Misc Christiaan's Pure FFB 2.3

LogiForce · Aug 30, 2020

LogiForce submitted a new resource:

Christiaan's Pure FFB - Pure Force Feedback without canned effects, like how a car should feel

LATEST RELEASE: Christiaan's Pure FFB v1.06 (Date 14-01-2020)

Hi everyone on this wonderful forum,

Some of you might know me from the off-topic section where I lurk the most, others might not. I've been a WMD member since the early days of Project CARS 1 and have been through it all again for Project CARS 2.
Those that know me from WMD always might remember I was always at odds with Jack Spade his way of creating...

Read more about this resource...

jlorenzo · Aug 31, 2020

Thanks Christiaan!

Besides any politics, I am happy that you keep this project alife. As a normal mortal in terms of simracing this files kept me from walking away, furthermore I enjoy PC2 very much again. As Integro said in his review, maybe you consider releasing 2.0 again for gear and belt drive wheels with a disclaimer for DD wheels. Heard many people praising them as a significant improvement even over the 1.06 files - where I have a hard time to figure what could still be improved. so I need to witness myself

. I am also on the budget side equipment wise with a Logi wheel and peeking at a T300 (if finance minister approves for Xmas ;-) ).

So again, thanks for your outstanding work and detailed insights!

gamer19 · Aug 31, 2020

Eddy van Beilen - Fanatec Clubsport Wheel v1
Olijke Poffer - Fanatec Clubsport Wheel v2.5
inthebagbud - Fanatec Podium DD2
Haiden - SimXperience Accuforce v2
GrimeyDog - Fanatec Podium DD2
Morpwr - SimRacing Bay 30nm OSW
mcarpenter - Unknown
FxUK - Fanatec Podium DD2

seems like a nice little fanatec illuminati club
not a single Logitech wheel to test ?
ok, let me be the first...
hope my game won't blow up

JZStudios · Aug 31, 2020

I'm not getting a great experience out of this. It might be better than the base game, and it certainly has a lot of "detail" and road/suspension feel, but the average driving experience is not great.
I tested the BMW 1m and even though the forces were pretty low, I was getting clipping, and on straights there was basically no FFB whatsoever and the car just seemed to float around. A bunch of corners the FFB dropped as well and then it was just a guess whether or not the car was slipping. There's also a bunch of places where the FFB "chunks" and feels grainy, not under braking.
Trying the same car in AC, there's much less road feel, but the centering force is always present and feels mostly natural, leading to much more control over the car as it's not "floating" around.

For reference I'm using a Fanatec GT2 with the belt driven LSS setup.

jlorenzo · Sep 1, 2020

Hi Christiaan, hi all!

Generally speaking the files work great for me, the more I use them, the more details I realize. One general question: I ran Wheelcheck on my wheel and generated the parameters for dead zone and scoop. Is it necessary to use these parameters in these files? Other than gain I can't find any reference. Does it make sense to define them and if yes, where in the code should I insert them. For the Ultimate FFB files v5 from Hugo it made a significant difference and also in AC it improved the feel even more by using the wheel characteristics via the LUT file.

I like the feel of your files a bit better over Hugo's so I am wondering if I could tune them better to my wheel.

I am using a Logi Driving Force GT.

Thanks for any input!

robnitro · Sep 2, 2020

G27 tried your setup and some cars on ABS braking, the wheel feels much too rough - everything else feels great.

Any way to reduce this in the ini?

ROFFATI · Sep 2, 2020

Hi, i have a question. In the file i downloaded here, there is a "Standard FX" and "Jack Spade FX" folder. Which one i am supposed to install?

LogiForce · Sep 3, 2020

ROFFATI said:
Hi, i have a question. In the file i downloaded here, there is a "Standard FX" and "Jack Spade FX" folder. Which one i am supposed to install?

Depends on what you are used to and what you have in terms of hardware.
Jack Spade has stronger effects than standard from SMS. So if you use standard and feel that even with FX at 100 it doesn't feel nicely enough you can use the files with Jack Spade his effects instead.

LogiForce · Sep 3, 2020

gamer19 said:
Eddy van Beilen - Fanatec Clubsport Wheel v1
Olijke Poffer - Fanatec Clubsport Wheel v2.5
inthebagbud - Fanatec Podium DD2
Haiden - SimXperience Accuforce v2
GrimeyDog - Fanatec Podium DD2
Morpwr - SimRacing Bay 30nm OSW
mcarpenter - Unknown
FxUK - Fanatec Podium DD2

seems like a nice little fanatec illuminati club
not a single Logitech wheel to test ?
ok, let me be the first...
hope my game won't blow up

Plenty of positive tests with Logitech wheels, even more so. These are just the folks who helped me when I was in the initial beta stages.

LogiForce · Sep 3, 2020

JZStudios said:
I'm not getting a great experience out of this. It might be better than the base game, and it certainly has a lot of "detail" and road/suspension feel, but the average driving experience is not great.
I tested the BMW 1m and even though the forces were pretty low, I was getting clipping, and on straights there was basically no FFB whatsoever and the car just seemed to float around. A bunch of corners the FFB dropped as well and then it was just a guess whether or not the car was slipping. There's also a bunch of places where the FFB "chunks" and feels grainy, not under braking.
Trying the same car in AC, there's much less road feel, but the centering force is always present and feels mostly natural, leading to much more control over the car as it's not "floating" around.

For reference I'm using a Fanatec GT2 with the belt driven LSS setup.

I was working on my latest last night and it needs some more testing, but I think I might have a winner. Including great curb and road feel from physics and not canned FX-effects, and above all a natural centering feel.
I hadn't driven in the sim for half a year and only drove in my BMW E46 out front, and it opened my eyes on where it needed some tweaks.
I just need to finish the file and have it tested.

So stay tuned.

LogiForce · Sep 3, 2020

jlorenzo said:
Hi Christiaan, hi all!

Generally speaking the files work great for me, the more I use them, the more details I realize. One general question: I ran Wheelcheck on my wheel and generated the parameters for dead zone and scoop. Is it necessary to use these parameters in these files? Other than gain I can't find any reference. Does it make sense to define them and if yes, where in the code should I insert them. For the Ultimate FFB files v5 from Hugo it made a significant difference and also in AC it improved the feel even more by using the wheel characteristics via the LUT file.

I like the feel of your files a bit better over Hugo's so I am wondering if I could tune them better to my wheel.

I am using a Logi Driving Force GT.

Thanks for any input!

There is no way to simply insert that since I removed that code completely from it but if you know how to work the files be my guest.

I am close to completing an all new file though that should fix a lot of issues.

LogiForce · Sep 3, 2020

robnitro said:
G27 tried your setup and some cars on ABS braking, the wheel feels much too rough - everything else feels great.

Any way to reduce this in the ini?

Have you tried turning down FX?

If you drive without FX than it just falls out from the dry tyre physics at which point you can't do much about that.
Now I am close to completing a new version of my file in which I take a new approach that might be more to your liking.

JZStudios · Sep 3, 2020

LogiForce said:
I was working on my latest last night and it needs some more testing, but I think I might have a winner. Including great curb and road feel from physics and not canned FX-effects, and above all a natural centering feel.
I hadn't driven in the sim for half a year and only drove in my BMW E46 out front, and it opened my eyes on where it needed some tweaks.
I just need to finish the file and have it tested.

So stay tuned.

Sounds good. Everything else felt great outside of centering forces being vague. Made it really hard to hit apexes or even do the carousel at Nurburg.

LogiForce · Sep 5, 2020

JZStudios said:
Sounds good. Everything else felt great outside of centering forces being vague. Made it really hard to hit apexes or even do the carousel at Nurburg.

Yeah, I know what you mean and if you haven't driven in a sim for a long time than you really start to notice it. In my case what got in between was life... hot summer, home improvement work, being simply tired from all that work in the first place. You know how it goes.

What I noticed myself was that the current file you guys have seems indeed as if it misses out on that tacky feel of rubber, that resistance to turning you have in real life. Which also thus produces that smooth rotation back to center as well as a smooth increase in resistance without deadzone when you start to steer.
Although in real life you have a difference in smoothness of steering depending on the powersteering strength or simple lack of powersteering.

jlorenzo · Sep 7, 2020

LogiForce said:
There is no way to simply insert that since I removed that code completely from it but if you know how to work the files be my guest.

I am close to completing an all new file though that should fix a lot of issues.

That's great! Thanks for keeping up the great work!

LogiForce · Sep 7, 2020

LogiForce updated Christiaan's Pure FFB with a new update entry:

Christiaan's Pure FFB v2.2

New off the press is a total revamp of my file. After working closely with a former formula driver and having a few ideas on how the FFB system works I came to the results in this file.

The file should work with all wheels using default settings both for the wheel specific and within the game (aka Gain 100 / Volume 50 / Tone 50 / FX 50.
The effects have been replaced by new ones I created and are only for engine noise and gearbox shunt. All the rest falls out of physics!

Also new is the...

Read the rest of this update entry...

GJDriessen · Sep 7, 2020

Christiaan, it is not clear to me what the Tone and Fx settings should be with the latest file (I use a G29). The custom file and the description on the download page here on racedepartment seem contradicting. Thanks for your help!.

LogiForce · Sep 7, 2020

GJDriessen said:
Christiaan, it is not clear to me what the Tone and Fx settings should be with the latest file (I use a G29). The custom file and the description on the download page here on racedepartment seem contradicting. Thanks for your help!.

Ah, yes. I will update that on the main page. If you look on the resource page it will say what is correct.

For every wheel it is the default of:
Gain: 100
Volume: 50
Tone: 50
FX: 50

Default wheel settings.

Edit:
I updated the page. Thanks for pointing it out.