SFX-100 + Next Level V3 Owners Thread

[anton_Chez]

Hello friends! It's me again back with another helpful and entertaining RD thread! This time focusing on combining motion's new kid on the block, the SFX-100 AC Servo full chassis motion solution with our current favourite seat mover, the Next Level Racing V3 Motion Platform. We already have extensive threads for either of these amazing pieces of sim racing hardware, you can read more about them both in the links below:

- SFX-100 / SimFeedback-AC DIY

- Next Level Racing V3 Motion Platform

This thread will focus on the owners or potential owners looking to combine these solutions for their sim racing motion experience. Looking forward to seeing everyone's input on getting the most out of this setup. Feel free to leave suggestion, questions, settings and profiles and anything in between. The other threads are huge now and have a lot of discussion, let's get this one up there, too!

 

[Mascot]

That's was faster than we all could imagine @Mascot.

It just might be the right decision and it also avoids a lot of work getting the V3 on and of the rig and making the various adjustments.

Yeah, I think I'd rather not know how good the v3 surge feels in tandem with the SFX100 in case I somehow try to justify it alone being worth £1,500+ . Of course it isn't, even if it's awesome.
If money wasn't a consideration then I'd be more inclined to try it and keep both, but £1,500 is a serious chunk of change.

 

[anton_Chez]

Apparently I've been told that I can sell ice to eskimos....... I am starting to think that may be the case

Cue another UK V3 unit being listed on the marketplace thread..... @Steve D

Seriously though, check this out.

That's how low I currently have gotten my seat with the V3 off. The bottom of the bearing mount sits 70mm from the rubber pad, so maybe 80mm from the floor. My ass sits 200mm from the floor with the shaft retracted and powered off. So, that's roughly 130mm between my seating position and how far the actuators are off the ground. I've had to drop wheel deck and pedal deck to make up for how low I am sitting now. I've also taken the opportunity to clean up the shifter mount, which now is getting in the way badly with my new seating position.

So a few things to note. I am replacing this seat with a Sparco Rev bucket seat in a week of so when it arrives (from Ireland of all places) and with that I've ordered the side mounts for it. This seat had an issue with the V3 in that the underside of the seat would foul the mount platform of the V3 if tried to mount directly. That's why I have the cross railings on the seat and since I am hopefully bundling the seat with the V3 sale, it made no sense to muck around with removing them now. I'll hopefully have someone pick it up and just take it the way I've put it together for them.

But, I've now got the seat mount railings for the GT1 inside the bottom frame, as opposed to resting on top of it like in their schematics. I simply moved the front cross member in front of the seat slightly forward to allow dropping them in. I can now directly mount the side mounts to these and then mount my Rev to the side mounts. Much easier and nowhere near as tight an area to work in. Probably save some brackets and bolts, too. I wouldn't be surprised if I get my seating position almost in line with the bottom of the linear bearing mount. I can go 40mm lower into the side rail for the seat mounts and then obviously remove the need for the cross mount this seat has installed, saving another 40mm. All that's left is to see how different the height of the holes is on the new side mounts in relation to where they are mounted on the bottom seat rails.

I've yet to take it for a spin, but will do so now before bed. Curious to see how the feedback is felt with the seat this low. It's a massive different just having the rigidity in the seat hard mounted to the frame as opposed to having it sit on a pivot point.

Also, my reference to a DIY project was to a seat harness tensioner, not an actual G seat. I think with the purchase of the Rev bucket, I'm clear of entertaining a G seat for the time being.

 

[Mascot]

Decision made.
Gonna miss that beast. It's served me well.

 

[EsxPaul]

So the general consensus is that if you have to choose, it'd be the SFX100 every time. I definitely couldn't raise the funds for both and have been undecided on which to go for.

Its been interesting to watch you guys coming to your decisions and I note that the V3s have been let go with what I detect as heavy hearts.

 

[anton_Chez]

Definitely. It has been an amazing piece of kit for the past 2 years for me. Hence the reason I wanted so much for it to work together. It does, but just feel that overall the experience is better with it off. You definitely miss some things from not having it, but you also miss things from the full motion with having it, so having a more simplified, lighter, more accessible and better overall feeling rig I think is the best way to go.

Great thing is others are going to be able to pick one of these up for like two thirds the price of a brand new one which means someone that might not have been able to pick one up now has a chance to. There will be a few of them floating around now I reckon.

I loved my V3 the more that I had it. As the software improved and added features and functionality it definitely grew as a piece of hardware the longer that I owned it. Things I didn't like were eventually greatly reduced or outright eliminated as the software matured both with internal testing at motionsystems and also through user feedback, which they took on board very willingly.

I can't recommend the platform enough for someone that doesn't have the space, funds or confidence to jump into something like the SFX-100 build, where you already preferably need an 80 20 cockpit or need to buy one as you begin to start the project. The V3 is a hassle free, highly effective, quiet, space saving and neat looking motion platform solution that will suit many builds, with software that is highly tune-able and easy to use, with a fair bit of depth now added to get cars to feel unique and to your liking.

 

[Mascot]

Its been interesting to watch you guys coming to your decisions and I note that the V3s have been let go with what I detect as heavy hearts.

Yep, it's a fantastic bit of kit and works superbly with VR. Even my Sparco looks sad to see it go in the photo above.

 

[o Tiger Feet o]

Just wondering how you guys that have gone from a V3 to the SFX find curb rumble? Does the SFX create a similar effect? The curb rumble on the V3 in Rfactor 2 is particularly impressive....

 

[anton_Chez]

Is is nicely done on on the V3 in rF2. It's actually one of the newer features I remember being implemented. I don't remember it being there for most of the time that I've had it and I've spent a fair bit of time in that title.

The SFX-100 does an amazing job of curbs. It's like going from a consumer wheel to a direct drive wheel for road detail. When you hit rumble strips, curbs and flat spot a tire, you are immediately taken back by how intense, rapid and strong the forces are from the FFB. That's not a rumble motor in there, that's the actual servo motor moving at such a rate to generate those impressive forces. The same is with the road detail in the actuators. I only ever use my tactile units now for engine RPM and maybe some wheel slide effects. I've turned everything to do with suspension geometry off in tactile. It's a no contest.

 

[Soulstoner]

Decision made.
Gonna miss that beast. It's served me well.

What are you going to do with the aluminum angle that you used to fix the v3 to your rig? I'd love to purchase it including shipping costs if that's something you're interested in? I don't feel like i'd be successful in drilling my own set as I lack the proper heavy duty hardware.

 

[Mascot]

What are you going to do with the aluminum angle that you used to fix the v3 to your rig? I'd love to purchase it including shipping costs if that's something you're interested in? I don't feel like i'd be successful in drilling my own set as I lack the proper heavy duty hardware.

Ah, sorry - already sliced up and recycled into seat brackets..!

 

[sjb266]

Hey @anton_Chez where'd you score the Supercars shifter knob?

 

[anton_Chez]

@sjb266 Hey Simon. In one of my racing league's Discord server there was talk of someone making these authentic Supercar shifter knobs. I checked it out and since we do a lot of V8 Supercar racing it seemed like the perfect fit!

There's a guy on Facebook that I got it through. He makes them himself. The only thing I don't really like about it is the 3D printed sleeve he gives you to match the thickness and thread of your shifter lever. It doesn't screw the knob on 100% straight. I'm sure that's not a problem for you, however!

www.facebook.com/Nexttecq/

That's his page. Check it out. It cost me around 120 I think. I use it all the time and barely use the stock HE levers anymore. I do occasionally swap them over but it's a lovely feeling shifter knob and if you have the right sequential shifter for it it's great. I think the HE has JUST enough tension on the shifts to make it worth it.

 

[sjb266]

Thanks Ant.. I'm onto it!

I feel like I need to get a longer shaft for my HE shifter.. hmmm...

 

[anton_Chez]

I'll tell you what I've found. With that beefy supercar shifter, you lose a little bit of the notch feel to the shifts. So the shorter the shaft (you get 3 with the shifter, use the shortest straight one) I believe the better the feel in shift. With THAT knob in particular. The way you get around this is mount the shifter higher, up around the top of the rim, so that the top of the knob is somewhat level with the top of the rim. The closer together side by side, even better. It feels awesome shifting this way with a sequential.

That's what I've found anyway. You might like the softer feeling that the longer shaft delivers (!), but I like the defined engagement into the next gear. With the HE you can't really adjust the tension more than a tiny bit, otherwise it either wobbles or binds up. So the shaft is a way to manipulate the feel, as well as the knob you combine with it.

Too much knob talk mate.......

 

[RCHeliguy]

Anthony,
That's a very impressive looking setup!

I'm planning to upgrade my controls to Heusinkveld whenever they catch up with demand. I've heard great things about the Ultimates, but I was planning on going with the Sprints to reduce the force on my knees.

After upgrading my pedals, hand brake and adding a dedicated sequential shift, I think I'm going to sit tight for a while and see how much use I give my rig.

Can you show a picture of all the power and control hardware used to run the actuators?
Now that you've removed the NLRv3, how much would you estimate your rig weighs?

 

[Mr Latte]

So I have a query, curious if some can clarify this and would be interested in modding their SFX build by trying out an idea I have. Please confirm, the following is right for users that tested/added the VR3.

Longitudinal G Telemetry Data
This moved the seat axis bringing it closer or further away from the wheel deck during acceleration and deceleration.

During this being applied an SFX rig would either dip at the front or rear for forward/aft tilt.
So combined with the VR3 the user would be immersed with:

Braking/Deceleration
SFX = Forward Tilt/Dip
VR3 = Additional Forward Tilt/Push Compression Towards Steering Wheel Position

Acceleration
SFX = Back Tilt/Dip
VR3 = Additional Back Tilt/Pull Stretch Away From Steering Wheel Position

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Lateral G Telemetry Data
This tilted the seat axis more to the left or right during cornering/steering or bumps.

During this being applied an SFX rig would just tilt to the left or right.
Yet combined with the VR3 the user would be immersed with:

Left/Right Lateral G / Bumps
SFX = Left/Right Tilt/Dip Maintaining Same Angle With Wheel Position
VR3 = Additional Tilt/Rotation Left/Right Applied Between Steering Wheel Position & Wheel Position

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

So What If
We were testing and the wheel deck for the steering wheel was 100% stationary and would not move in conjunction with the SFX motion at all. This would allow the SFX on its own to move around the steering wheel support. Basically, it would be the reverse of a (seat mover) in that we could use the SFX motion to alter the angle or forward/aft position of the "Steering Wheel Position". in relation to the "User Seated Position". As such, we disconnect how the wheel moves with the SFX motion to help replicate what the VR3 was adding.

Additionally, the structure for the wheel deck could also support a monitor etc. It seems most SFX users are seeking to go with this method with a fixed display than one attached to the SFX 8020 frame.

One early idea/possibility would be that the base for this "wheel/monitor" support could be fixed in place that it is beneath the SFX actuators. Here the whole weight of the rig & user keeps it in place. Importantly ensuring it does not enable the steering wheel position to move. So this becomes like a plinth and can have additional feet/isolation underneath from the floor.

Braking/Deceleration
SFX = Forward Tilt/Dip Of User Seated Position
FIXED Steering Wheel Position = Forward Tilt/Push Compression Towards User Seated Position


Acceleration
SFX = Back Tilt/Dip Of User Seated Position
FIXED Steering Wheel Position = Additional Tilt/Pull From User Seated Position

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Left/Right Lateral G / Bumps
SFX = Left/Right Tilt/Dip Generating Variable:
Tilt/Rotation between Stationary Wheel Position & User Seated Position.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

[anton_Chez]

The heave of the motion platform will probably render a fixed wheel unusable. I think that's the missing element here in the hypothesis.

 

[Mr Latte]

The heave of the motion platform will probably render a fixed wheel unusable. I think that's the missing element here in the hypothesis.

It is one factor that yes, I can see it being a problem if it was set with a high amount of movement, but like the other axis that moved the user towards/away from the wheel, why would it be a problem if we limited the actual amount of "heave" movement it generated?

Based on what some already have shared, If small amounts of movement from the VR3 are enough to accentuate the motion, especially in VR. What happens when we apply the same to "heave" motion?

What I question is if a controlled motion that was limited to how much it moved, can still heighten "longitudinal" and "lateral" movements, then why can the same not also be applied with "heaveI'm

Im curious if someone has tried to test this or would consider.

 

[anton_Chez]

I probably should update my position on the thread as the OP here. I've had my V3 platform off the rig for a good few weeks now and intend to keep it that way. I think I've outlined the reasons and benefits of doing so somewhere along the line here and also in the main SFX-100 thread.

I still think if people are upgrading from a V3 seat mover to the full motion experience and can spare the change that they should give it a try combined. Then you can make an informed decision whether it's feasible to continue running like that.

 

[RCHeliguy]

I saw this recently which seems like a very interesting combination of motion systems.
I notice that it has diagonal actuators in back so the whole rig can effectively turn left and right as well as having a seat mover system. It looks pretty elaborate.

I'm not entirely sure how it works since the front rig actuators appear vertical. The back actuators have the motors on the floor to reduce moving mass and more likely to create a smaller pivot point.