2010 Formula One Hungarian Grand Prix

[ufunacaoenn]

You will enjoy with him in Ferrari next year then

They are changing Alonso for Kubica, GREAT NEWS (Massa got contract until 2012 )

 

[David Garcia]

GREAT NEWS? Not for Ferrari...

 

[Dustin Withers]

so, can anyone explain mark webber at the post race conference? lol

 

[Xosé Estrada]

They are changing Alonso for Kubica, GREAT NEWS (Massa got contract until 2012 )

So?, Massa has contract but that doesn't mean it's impossible they made an agreement with him to go...

And come on, you know Alonso is way better than Massa

 

[David Garcia]

LOL on Webber at the press conference!

 

[Péter Bártfai]

So?, Massa has contract but that doesn't mean it's impossible they made an agreement with him to go...

And come on, you know Alonso is way better than Massa

And you judge that from this season where Massa returned after a half-season break after a serious accident which he had to recover from.

 

[Warren Dawes]

so, can anyone explain mark webber at the post race conference? lol

"I'm sure my Nana had a set of lounge chairs like these? Hers were a better colour though.."


Or maybe ??

"These seats feel great, I wonder if Red Bull could fit them into our cars? Nah!. If it was better, they'd give the bloody thing to Sebastien first."

 

[ufunacaoenn]

So?, Massa has contract but that doesn't mean it's impossible they made an agreement with him to go...

And come on, you know Alonso is way better than Massa

Exacly what Peter said plus Massa is allways behind Alonso and not that far. IMO Massa is much better then Alonso but Massa lacks the winners confidence wich makes it hard to win.

 

[David Garcia]

Exacly what Peter said plus Massa is allways behind Alonso and not that far. IMO Massa is much better then Alonso but Massa lacks the winners confidence wich makes it hard to win.

Not by far? Look on the top teams and see the diference between their drivers in the championship standings.
RBR - Webber 161
RBR - Vettel 151

McLaren - Hamilton 157
McLaren - Button 147

Ferrari - Alonso 141
Ferrari - Massa 97 * Plus that hughe diference between them forced Ferrari on the team orders stuff with the intention of save at least the drivers championship, as the constructors tittle is almost lost because of Massa.

The diference between the fastest F1 driver to the slowest one can be... maybe 0,5 secs as much, the rest of the diference is because the car, the setup, the tyres, etc. In this case the diference between Alonos and Massa is around 0,2 tenths of sec per lap on a regular basis so I guess you are wrong...

By the way, I always liked Massa since his Sauber days and I agree in the afirmation that he has not the winners confidence, but apart of it at the moment he is slower than Alonso, and he was slower than Kimi on a regular basis aswell, only maybe he was more regular than Kimi.

To me Kubica, Alonso, Webber are the best drivers on the grid by far, with Hamilton and Vettel on the road to join the group when they become a bit more mature.

I don´t understand why there is a growing hate on Alonso, as there was with Schumacher in his Ferrari days... but maybe it is a good symptom.

 

[Larry Stovall]

I don´t understand why there is a growing hate on Alonso, as there was with Schumacher in his Ferrari days... but maybe it is a good symptom.

I'm fairly new to F1 and I try to stay neutral but I have noticed a certain distaste for Fernando Alonso growing in my mind over the course of the season. So perhaps I can explain my own feelings.

To me, it seems like he has a very strong sense of entitlement, and a certain disdain for people or things that don't obligingly get out of his way. This would be annoying in most people, but it's doubly so with a race car driver, as he's a voluntary participant in a sport where other contestants are sort of obligated to try and stay in his way -- and yet he still complains when they do so.

He gripes when the smaller teams don't let him by when racing for position. He gripes when penalties to other racers don't come fast enough to suit him. He whines when his teammate won't let him by despite being, from my position, in pretty firm control of the race. Etc.

In short, he creates an impression of a person who, having won world titles and landed a seat at Ferrari (a team that seems to mirror his attitude), expects victories to be handed to him by people who are supposed to be seeking that victory for themselves. He doesn't seem to get that what he accomplished in the past was...well, the past. If he wants it again, he has to fight for it.

Possibly worse is his tendency to be around when something sordid happens, like Ferrari's team order to Massa, or the Piquet Jr. 'Crashgate' thing. Complicit in them? Don't know. But he's always around, which probably isn't good for his public image.

These are just my feelings on the subject, of course.

 

[ufunacaoenn]

I dont know so much about the hatred for Schumi but I think people hate Alonso because (from what I have seen) he have only had easy wins (hockenhiem, Singapure) and he complains alot about stuff wich other drivers don't for example I did not hear Hamilton say "I would still be the championship leader or I might had a podium finish if it was not for the gear box failier".

Plus there is not hatred for Hamilton (apart from some RD guys) because he have proven that he is very talented (appart from that other say he cheat). 2009 in Melbourne, he started last I belive and finished 3rd, then his team screawed things up and gave him some stupid orders But Hamilton overtook driver after driver. He did exacly the same thing in Interlagos but he did not start from last place but from 17th I belive and finished again 3rd.

I have not seen stuff like that been pulled of by Alonso exapt for Monaco this year but I would not realy compare it to what Hamilton have done because Alonso was lucky that the safety car came out other wise he would be infront of all the new comers and maybe a few of the more mature teams.

IMO I think that Vettel and Hamilton need to be more mature when it comes to frustraiting times and Alonso needs to be more mature as person because he could use the time that he complains about stuff to realy do something about this stuff. The day that Alonso stops to complain like he does then thats the day when I will start to like him.

 

[David Garcia]

I agree in the last part, he is not managing it well and his public image is being damaged. But in the other hand he is a honest guy that always say what he thinks wheter he is right or wrong for the others, if he is convinced he say it, and I use to agree with im most of the time.

I am quite sure there are other drivers in the grid doing it really well, being a bastard & manipulator but only when it is not visible... it is the best way for some people that prefeers a lier saying what people wants to listen than a honest guys saying stuff maybe you like, maybe you don´t. Fortunately it is not my case.

...I dont know so much about the hatred for Schumi but I think people hate Alonso because (from what I have seen) he have only had easy wins...

Giorgos you are starting to make me laugh, a lot, thanks for the making my days funnier. LOL!

I guess you are too young as when Alonso beated Schumi 2 years with a Renault you where 12, 11 ¿?... my friendly tip, is go to youtube and look for a 1995 Karting World Champuionship review, then 1996 Karting World Championship review, then 1999 World Series by Nissan, then 2000 at F3000 with Team Astromega, then 2001 with Minardi, then Renault, etc....

http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/f1-information/whos-who/whos-who-a/fernando-alonso/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fernando_Alonso

 

[Stuart Thomson]

Why is always saying what you think a good thing? What about if what you think is ill considered, inflammatory or just plain wrong?

Larry's points are pretty well made, IMO.

If there is an antipathy building up around Alonso, he's fuelling it himself by his behaviour and demeanour, IMO.

 

[David Garcia]

STUART: Would you say something thinking in advanced it is wrong, inflamatory or a lie? Thinking that is simply stupid. When Alonso say something he thinks he is right, that´s all. As anybody (but a manipulator or a lier) would do.

He gripes when the smaller teams don't let him by when racing for position.

Would you mind showing us an example.

He gripes when penalties to other racers don't come fast enough to suit him.

Sorry let me correct you, he gripes when other racers don´t receive a penalty as fast or as hard as he does.

He whines when his teammate won't let him by despite being, from my position, in pretty firm control of the race.

Are you serious or are you joking as Giorgos? With Massa´s pace at Hockenheim Vettel would have reached both cars risking Ferrari´s cars and race... Looks like you still don´t want to accept it is a team play, and it is ridiculous having to fight for a position risking both team cars when you are faster, or when you are in the position of fighting for the champ/race and your team mate is not despite the position you are in a rcae. Any other example of Alonso complainig about a team mate?

 

[Xosé Estrada]

Actually Massa was never stronger than his team mate, was not with Schumacher (obviously), was not with Kimi (in 2008 Kimi wasn't there at all) and is not now with Alonso.

Alonso beat fair and square Schumacher two times when he was on top, and is two time champion with RENAULT, nothing to proof.

And yes, Singapour happened, but he was not involved, as FIA determined... thing that is very logycal considering he had to do nothing special, just drive. There is not a motive as well, he already had a contract with Ferrari at that time, he had no rush or need to win, why a 2 times world champion would risk that much for a single GP win... but RENAULT did, they needed to secure ING for instance. Insist in this is part of the same thing, because a person should be ashamed of continue accusing another person considered innocent by justice.

I think there is also kind of "cultural misunderstanding" between Alonso and the most of F1 world. It seems for many fans and the organization is more important to keep an image, with everybody smiling and acting following a certain pattern, despite what happens in reality. The old battle between the HOW and the WHAT (hope this makes sense in english).

I realized that with the team orders... all the teams do them, this is the WHAT, but Ferrari did them in public, this is where they did different (HOW) and it seems this created a storm in F1 world... I think nor Alonso, Ferrari or myself realize why, but it seems to be very important for many other people.

A example a guy put in a forum I read makes this difference obvious for me:

"In a country where is not legal to smoke at all, everybody does it but hidden. Then one day one person decides to smoke in public, and everybody starts calling him criminal".

This is what Alonso does not understand, the benefit of smile and say what you have to say if you are a nice guy despite if it's true or not.

Cya!.

 

[ufunacaoenn]

David, Ofcourse Larry will join me because Ferrari would not need to give a team order like that and just say to Massa that Alonso is closing in, if there will be a battle think wisely. Because then there would be a battle but no one would be sad because Massa would know that he did not give the possision wich he could finish at because "Closing up to a driver is one thing, but passing is a totally diffirent thing".

Plus the win in Hockenheim is the same as the win in Singapure only that instead of having Alonso's team mate crashing into a wall his team mate just gives the posision just like that. I can understand that people say "but Alonso is fighting for the WC" but tell me. Would you like to win a race because all the the fast drivers got disconnected and only 5 very slow drivers were left. I dont think so and thats why lots of people hate that insident because they would rather like to see a driver win fairly then winning with the help of a cheat (even if his team is the one pulling the strings).

 

[David Garcia]

But Giorgos, from the point of assuming all the teams on the grid use team orders, would you risk your team results because of not using what everybody does? Cmon. No one got disconected (accident) from the other teams, and if it happens it is racing. But fighting your team mate risking your team interests... if you defend that, it is really hypocrit. Go to the Moto GP format and things will change in F1.

So Singapure and Hockenheim is the same stuff in your eyes... ok. :wink:

 

[David Garcia]

But Giorgos, from the point of assuming all the teams on the grid use team orders, would you risk your team results because of not using what everybody does? Cmon. No one got disconected (accident) from the other teams, and if it happens it is racing. But fighting your team mate risking your team interests... if you defend that, it is really hypocrit. Go to the Moto GP format and things will change in F1.

So Singapure and Hockenheim is the same stuff in your eyes... ok. :wink:

P.D.: Since the Team Radio is shown on TV it really sucks. I wonder what Schumacher or the others said...

* Sorry, I made a double post when trying to avoid my previous one.

 

[Péter Bártfai]

But in the other hand he is a honest guy that always say what he thinks wheter he is right or wrong for the others, if he is convinced he say it, and I use to agree with im most of the time.

Funny because I always feel the opposite when he's speaking...

 

[David Garcia]

This is what happens to me with Hamilton.