HOLY Shamolee - The Long Requested / Buttkicker Gamer 2 / Simhub Tactile Effects Thread

Mr Latte

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I've been asked for a long time to do a thread on one of the most popular ever tactile transducers.
To this day the Buttkicker Gamer 2 is one of the most considered entry-level packages.






The CURSE OF TACTILE:
As tactile becomes a REAL headache of a topic.

First off, I'm going to simply request that this thread is for discussion only of using the Buttkicker Gamer product line.
This way all users are on the same hardware. It's not, to talk about tactile in general, it's not to talk about other models of Buttkicker or different makes of units and different models or using different amps etc.

Keeping It Simple Guys
So let's focus on and talk about using "Simhub" and getting started with effects creation/tuning for the BK Gamer & BK Gamer 2 models
My hope is people will benefit and learn from this, owners will get involved. People will start to share their own effects, discuss issues, configurations ask questions. I will help what I can and for those that are new to this and using a single shaker or indeed the more advanced users with multiple sets of units installed.


Getting Started:
Tactile when it's working nice can be a great addition but it can also be a troublesome one as these and many threads show regards setting up, configuring, and how to come up with nice working effects. I will continue to update this thread in time with images/info on getting started but I think we have a fair few that are already using and familiar with the software.

(Info on Amp & Soundcard Settings To be Added)
(Info on Windows/Software Settings To Be Added)
(Images for break down on mentioned factors, Master Volume / Effect Folders / Effect Layers)



Featured Effects - Lets SHARE!
Here is my own effects submission, as my first test effects based on ACC and The Ferrari 488GT3
I used this car for creating the files as I had previous effects testing done with this.

My advice is if checking out the effects try them on that sim/car.
People will likely use shared effects for other cars and sims too and that can vary how well or suitable the effects are but for feedback.
I would suggest relating to how effects feel with the car/sim they are created on. To me, this makes sense if someone else creates/shares their own sets to mention what sim/car was used.



What I attempted to do with this set was to bring more to the immersion than an individual or typically used tones have.
Yet also with the intent to make things easy and keep down the number of layers an effect uses. This way we can get more variation in the possible feel and personalize the felt sensations.

  • As a baseline, these are not bad, better is possible with more layers but this being mostly aimed at beginners to tactile
  • I want to make it easier to start feeling or learning how we can achieve nice felt sensations
  • Simple advice, stick to altering just the volumes and not things in each layer's settings if you are not aware of how/what they do
  • In some scenarios with combinations of effects, even a single Hz change can alter how the layers of different effects work together or feel
  • This can be covered if the thread is a success and then we could start looking deeper into each effect's primary settings

Balancing Frequencies
With each effect, I have them simply labeled for easy discussion and in their own folder.
  • Within each folder, I have set out 3 layers for most effects
  • This enables altering the volume of individual layers to adjust the feel of that effect
  • Try each layer on its own, learn what it does/how it feels then set a general volume
  • Do the same for all effects, then fine-tune the volume for each effect folder, to balance the mix for all effects
  • Test and tweak, different cars or sims can vary even with the same settings


Same Effects / Very Different Feel
You can create a volume balance that is more towards the engine or chassis feel depending on what you like. It's also possible to create a volume mix for both scenarios and save these as individual profiles to then use/load as you please.

We all may differ in what, we prefer to represent sensations for different effects, so I welcome others to get involved too.
Personally, I think it's better to use more balanced volumes or try to limit the effects used. Even this set the Engine/Speed effects to keep a single unit busy and make it harder to feel other effects.

These effects have perhaps some potential for easier enjoyment in getting started but the may need better-balanced volume settings
See what you think and feel free to comment or indeed highlight issues.



How To Use:
Simhub can be found HERE
My efforts being shared are like an unofficial help/guidance I am no way associated with the software or its developer. I recommend this incredible software as it is the best option now available for tactile and with many other uses/features. So please consider giving its developer a kind donation.

I strongly recommend also reading any official documentation that is given to get a grasp of how to use it.


NOTICE: The attached set of effects is not to represent ideal/perfect settings but as a starter for people to use and give feedback. If people get involved and offer feedback or share their own effects then I will help with sharing other effects more to what people may want.

My Attached Profile:
*Download File, place it in Docs/Simhub folder and rename from ".txt" to ".siprofile" for it to work as a profile
You should then be able to import it into Simhub.
 

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  • Assetto Corsa Competizione - RD Forums _ BK GAMER2 - ACC - Example Effects By Mr Latte.txt
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Sorry, got a bit confused with "I have my amp at 57" which I thought you meant the buttkicker amp even though you said 13 clicks on the physical button of the amp. And in search of buttkicker gamer 2 greatness just clarifying.

My 2 rigs - one buttkicker is 13 and the other 14 physical clicks but I have my soundcard level within windows at 75. Using simhub and tiny bit of red clipping on BK amp now and again.

The buttkicker gamer 2 clearly has enough power as I base that on a simple experiment I did with it. I disconnected from simhub and instead selected deep bass hip hop music on YouTube and oh my gawd my buttkicker came to life in an amazing away. Really intense, much more intense than using simhub or simshaker wheels and no clipping and i could also increase the buttkicker amp further. I think (i don't know) telemetry and simhub pulses are different to audio sounds but still the buttkicker is quite remarkable if giving the right juice. A youtube video of a helicopter approaching was amazing also. Tempted to buy simvibe to see it it does anything different to simhub with regards to pulses etc...as in, does it do it totally differently but it's a bit pricey at £80.
 
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Sorry for the noob question but I dont know where to put the file, I dont seem to have a docs/simhub folder ?
What am I missing ?

** Never mind, figured it out :)
 
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Sorry for jumping into this without reading every single post.

I have 4 x mini LFE's in Chassis mode (simvibe) using Emotiva BasX A500 and Sound blaster Audigy FX. All working fine and now thinking of adding a couple of large LFE's, another sound card and of course an amplifier. The new large LFE's will run in extension mode.

In some older posts I read about recommended Behringer iNUKE 6000 dsp for 2 large LFE's. Is this amplifier still recommended or there is something else that can do the same or better? I heard that Mr.Latte is an expert in the field, and of course all your help is welcome.

Best Regards
 
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There is plenty of good information on amplifiers in @Mr Latte’s hardware thread. Following his recommendations, I found the Behringer NX3000D two-channel DSP amplifiers to do an excellent job driving the larger LFE transducers.

The iNuke NU6000 DSP has been superseded by the NX6000D, but is much more power than you need for the LFEs.
 
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Came here to say thanks to you guys for the simhub files and insight to tactile using the BKG2.
Long time lurker on these forums and only got a rig in July. Moneys tight and I always thought id have to wait for a tactile set up but got offered a 2nd hand Gamer2 really cheap.

I initially thought it was broken it was shaking so bad. I took your advice and loaded a few of the profiles and tweaked one to my liking. Loving running over apex curbs and that spine tingling reward.

What a difference it makes so thanks.
 
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Lack of recent posts in this thread from me as I have not had tactile operating since June.

Got a good portion of my rig build done by Sept only to find an issue that I wasn't so happy with.
So here I am in December with more materials, starting a new rebuild of the rig's main base structure.

At some point, I will come back to doing some new effects that work well on the BK Gamer based on using all the new hardware I bought. Those toys will help me improve or understand more how frequencies and harmonics are being generated and to make effects that can operate better.

It would be good though to see more people not being afraid to share their own profiles they use for different sims. That alone will help inspire others and let us find different effects we can create our own combinations from.
 
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Hi there, very interesting.
Following Mr Latte many post I decided to go with the BK LFE (seat) + a BK gamer2 (pedals) using the NX3000D amp. + one additional BK gamer2 close to the pedals also and driven with a Nobsound G2, now using Simhub.

For the NX3000D amp, I guess I will have to be careful and set all the correct max. watts & ohms according to the specs of each devices + the frequency that might cause the piston pang in both units?

Hey Mr Latte, did you already gave those setting in a recent post?

All in all I cant wait to try the LFE & NX3000D. As for my previous experiences what I was using till now was (3) BK gamer2 with the original amps and remotes driven with Simvibe. To be honest, I thought it was always difficult to re-create the same sound after and after and the BK was clipping alot randomly, I really think it was a combination of the kicker location / installation (could of been improved) - the original amp (bad volume control & weird overheating prob?) - simvibe (not so consistent in volume control I also thought).

So far, the Gamer2 + Nobsound G2 + Simhub + good location = just with one gamer2 installed it almost feels like Im driven the (3) of them, plus it seems move vibrant and detailed, curious to see what the NX3000D amp will bring. Also, I need to look into Mr Latte layered setup in Simhub, seems very capable indeed.

Cheers,
And thank you much !
 
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Hi there, very interesting.
Following Mr Latte many post I decided to go with the BK LFE (seat) + a BK gamer2 (pedals) using the NX3000D amp. + one additional BK gamer2 close to the pedals also and driven with a Nobsound G2, now using Simhub.

For the NX3000D amp, I guess I will have to be careful and set all the correct max. watts & ohms according to the specs of each devices + the frequency that might cause the piston pang in both units?

Hey Mr Latte, did you already gave those setting in a recent post?

All in all I cant wait to try the LFE & NX3000D. As for my previous experiences what I was using till now was (3) BK gamer2 with the original amps and remotes driven with Simvibe. To be honest, I thought it was always difficult to re-create the same sound after and after and the BK was clipping alot randomly, I really think it was a combination of the kicker location / installation (could of been improved) - the original amp (bad volume control & weird overheating prob?) - simvibe (not so consistent in volume control I also thought).

So far, the Gamer2 + Nobsound G2 + Simhub + good location = just with one gamer2 installed it almost feels like Im driven the (3) of them, plus it seems move vibrant and detailed, curious to see what the NX3000D amp will bring. Also, I need to look into Mr Latte layered setup in Simhub, seems very capable indeed.

Cheers,
And thank you much !

(See links on the first post of the general tactile thread)

A common issue with Mini BK (inc Gamer2) is with the piston pang. This is due to the units having characteristics in their audio output with a peak/spike @35Hz.

This can happen on the larger models too (if driven hard) but IIRC it's more in the 22-25Hz range with those.
Trying to do what SimXperience did in 2012 with adding cheapo acoustic foam, (SE Editions) won't be a good /long-term solution as the foam eventually disintegrates with the piston.

You will find some people who have done rather questionable mods, to reduce the pang of the piston. My advice is not to alter the unit as it will likely impact its performance/operation in other negative ways. The key was seeking to learn what was the cause and how it could be tamed and removed from the units operation.

All we need to do is apply an EQ filter to reduce the dB of those (peak/spike frequencies).
Unlike "volume" that adjusts the full dynamic range (altering all frequencies the same). We are seeking to adjust the dB of "amplitude" to reduce/increase the energy (dB) within "specific frequencies". This modifies the character output of the transducer. It also can be useful to reduce/remove resonance (buzzing) within rig materials as different materials will resonate at different frequencies. If we find the frequency causing the resonance issue we can lower its dB too.

This can be done by what is called PEQ (Parametric Eq)
Unlike conventional DEQ (Dynamic Eq) that has fixed frequency sliders.

The difference with PEQ is that it lets the user pinpoint any exact frequencies to adjust different EQ bands.
You then, determine the "Q" (Quality factor) which alters how thin/wide the EQ alteration will affect neighboring frequencies. Any decent PEQ software will visually let the user see what settings are doing and really it is not that hard to grasp.

The Behringer software is quite clean and uncluttered for the NXD amps.
If you also set a crossover you can boost the curve of certain frequencies (up to +12dB) but also adjust the curve so you eliminate frequencies from being generated via levels of (-dB) . Setting a curve can give a smooth transition over frequencies. Some people try to use multiple PEQ adjustments to achieve a curve but really we should use the PEQ to address/pinpoint specific boosts/cuts we want within the set curve.

Also by lowering the number of effects going to the unit or lowering the crossover for the unit will help it from overheating.

People fall into the trap that they think, the settings for Hz they place in Simhub or Simvibe are the only frequencies that are generated. This is not how audio works as natural harmonics are generated too.
 
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Just set up a Buttkicker Simulation kit with SimHub and kind of took some parts the wonderful Mr. Latte's profile that he shared. I'm still playing around with what is available and how I can feel different effects, so am not qualified to give much of an opinion yet. However, this is great. I should have jumped on this ship earlier. It is a lot of fun just playing with the different settings to see what I like. The SimHub software has been pretty intuitive for me and simple to use so far. I'll share some profiles once I get comfortable building profiles I like in a way I can explain to others. Seems like a great affordable option that you just don't know what you are missing until you have tried it. But that may lead you to a rabbit whole. For example. Mr. Latte's project is quite the project and I have learned a lot just reading his updates. However, while interested where that rabbit whole leads, I can't see myself taking that journey myself and love to live viciously through him.
 
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Just set up a Buttkicker Simulation kit with SimHub and kind of took some parts the wonderful Mr. Latte's profile that he shared. I'm still playing around with what is available and how I can feel different effects, so am not qualified to give much of an opinion yet. However, this is great. I should have jumped on this ship earlier. It is a lot of fun just playing with the different settings to see what I like. The SimHub software has been pretty intuitive for me and simple to use so far. I'll share some profiles once I get comfortable building profiles I like in a way I can explain to others. Seems like a great affordable option that you just don't know what you are missing until you have tried it. But that may lead you to a rabbit whole. For example. Mr. Latte's project is quite the project and I have learned a lot just reading his updates. However, while interested where that rabbit whole leads, I can't see myself taking that journey myself and love to live viciously through him.

What I shared here was still quite basic, it was just meant as a point to get others into doing and sharing their own effects. People should play around at their leisure and try to find nice effect combinations. Some may be more interested in engine based sensations, others more on feeling what the car is doing with its handling.

It's hard to be fair to try to get a single transducer unit to do both satisfactorily as engine effects can be quite constant and demanding.

As for the rabbit hole ummmmm.
Well in 2020 and in 2021 I am going deeper than I ever have (still much to learn myself).
Currently I am testing what is possible with some of my latest purchased hardware and specialist audio software tools.
 
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What I shared here was still quite basic, it was just meant as a point to get others into doing and sharing their own effects. People should play around at their leisure and try to find nice effect combinations. Some may be more interested in engine based sensations, others more on feeling what the car is doing with its handling.

It's hard to be fair to try to get a single transducer unit to do both satisfactorily as engine effects can be quite constant and demanding.

As for the rabbit hole ummmmm.
Well in 2020 and in 2021 I am going deeper than I ever have (still much to learn myself).
Currently I am testing what is possible with some of my latest purchased hardware and specialist audio software tools.

Hey Mr Latte, just finished installing my NX3000D & big LFE. Would you be kind enough to share some of your low effect setting in simhub / NX software? Id like to start experimenting and figure out with some example.

Btw, to get the LFE really going I have to crank almost to max 900w the front volume knob (which is what the amp max. can deliver at 4ohms setting peak at 900w) I would believe it makes sense since this LFE need a min. of 400w but could be driven at 1500w max. Well, at 900w so far it does not clip, sound card volume at 75% max simhub effect at 80% vol.

Thanks,
Cheers!
 
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Well done man, perhaps if you can edit/copy/place this post in the general tactile thread.
It's best we keep this thread more about the BK Gamer.

Currently, two other people on the forums are just about to go with the same amp and dual large BK setup.
I have suggested a new thread be created and would be willing to discuss or try to arrange each person to commit to such a thread.

Then each of you can show their rigs to discuss installation, isolation, amp configuration, and have an actual conversation about preferences and ideas on effects. What we need is a thread in relation to these amps that then makes an easy starting point for others in the future. Yet I would prefer such to have user examples and input.

Note the knobs on the front of the NX3000D are to control only the input level of the source.
The output gain level is set via the DSP software and frequency boosts of up to 12dB within the crossover.
You will not need the front dials beyond12-2pm positions when you have the amp configured by the recommendations I offer.
 
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Ok understood relating to the gain via DSP, thats what I thought.
I was still posting here because my setup going to be a single LFE at seat + 2 BK gamer in the pedal region (One driven with the NX along the LFE and one with a small nobsound G2 amp which so far does a great job !)

Youll probably laught at my rig, hehe. It is an hybrid setting, a nicely done wooded frame for front (steering & pedal) + my sofa with a racing seat on to complete the majesty :)

Cheers
 
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First post here, I`ve been researching loads and see how much you contribute to the community Mr Latte, massive respect to you!

I have tweaked your setup for use with GPL Ferrari 312 in Assetto corsa.

Details:

Frame - GT Omega apex with rear seat frame
Single ButtkickerGamer2 mounted to rear of frame.
Low cut off
High cut off
Simhub soundcard volume - 75%
Buttkicker amp green light faint during use, sometimes red clip light flickers very faintly.

Overall I adjusted some of the frequencies (mainly the lower stuff) as it was resonating my rig somewhat and creating s few unpleasant rattles, this I believe is entirely down to isolation/setup etc.

I also dialled volumes down in a few areas.

Anyway, if anyone wants to give this a whirl and offer any areas for improvement.
Overall I`m quite happy with the feel, although subtle gives some quite nice tactile feedback during driving/racing.
A few further tweaks and I may settle on this until I can work on isolation of my righ/eliminating various rattles etc.

Thank you for this thread and for the bassline setup.

!EDIT!
Tweaked a few things and feels so much better!
 

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  • Assetto Corsa - RD Forums _ BK GAMER - AC - Mr Latte Setup Mod_ Skiddychop Ferrari 312 GPL_v2.txt
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Quick question, I have just removed my buttkicker to try and find the source of the rattles and eliminate, I had the pc playing a 10hz test tone and I noticed flipping the unit upside down completely got rid of the rattle.
What is the downside (pun intended) to mounting a buttkicker upside down?
 
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Quick question, I have just removed my buttkicker to try and find the source of the rattles and eliminate, I had the pc playing a 10hz test tone and I noticed flipping the unit upside down completely got rid of the rattle.
What is the downside (pun intended) to mounting a buttkicker upside down?

Do you have a picture of your BK gamer installed to your frame? Having play with the location of mine I can tell you it makes a huge difference.. Do you use the original amp?
Thanks
 
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Do you have a picture of your BK gamer installed to your frame? Having play with the location of mine I can tell you it makes a huge difference.. Do you use the original amp?
Thanks

Yes, I am using the amp that came with the buttkicker2....
I orignally had it mounted in the cross bar just beneath the seat sideways.
I now have it mounted on a socket bolted to the lower bar.
(Please excuse the cheapo foam, I`m experimenting!)

The interesting thing with this frame is that some of the effects in the higher frequency range travel into the pedals and sometimes up to the wheel :)
 

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With Mini BK or Gamer units if you want to try

Lower the 30Hz band a notch or two
Increase 60 &120 bands a notch or two
Drop to the bottom any bands over 120

This may help a bit with piston pang and also help to feel better some Hz above the 40Hz peak.

Its also using the EQ to act a bit like a filter to remove the higher generated harmonic frequencies these units wont have much use with.
 
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