Will you be Buying an RTX 3080?

We are living in the age of greed,a rtx 2070 super is selling for 1,400 here in Australia.
Bitcoiners and scalpers have destroyed everything.

I was excited at getting a rtx 3070 at 850 retail but they are now going close to 2k here and all sold out because of scalpers using online bots and bitcoiners buying them in bulk.

We are a dreadful species.
 
We are living in the age of greed,a rtx 2070 super is selling for 1,400 here in Australia.
Bitcoiners and scalpers have destroyed everything.

I was excited at getting a rtx 3070 at 850 retail but they are now going close to 2k here and all sold out because of scalpers using online bots and bitcoiners buying them in bulk.

We are a dreadful species.
I don’t think greed is the correct description. If someone has a nonessential product, why should they sell it for less than market value? We are living in an age of low supply and high demand. This is naturally going to drive prices up.
 
If even 10% of the hashing power on Ethereum right now moves to any alt coin, the difficulty will spike and it won't be profitable anymore.
I'm trying to figure out this statement. Wouldn't fewer miners on a given coin mean a better chance at profitability for those remaining, not less?

Personally, I think that "coins" are a blight upon the world. Etherium, in particular, was designed to be mined on graphics cards in an effort to democratize mining (Bitcoin had long-since been relegated to ASIC miners). How did that work out for the rest of us!? Unintended consequences, indeed! Now, next on the consumer's chopping block is storage, and what will come after that?

Anyway, I've given up on getting any new graphics cards for now (so glad I didn't sell my 2080ti, as I nearly did in anticipation of a 3080). I'd estimate December at the earliest before availability is moderately improved. But I don't expect prices to drop by very much, and by then one might wish to wait for a 4080 to be "available" anyway.
 
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We are living in the age of greed,a rtx 2070 super is selling for 1,400 here in Australia.
Bitcoiners and scalpers have destroyed everything.

I was excited at getting a rtx 3070 at 850 retail but they are now going close to 2k here and all sold out because of scalpers using online bots and bitcoiners buying them in bulk.

We are a dreadful species.
The morally bankrupt who engage in this type of behavior will tell you it is capitalism at work.
They'll justify it too in the name of supply and demand.
I don't know how it is acceptable to have a $699 product selling for $2000.
I won't support it out of sheer principal and I feel good doing so.
I'm gaming on a GTX770 and I flat out refused to pay any of those prices...ever.
If my current card dies before normalcy is restored (whatever that may look like) I'll quit simracing for a bit and go do something else.
It is just that simple.
 
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The morally bankrupt who support this type of behavior will tell you it is capitalism at work.
They'll justify it too in the name of supply and demand.
I don't know how it is acceptable to have a $699 product selling for $2000.
Don't support it out of sheer principal and feel good doing it. I know I won't.
I'm gaming on a GTX770 and I flat out refused to pay any of those prices ever.
If it dies before normalcy is restored...whatever that may be, I'll quit simracing for a while and do something else.
Interesting comments. Can you explain “morally bankrupt”? What is the max profit allowed before you fall into the category of “morally bankrupt?” Allowing a free market to dictate the price of a nonessential item is a fundamental aspect of capitalism. It’s not like GPU’s are an essential item to survive. People willing to pay the price are clearly happy with their buying decision or they would not have made it. Obviously they would have been even happier to have bought it at half the price but that is not the current market.
 
I'm trying to figure out this statement. Wouldn't fewer miners on a given coin mean a better chance at profitability for those remaining, not less?

Personally, I think that "coins" are a blight upon the world. Etherium, in particular, was designed to be mined on graphics cards in an effort to democratize mining (Bitcoin had long-since been relegated to ASIC miners). How did that work out for the rest of us!? Unintended consequences, indeed! Now, next on the consumer's chopping block is storage, and what will come after that?

Anyway, I've given up on getting any new graphics cards for now (so glad I didn't sell my 2080ti, as I nearly did in anticipation of a 3080). I'd estimate December at the earliest before availability is moderately improved. But I don't expect prices to drop by very much, and by then one might wish to wait for a 4080 to be "available" anyway.
The basic explanation is:
Cryptocurrency is awarded when a block is calculated. This is a mathematical operation that requires multiple GPU's to perform. The block is usually calculated with a ton of smaller math operations that each GPU solves.
The difficulty of solving these mathematical problems is directly proportional to the difficulty level of the network. As more processing power gets added, the difficulty rises. So basically, ideally, the rate of distributing cryptocurrency that's generated through POW will be slow enough that the value can rise.

The reason no other coin will be viable when Ethereum mining dies, is because there's a LOT of hashing power on Ethereum right now. I'm not talking about ASIC's, but GPU's. Ethereum was GPU mineable for way longer than BTC.

Right now, I'd be surprised if even 0.5% of the hashing power on Ethereum was on any of the alt-coins. The reason 10% would be a lot is because even 10% of Ethereum hashing power would be so much, that the difficulty would rise, but the value of the alt-coins wouldn't rise alongside the difficulty rise. So it wouldn't be profitable for miners.

And at the same time, they'd see other miners trying to dump their GPU's before the market corrects itself. Why would the market correct itself? Because GPU's are still being manufactured. Why would anyone pay $2400 for a 3080 on Ebay when Best Buy is still stocking them every week? Plus gamers who don't care about the LHR versions will buy those. So large mining farms will dump their GPU's, hoping to get as much of the resell price as they can. Some just want the GPU's gone so they'll literally dump them for or under MSRP.

This will sort of lead to a snowball effect. GPU's going down in price, causes more mining farms to dump their GPU's hoping to sell them, which will again cause GPU's to go down in price, causing more mining farms to sell them. This happened in 2017, trust me, it'll be the same now, maybe even worse.
 
I sold my crypto at the peak. Got a LOT of insults from people when I said to a group of miners I know "sell now" because I wasn't a "believer". You don't need an MBA to see that something going from $19k to $65k in four months is unsustainable. Whatever. They can have fun sliding down that rollercoaster at 200 miles per hour.
 
I don't know how it is acceptable to have a $699 product selling for $2000.
Don't support it out of sheer principal and feel good doing it. I know I won't.
Not paying the prices is how they'll fall. The problem is the gamer market is full of thirsty people with more money than sense. I find the whole console market a complete rip off and a prime example of how gamers will pay anything for the latest popular products. Past grievances go out the window and instead of voting with their wallet they'll hand over money and then cry about it after the fact.

I sold my crypto at the peak. Got a LOT of insults from people when I said to a group of miners I know "sell now" because I wasn't a "believer".
Those people shouldn't be playing with investment markets.
 
What I'm reading is that 5/31 will be the official release of the 3080Ti and 3070Ti.

That should be an interesting day. I'm expecting to hear the continued gnashing of teeth and complaints about availability, but if there are more sku's and products floating around that's a good thing right?
 
What I'm reading is that 5/31 will be the official release of the 3080Ti and 3070Ti.

That should be an interesting day. I'm expecting to hear the continued gnashing of teeth and complaints about availability, but if there are more sku's and products floating around that's a good thing right?
Problem is that these SKUs are reliant on defective wafers (same with CPUs). If yields are good then there are not a lot of chips to bin into the lower SKU's. EG. poor 3090 chips would have been turned into 3080's but now they are being split amongst 3080 and 3080ti. Same number of cards going out the door, just a different mix of SKUs.
 
Problem is that these SKUs are reliant on defective wafers (same with CPUs). If yields are good then there are not a lot of chips to bin into the lower SKU's. EG. poor 3090 chips would have been turned into 3080's but now they are being split amongst 3080 and 3080ti. Same number of cards going out the door, just a different mix of SKUs.

My understanding was that 3090's have never been repurposed as 3080's and are also built at a different fab.

So the 3080Ti's should be additional GPU's that have been accumulating a while.

The 3070Ti's I have no idea about.
 
They are the same Ampere GA102 chip. Defective chips have their bad cores locked out and become the lower spec'd models. Same thing with 5950x and 5900.

NVIDIA-GeForce-RTX-3090-vs-NVIDIA-GeForce-RTX-3080_10485_10487.247598.0.html
 
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They are the same Ampere GA102 chip. Defective chips have their bad cores locked out and become the lower spec'd models. Same thing with 5950x and 5900.

NVIDIA-GeForce-RTX-3090-vs-NVIDIA-GeForce-RTX-3080_10485_10487.247598.0.html

My point is that the 3090 chips that didn't make the cut have not been put into 3080's. They are all patiently waiting to become 3080Ti's.

The 3090 chips are built in a separate fab from the rest of the 30 series.
 
Haven't been able to locate any articles specifying which 8mm Samsung fabs they are built on and/or the 7mm TSMC ones they are moving/moved to this year. Just know that they are both the GA102 die.

This article further indicates the 3080 is a locked down 3090 which didn't make the cut...
"The GA102 GPU powering the RTX 3080 and 3090 has 7 GPCs (Graphics Processing Clusters) which are divided into five or four TPCs (Texture Processing Clusters) which in turn is composed of two SMs. It consists of 6,144kB of L2 cache for the 3090 and 5,120kB for the 3080 (The TU102 had 6,144kB) while the GA104 packs even lesser at 4,096kB. The RTX 3080 packs 6 active GPCs with one GPC disabled. This results in an overall core count of 8,704 CUDA cores or 68 SMs. For the RTX 3090, (almost) the entire die is enabled (except two SMs) resulting in a total core count of 10,496 or 82 SMs.... Furthermore, two of the memory controllers in the RTX 3080 are disabled reducing the bus-width from 384-bit to 320-bit. Interestingly, in the case of the RTX 3080, the number of TPCs vary from GPC to GPC. This is because, in two of the GPCs, there are only five TPCs instead of six. Even with the “BFGPU”, the RTX 3090, two SMs are disabled (not shown in the above block diagram)."

 
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As @RCHeliguy said, the 3080 is a completely different chip. Originally Nvidia was going to release the 3080 Ti earlier, but when they realized demand was holding well into 2021, they started purposing those chips for 3090 instead. The fundamental difference isn't the quality of the silicon, it is the amount of memory.
https://www.techradar.com/news/your-nvidia-geforce-rtx-3090-might-secretly-be-an-old-rtx-3080-ti
They literally just cross out the name lol.

Anyway, 3080 Ti is a somewhat pointless SKU. The performance difference between the 3090 and 3080 was already a hard sell for the price difference, but people bought the 3090 because for hobby ML applications and development, it was quite a value. All that gets tossed out the window by having only 12GB of memory on the 3080 Ti.

They aren't creating an LHR version of the 3090, which leads me to believe they're going to just allow the AIB's to keep their 3090 price as the "unofficial" MSRP ($2200-$2500), and the 3080 Ti will slot in to where the 3090 FE was, at $1500. If I'm right, the 3090 FE will magically "stop" being restocked.

They've already slowed 3080 FE/3090 FE restock pace to a crawl. It used to be weekly back from December until March, suddenly it's a monthly drop.
 
Not referring to the memory configurations, just the GA102 which is used for all 3 cards. Please provide some citations showing that they are different chips... everything I can find indicates 3080s (both regular and ti) are just cut down/gimped versions.

"The GA102 graphics processor is a large chip with a die area of 628 mm² and 28,300 million transistors. Unlike the fully unlocked GeForce RTX 3090, which uses the same GPU but has all 10496 shaders enabled, NVIDIA has disabled some shading units on the GeForce RTX 3080 to reach the product's target shader count."

 
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Labeling aside, the 3090, 3080 and the (vapor, thus far) 3080ti all use the same base chip. The 3080 gets the dies that aren't fully functional per the needs of the 3090, and the 3080 ti will presumably get the "tweener" chips that aren't 3090 quality but are better than 3080's requirements (or perhaps they will use the same full chips as the 3090, but just with less memory - no one outside Nvidia really knows). "Better" here mostly means fewer defects on the die.

A caveat is that Nvidia has been preparing slightly modified designs (with hardware changes? Just firmware?) that throttles mining speeds, and it's still unclear which models will get those. Some rumor sites are echoing a rumor that the 3090 won't be affected, with the rational being that the 3090 is already so expensive that miners view them as less profitable. I'm not sanguine about this, especially after 3080's get hobbled, and I'd hope all future gaming-oriented models are hobbled for mining.

That said, I'm far from certain that this hobbling will actually improve availability and pricing, assuming that Nvidia sells mining-only cards too. Their limited chip production capacity relative to demand would not be expected to improve just because they split that same limited capacity into two diverging lines of products.
 
Interesting comments. Can you explain “morally bankrupt”? What is the max profit allowed before you fall into the category of “morally bankrupt?” Allowing a free market to dictate the price of a nonessential item is a fundamental aspect of capitalism. It’s not like GPU’s are an essential item to survive. People willing to pay the price are clearly happy with their buying decision or they would not have made it. Obviously they would have been even happier to have bought it at half the price but that is not the current market.
Capitalism isn't always a good thing.
Lots of instances of it going horribly wrong...even on critical items during disasters.
It is only as good as the people pushing it.
They're lots of very greedy, immoral people willing to subject people to the worst aspects of it.
 
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