AC Try out vintage cars championship@Bremgarten, Tuesday 28th September 2021

[Shed 17]

You're making steady progress, Paul. Very impressive ! Your recent results are now better than mine. For me you are a great example of what I was aiming for when I started organizing the Multiclass Wednesday events. To help new and inexperienced drivers in online racing get and stay excited so that they feel more confident and get better while still having fun. And now willing to try out other combo's to learn even more.

Thanks Han, your vision and this community is exactly what I was looking for when I got fed up with public server wreckfests.
As for recent results, well I have had a bit of luck but I guess you have to be in it to win it as they say! Just got to find those small improvements and extras tenths to maintain consistency.

 

[Kek700]

@HF2000 The mini was never going to beat the Porsche or Skoda here, or probably at any circuit.

I have done a 2:39:00 here in the mini, with the impression that a 38 was easily on the cards.
Just had one of those races were one second disappeared. so it has reasonably good pace.?

Considering I spent a lot of time stopped in this race, I found the mini could hold its own around here with the Porsche and Skoda.
Given the opportunity to have a reasonably clean race it would have been great to be snapping at their “heels”. admittedly over taking all the “shoe” may have been a bridge too far.
So I hope you will not discount the mini.

 

[Programmer_Rich]

That makes sense, @Programmer_Rich, now you describe how you tried to serve the drive-through. If you take a look at the image below showing the physical objects that make up the pit area, it might explain the problem:

View attachment 506160
The area marked "2" is the pit lane, and must be driven through for AC to recognise that you have carried out your penalty.

Areas "1", "3" and "4" are simply tarmac areas that are neither valid track surface nor pit lane. If "4" was also pitlane, each time your wheels encroached on this area, the pit lane limiter kicks in and the pit menu appears on-screen. I guess I could add a row of hay bales or some red/white ticker-tape across the entrance to encourage you to stay to the right of the white line on pit entry.

The problem with the pit boxes not showing up until the last minute is related to the length of the pit lane. The red pit areas don't show up until you enter the pit lane marked "2", but the limiter kicks in as soon as you leave "3" and enter "2". If I made the pit deceleration section "3" shorter, you risk your wheels locking up as soon as you leave the racing line. I figured it would be better to give people the chance to decelerate in a controlled manner and have less time for their pit area to appear. It's not really an issue for the later pit boxes, but if you're in the first few boxes, I agree, you don't get much warning of where to pull up.

Thanks again for the kind words

David, thanks for the background info and image, really interesting and as I suspected all carefully thought through and considered on your part.

In an attempt to make a constructive suggestion, looking at the image I do wonder if perhaps having the line dividing areas 2/3 slanting back would work better and similar between 1/2. At the extreme perhaps you could even then do away with the 'extra' area 4 (just making it all part of 2). As hopefully shown by this quick mockup:

But definitely not trying to teach you to 'suck eggs' just trying to help improve a brilliant track further if possible.

Perhaps worth adding that I haven't experienced AC 'locking the wheels' going into the pit speed limit area so I don't think that would be a problem. Plus I have also noticed a 'quirk' in the pit lane here that, I now assume is due to area 4, where the pit limiter goes off and back on again as you drive out (I think because I drive across part of area 4 from my early pit box. Again just comments certainly not complaints.

 

[HF2000]

@HF2000 The mini was never going to beat the Porsche or Skoda here, or probably at any circuit.

I have done a 2:39:00 here in the mini, with the impression that a 38 was easily on the cards.
Just had one of those races were one second disappeared. so it has reasonably good pace.?

Considering I spent a lot of time stopped in this race, I found the mini could hold its own around here with the Porsche and Skoda.
Given the opportunity to have a reasonably clean race it would have been great to be snapping at their “heels”. admittedly over taking all the “shoe” may have been a bridge too far.
So I hope you will not discount the mini.

Hi Ernie,

Thanks. 2.39.0 That is good news! That is 2s off my PB!
I wasn't going to skip the Mini. I was thinking of a multiclass (GTA,718,Skoda and Mini + other car). But I'm quite happy to leave all four cars in one class if you think it's not too slow and that there will be other drivers that will choose it in an upcoming championship. But let's first see how it turns out on the Deutschlandring. I'm counting on you to drive the Mini there again then.

 

[Simon Swarbrick]

Those Skoda lap times... Just wow! I was 11 seconds off the pace, I know I'm a little rusty having taken a few years out with SIM racing AND I'm getting on a bit now, but 11 seconds...

 

[HF2000]

Those Skoda lap times... Just how! I was 11 seconds off the pace, I know I'm a little rusty having taken a few years out with SIM racing AND I'm getting on a bit now, but 11 seconds...

Hi Simon,

May I suggest to join tonight's multiclass event in the MX5? It's an easy car compared to the vintage cars but the same basics for being fast apply to it. And these events are very suited to get used to racing with others, handle blue flags and so on.

simracing.gp

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[Shed 17]

@HF2000 The mini was never going to beat the Porsche or Skoda here, or probably at any circuit.

I have done a 2:39:00 here in the mini, with the impression that a 38 was easily on the cards.
Just had one of those races were one second disappeared. so it has reasonably good pace.?

Considering I spent a lot of time stopped in this race, I found the mini could hold its own around here with the Porsche and Skoda.
Given the opportunity to have a reasonably clean race it would have been great to be snapping at their “heels”. admittedly over taking all the “shoe” may have been a bridge too far.
So I hope you will not discount the mini.

I think the Mini will be better on the twistier circuits, just like in real life and in my opinion the more variety of cars we have to chose from makes for more interesting racing.

You don't have to be in the fastest car or be up the front to have fun and like in the championship we have the the moment, the Alfa's are quicker and the champion is likely to be driving an Alfa at the the end.
But whatever car you are in you look for the next competitor in a similar car so if there are more classes you can still have the standard points table to find the overall winner but also at the end there will be the top Alfa, top Porsche, Skoda, Mini etc....... and class winners. makes it more of a competition further down the grid.

 

[HF2000]

I think the Mini will be better on the twistier circuits, just like in real life and in my opinion the more variety of cars we have to chose from makes for more interesting racing.

You don't have to be in the fastest car or be up the front to have fun and like in the championship we have the the moment, the Alfa's are quicker and the champion is likely to be driving an Alfa at the the end.
But whatever car you are in you look for the next competitor in a similar car so if there are more classes you can still have the standard points table to find the overall winner but also at the end there will be the top Alfa, top Porsche, Skoda, Mini etc....... and class winners. makes it more of a competition further down the grid.

Ok, so Goodwood will be on the list of tracks for the next Vintage Championship .

But elaborating on your post: it is possible to make it a championship with 4 classes but I'm afraid we end up with one or two classes with very few participants.

 

[Kek700]

Absolutely agree Paul, I knew the mini was going to be the slowest here, did not stop me from enjoying myself in this wee beasty.
Just been on the online server, managed a 2-39 after a lot of fiddling with the setup, so I don't think, as you have just said, it is that far off the pace to have some great midfield battles.

I will certainly stick with it, just trying to convince Han to keep it in the championship.

Just noticed on the online server two wheels off is an invalid lap, and it was just that, any more and it would have been in the fence?

 

[Shed 17]

Ok, so Goodwood will be on the list of tracks for the next Vintage Championship .

But elaborating on your post: it is possible to make it a championship with 4 classes but I'm afraid we end up with one or two classes with very few participants.

I agree Han, the more you water it down the fewer competitors we will get, that’s why it’s best to let people choose their weapon and race amongst themselves.

 

[Kek700]

Save the mini.



Let’s hope it is in with the other cars, we need the mini.

 

[HF2000]

Save the mini.

View attachment 506351

Let’s hope it is in with the other cars, we need the mini.

I'll try the Skippy to see if it's a match for the Mini!

 

[gearwhine]

Hello fellow sim racers . Seriously, i want to thank everybody who organised and took part in what for me seemed like a very successful event. Apart from the already mentioned start i cannot fault the event and apart from one avoidable incident in which i was NOT hit by a certain Porsche, but avoiding the obvious launched me into the central park which i must say is a nice place to be! Especially nice to have the track designer race with us on his track. Thank you for many atmospheric beautiful tracks David of which this one may be my favourite, just. I have lots of miles on this track and find the pit area works fine as it did for me on my drive through the other night and have got used to the section 4 on the map which really is fine if one uses the proper but slower exit out of the pits. I have had the Skoda on my hard drive for ages and ignored it and the races it is used in. I was wrong, what a fun car.

 

[Fat-Alfie]

Was that you that I bumped into? Should I have stopped and waited for you? I have only ever done maybe 3 or 4 races online and really wasn't sure of the rules. I asked (over the voice chat) just after it happened but no one responded.

I'm really sorry if I ruined your race This is why I race off line against the AI, as it doesn't matter if I spoil their race

EDIT - I just found that I had the entire replay saved. I think this is what happened...

 

[JamKart22]

What an honour having the track designer racing with us. I had the pleasure of being overtaken by you

I'm interested to know if you have any influence on how the AI drives on your tracks? Do you do lots of race testing with AI to see how they behave and is there anything you can do in the track to improve AI behaviour?

Whenever I've driven on this track with AI they seem particularly crazy and I'm not sure how they keep it on the track!

 

[Fat-Alfie]

The honour was all mine, seriously. As I said, I very rarely race online so Tuesday night was quite special for me, and I couldn't have picked a nicer bunch of people to have experienced it with

Yes, I do have a certain amount of control over how the AI drive round the circuit, but unfortunately, part of their behaviour also comes from the car itself. I design the racing line that they take, and I can also 'encourage' the AI to either be more or less cautious at certain parts of the track, to brake harder, or later, to take certain corners faster than they think they should (i.e. if a corner has unusually high camber I can tell them to take it 15% faster than they think they should).

All these instructions are written in the track's ai_hints.ini file, in the track's data folder, so can be edited by any user without it causing a checksum error (I think). I have to do lots of testing against the AI to try and get their performance as good as possible. Some cars are better than others, but I always try my best to make the offline racing as fun / challenging as possible.

 

[stigs2cousin]

Whenever I've driven on this track with AI they seem particularly crazy and I'm not sure how they keep it on the track!

Well, they don´t

They play "bumper car" with the track limits

MFG Carsten

 

[stigs2cousin]

The honour was all mine, seriously. As I said, I very rarely race online so Tuesday night was quite special for me, and I couldn't have picked a nicer bunch of people to have experienced it with

Yes, I do have a certain amount of control over how the AI drive round the circuit, but unfortunately, part of their behaviour also comes from the car itself. I design the racing line that they take, and I can also 'encourage' the AI to either be more or less cautious at certain parts of the track, to brake harder, or later, to take certain corners faster than they think they should (i.e. if a corner has unusually high camber I can tell them to take it 15% faster than they think they should).

All these instructions are written in the track's ai_hints.ini file, in the track's data folder, so can be edited by any user without it causing a checksum error (I think). I have to do lots of testing against the AI to try and get their performance as good as possible. Some cars are better than others, but I always try my best to make the offline racing as fun / challenging as possible.

Is there a way to keep several cars from " leisurely cruising around"
Sometimes they do laps with 30 mph

AI strength 95-100%
agression 70-100%

MFG Carsten

 

[JamKart22]

The honour was all mine, seriously. As I said, I very rarely race online so Tuesday night was quite special for me, and I couldn't have picked a nicer bunch of people to have experienced it with

Yes, I do have a certain amount of control over how the AI drive round the circuit, but unfortunately, part of their behaviour also comes from the car itself. I design the racing line that they take, and I can also 'encourage' the AI to either be more or less cautious at certain parts of the track, to brake harder, or later, to take certain corners faster than they think they should (i.e. if a corner has unusually high camber I can tell them to take it 15% faster than they think they should).

All these instructions are written in the track's ai_hints.ini file, in the track's data folder, so can be edited by any user without it causing a checksum error (I think). I have to do lots of testing against the AI to try and get their performance as good as possible. Some cars are better than others, but I always try my best to make the offline racing as fun / challenging as possible.

That's interesting to know. Perhaps some of our aliens could help tune the AI so they match the fasted time possible and make them a bit more predictable?

 

[Allan Ramsbottom]

I think looking at that video you wer,nt at fault David,Skoda is off the track before your coming together, a slight lift or tap on the brakes would have avoided that..