FIA, and telling them they are being ridiculous. Much like now.

The rules are there for the drivers to obey, these drivers are the best of the best, allegedly, so why can't they drive within the bounds of the track limits. The FIA are very lenient in their breeches of track limits, until someone gains a distinct advantage....Max in this case. Sure most drivers were doing the same at other parts of the track in practice, qualifying and the race, but none of them gained a position by doing so.

 

[Jriv012]

Well, they're called "Track Limits", you are supposed to receive some penalty for exceeding them, all of them, not just some of them

So I do agree it's the inconsistency that makes the penalty "appaling"

Not enforcing "non important" transgressions is like, I gain a half sec here and there as long as they let me, but cant use the same trick on the last lap?

FIA management of penalties is BS and causes this controversy, I do feel sorry for the kid, and for Kimi, because he drank his water while chatting at large with the big guys...