PC1 Pcars: A community divided

Continuation of Part 1: http://www.racedepartment.com/forum/threads/banned-for-no-reason.47384/

Its hard to believe a game has taken a community over like this. Now with legal proceedings, its kind of become a joke for simmers. I have been at this a while now and have never seen a game invoke so much negative and positive reaction. May the discussions continue :)


Ps. While i continue to support pcars, i respect RD for allowing the freedom of expression to all its members.
 
Sorry that I leap over the current argument but Happy New Year (Yes, I know that I´m too late ;))

I´m very sceptic about PCARS. So many things that are crucial to the driveability haven´t made it into the game although we only have almost one year to implement them. My criticism over at WMD pretty much branded me as the grumpy middle aged man :D.Others have left, got banned or just lost interest at all. Some of them were good guys with lots of knowledge. And all because they were called "rude" "ungrateful" etc.

- Instead of implementing a real clutch you can throw in the gears without pressing it down
- The Tyremodel should be not in this premature state yet that we already have only 1 year of time
- The new Chassismodel is not implemented though it should be
- The whole graphics section is way beyond the physics section
- Their political correctnes in their forum and backstabbing attitude on this forum f.e. make me nauseous
- The sound seems to not develop anymore. Some effects here and there but the cars miss any uniqueness

Since "true" WMDers stop reading at this point thinking "ah hes bitching again", other might read on.

PCARS has done some very brave and unique decisions that show that they somehow know their fans.
- They got the Yellow Bird license (and other fantastic RUF models)
- They don´t try to chum up with the mainstream taste. Very nerdy cars like Ariel Atom, the BAC Mono. They go for the nerds. Bravo
- They implement the Solitude Rennstrecke and add more Countryroad tracks that will delight the guys like me who love to drive on real streets rather than circletracks.
- Their graphics guys have created the most realistic version of the Nordschleife ever. I was there doing reference photographs for them and they did a very good job.
- The weathersystem is going to get better and better although it already offers very credible weather conditions.

All in all I think that Pcars has to focus on the Physics and the FFB the most. The sim feels so broken that I simply don´t enjoy testing anymore. MOreover the attitude in the forum forbids to clearly speak your mind, especially if you are frustrated about some things. It doesn´t make sense anymore. I already stated there that I will keep my mouth shut most of the time and will go on consuming. Thats what basically every corporation wants. The dumb thing is that SMS pretended to handle things not that way. Now the community consists of the usual yea-sayers and some Experts like Nic Hamilton and Ben Collins who basically say what already has been stated in the past.

But this is all bitchy-nonsense uttered by a crazy man who should be banned :)
 
Um...but they are focusing on the physics and FFB. Interesting notes in the past couple of days by Ben Collins on the Lotus 98T and Nic Hamilton as well as responses by their physics guys AJ/Casey.

AJ in particular seems to know a ton about the other games tyre models (rF1, iRacing OTM/NTM, GPL etc.) I think he's the key to the project and why I have a lot of confidence in SMS to really nail it in physics and FFB.
 
Sorry that I leap over the current argument but Happy New Year (Yes, I know that I´m too late ;))

I´m very sceptic about PCARS. So many things that are crucial to the driveability haven´t made it into the game although we only have almost one year to implement them. My criticism over at WMD pretty much branded me as the grumpy middle aged man :D.Others have left, got banned or just lost interest at all. Some of them were good guys with lots of knowledge. And all because they were called "rude" "ungrateful" etc.

- Instead of implementing a real clutch you can throw in the gears without pressing it down
- The Tyremodel should be not in this premature state yet that we already have only 1 year of time
- The new Chassismodel is not implemented though it should be
- The whole graphics section is way beyond the physics section
- Their political correctnes in their forum and backstabbing attitude on this forum f.e. make me nauseous
- The sound seems to not develop anymore. Some effects here and there but the cars miss any uniqueness

Since "true" WMDers stop reading at this point thinking "ah hes bitching again", other might read on.

PCARS has done some very brave and unique decisions that show that they somehow know their fans.
- They got the Yellow Bird license (and other fantastic RUF models)
- They don´t try to chum up with the mainstream taste. Very nerdy cars like Ariel Atom, the BAC Mono. They go for the nerds. Bravo
- They implement the Solitude Rennstrecke and add more Countryroad tracks that will delight the guys like me who love to drive on real streets rather than circletracks.
- Their graphics guys have created the most realistic version of the Nordschleife ever. I was there doing reference photographs for them and they did a very good job.
- The weathersystem is going to get better and better although it already offers very credible weather conditions.

All in all I think that Pcars has to focus on the Physics and the FFB the most. The sim feels so broken that I simply don´t enjoy testing anymore. MOreover the attitude in the forum forbids to clearly speak your mind, especially if you are frustrated about some things. It doesn´t make sense anymore. I already stated there that I will keep my mouth shut most of the time and will go on consuming. Thats what basically every corporation wants. The dumb thing is that SMS pretended to handle things not that way. Now the community consists of the usual yea-sayers and some Experts like Nic Hamilton and Ben Collins who basically say what already has been stated in the past.

But this is all bitchy-nonsense uttered by a crazy man who should be banned :)

Excellent well thought out post sir. :thumbsup:
 
Um...but they are focusing on the physics and FFB...

As I wrote. Thats too late to begin tinkering with such elemental stuff. Yeah its nice that they already noticed that something is wrong with the most important gameplay element (the physics) but its too late to. No wonder the trolls jump on the Arcade argument. Its all shiny but the FFB and physics suck. The Lotus 98t is the only car that is finally at a stage where I can call it driveable. But honestly it as well has a long way to go. I just cannot imagine how they want to organize the finishing of the sim in time.
I really want them to get things right (I mean, I payed for this :D ) but I really don´t see it anymore. It feels sometimes like GTR2. The non saveable back of cars f. e.
The debates in the past and all just gives me the feeling that their ego slipped right in front of the craft. One dev wrote a PM to me that it was rude to call Stephen Baystedt not by his Doctors degree. WTF? Are these guys living in the 19th century? Its so sad.
 
They work on it fulltime...there is plenty of time to bring physics and tires on the "right" way. I am sure, that AJ knows what he is doing.

They started with the old BTM and worked on it till march 2012. The community said, that it is not good enough...so they made a restart with direct FFB and later with STM...and now after 10 month it is not ready at all.
Wait till AJ is firing up the 2nd stage of his STM, the flex carcass system....and he has 3 more stages in mind....perhaps we wont see them all in this first pCARS, but I think other sim developer havent all their ideas in their first release, too.

The real art is to hold this developement cycle driveable for the users from build to build...so sometimes it feels better and other time less. Some cars are good, others are worst.

Test the Bac Mono right now and see how good it is in controlling in powersteering. Search for good ffb-tweakerfiles at WMD and reduce sensitivity of steering to 20-30 as a workaround...play with your FFB and tireforce sliders...I found a combination, that works pretty well.
 
Well it's fine saying that it will all come good, but what with many members now questioning if it will be ready at all this year with so much yet to do and the game being constantly stuck in pre-alpha, some are beginning to think it might take quite a lot longer. And all this faff about the FSA investigating their investment work arounds too. It's getting complicated. I see that even though the big investors and many not so big investors bought into the investment to now be told it is not an investment and no returns are guaranteed. Not good at all.
 
your thoughts arnt wrong...but who owns the problems?....surely not the community, right? We can wait...we are waiting for AC and waiting for rf2 to complete, some are waiting for iracing while sending hundreds of bucks....are they all just in time?...No. They all will be ready, when its done and not earlier ;) I give them all the time they need, because there is lot to drive for all of us right now...

Keep on racing!
 
B377, horrible pendulum physics, and unlike GTR EVO/GSC, you can barely feel anything except a gross reaction/snap, so in both EVO/GSC, you can play with both the brakes and especially the throttle right near the limit{RACE ON US Muscle car a great example}, but pcars has snappy spring loaded pendulum physics not worthy of a sim.

Can or will they fix this, who knows, but the longer it remains in this state, the less likely it's looking.
 
"pendulum physics" hits the nail on the head. I´ve driven several sportscars on the Nordschleife in my life. If I drive on the PCARS Schleife the cars jump around and transfer after each lift off in the most unnatural way. The back end swings like no good. In real life a "neutral" car goes over all fours.
 
Just that it has been said: I think AJ has really the best expertise to manage the problem. My concern is on the "menpower". Due to the complexity and size of this problem I really have concerns that he alone can deal with this problem. Furthermore Ian bell himself statet (some time) ago that AJ only does PCARS as a side project. I really think AJ should get a helping hand. Or two...
 
I just want to get behind the wheel and feel "wow" and that hasnt happened for me yet. I keep testing away tho. Just picked up an overclocked 660 ti and it runs the visuals nicely.

Same here Nathan. I look forward to every build but every week it does not improve for me and in fact, it got worse lately. Obviously they have to try out many different things. I really do wonder when it will really start to improve as they were hoping for a 2013 release.
 
It's great to read some more of Ben Collins and Nic Hamilton's thoughts.

The great thing is they get listened to and considered by WMD'ers/Devs, I wish I and other members of the community were treated the same over the past 15 months, when we have attempted to discuss many of the same things.

The attitude of some WMD members even those with a title have held back physics and driving development as they won't accept things need to change.

At least the cogs are turning now, and I hope the outcome is a good one.
 

Latest News

What's needed for simracing in 2024?

  • More games, period

  • Better graphics/visuals

  • Advanced physics and handling

  • More cars and tracks

  • AI improvements

  • AI engineering

  • Cross-platform play

  • New game Modes

  • Other, post your idea


Results are only viewable after voting.
Back
Top