Tactile Immersion - General Discussion - Hardware & Software

[stigs2cousin]

Just a little addendum:

the type and power of the amp for tactile DOES matter.

I have swapped out the rag tag bundle of audio amps ( both nominally over 50 watts and so powerfull enough for my transducers) against an almost as old Yamaha 5.1 receiver with 85 watts at 8 ohm.

That makes quite a difference, especially the Puck in the backrest and the Aurasound under the seat really come to live.

So If you are ready to take a gamble on an AV Receiver with 5.1 analog input, I think they are well suited for the job.
( A gamble because most of them are around 20 years old, but can be had quite cheap.
My smaller receiver for game audio was 75€, on the bigger Yamaha I took a gamble because it was missing the right plug and i couldn´t test at the sellers house, that went for 20€.)

The gamble paid of, this thing has oomph
Lets see how long it lasts.

MFG Carsten

 

[FredAZ]

the type and power of the amp for tactile DOES matter.

Yes it does and and AVR suited for 8-Ohm speakers is probably a bad fit.

Low frequency drivers take CURRENT to drive.
This is why they are always 4-ohms or less.

ButtKickers at 2-Ohms are not going to do well with an AVR that wants 8-Ohms and only tolerates 6-Ohms transducers.

You may get lucky.
But minimum speaker output impedance is a real spec. that shouldn't be ignored.

 

[stigs2cousin]

Well, we´ll see.

The transducers are rated 40 to 50watts at 4ohm, the amp delivers 170watts at 4 ohm
(impuls rated.) should give me a little headroom.

And if the amp fries I lost 20€ and the fuel for 50km.

I could live with that

MFG Carsten

 

[bigkid66]

Corbeau has mounting holes at the bottom, just cut a board to mount using theses 4 holes and attach transducers to it.

Thanks! Took the seat off tonight and hoping to cut a piece of plywood tomorrow

 

[miwashi]

Has anyone seen these 'mega bass' versions?
Dayton Audio DAEX32QMB-4 Quad Feet Mega Bass 32mm Exciter 40W 4 Ohm

Anyway, how do these small ones perform compared to the standard dayton tt25 puck?

 

[stigs2cousin]

.

The DAEX32EP4 are on my pedals (Heusinkveld Sprint), the Puck is IN the lumbar support of my (road car) Recaro Sportster.

I would guesstimate that the Puck is the weaker of the two.
And the DAEX32EP has a smaller footprint which makes it easier to mount ( just stick it on)

I think @blekenbleu had are more scientific comparison in this thread earlier on.

MFG Carsten

 

[blekenbleu]

comparison in this thread

Actually in another thread (which also addressed Visaton BS 130 and DAEX30HESF-4):

Dayton Audio DAEX32EP thruster vs TT25 puck​

Bottom line: all other things being equal (which they rarely are) DAEX30HESF-4 has IMO more useful low frequency output and requires a smaller attachment area than DAEX32EP, much less TT25-16 puck.

My guess is that the DAEX32QMB-4 will perform more similarly to DAEX30HESF-4 and better than DAEX32EP, which uses spring steel suspension for controlling voice coil alignment more compactly than external arms of DAEX32QMB-4. Any of these are more effective than a puck when attached to something with not too much mass, while TT25-16 pucks are good when simply inserted in foam cushions. e.g. ShakeSeat.

Appreciably moving something as massive as a seat and driver much below 100Hz wants real bass shakers, rather than these exciters,
but they can deliver occasional useful 40-60Hz localized tactile cues, but trying to e.g. constantly simulate strong engine and/or road vibrations can burn them out.

 

[SpeedyBanana]

I think the amp is underpowered for the shakers you want, the amp is rated for 50w at 4ohm per channel and that power supply only giving 90W so you going to have about 40W per speaker (based on 2 shakers and taking in account for power loss to heat) which is not enough for the AST-2B-4 .

I have the Fosi BT20A with outputs 100W per channel at 4Ohm - which migh be a better option for you

Thanks for the info!
For the (4) AST-2B-4 50w speakers (1 on each of the 4 corners of my rig)

I adjusted my order to (2) of these amps:

• Model Name: ZK-1002T Almost same as the FT20A but without the enclosure. I am retired so I'm watching every penny these days. Times 2 units it shaves about $46 total off.

100W x 2 Bluetooth audio amplifier module with Tone & BT 5.0

Fosi Audio ZK1002T Bluetooth Treble and Bass Adjustment Subwoofer Amplifier Board Channel Power Audio Stereo Bass AMP

Fosi Audio ZK-1002T Bluetooth Treble and Bass Adjustment Subwoofer Amplifier Board Channel High Power Audio Stereo Bass AMP

fosiaudio.com

and (2) of these power supplies: Size: 24V 4.5A

24V 5A 6A 8A Power supply for TDA7498E TPA3116 TAS5613 Amplifier

AC110V-230V input; DC 24V 4.5A 6A 8A output; Connector size: 5.5*2.5mm Power adapter for class d amplifier;

fosiaudio.com

Hopefully it will work
Thanks again for the advice to increase the power capability.

 

[Brutal Deluxe]

I've not been active on here for a while but wanted to check-in.

I came across these 3M VHB pre-cut circles (38mm). Ideal for anyone looking to move or relocate their Dayton Audio DAEX32EP-4 Exciters (company is UK based):

3M VHB GPH110GF Circles 100 Circles per Roll – Viking Industrial Products Ltd

3M VHB Circles available in a range of diameters and are sold in rolls of 100 circles. Our circles are made with 3M™ VHB GPH which is a grey conformable double coated acrylic foam tape. Its high temperature performance enables bonding of materials in applications with high operating temperatures...

www.vikingtapes.co.uk

Hope that's of help to someone out there.

 

[Klingomucingo]

Update 20.06.2021

I'm about to enter the world of tactile immersion and as typical male hunter, I have purchased stuff before knowing how to use it, but after reading (and more and more understanding) big parts of this thread (which I wish it would be downloadable) I feel like I am not so far off my goal of a diversified tactile immersion experience of my motion racing rig.

Currently I have amassed:

2 x Buttkicker LFE
4 x AuraSound AST-2B-4 Pro Bass Shaker
4 x Buttkicker mini LFE
2 x Reckhorn BS200i
1 x Earthquake Q10B

1 x ButtKicker BKA1000-4A
1 x Fame Quad 4150 Amp
1 x Nobsound Mini 200 W

1 x CREATIVE Sound Blaster Z SE
1 x LogiLink USB Sound Box (7.1 Surround)
1 x Creative SoundBlaster X3

On my purchase list is either a TST Gold or Platinum transducer and some Dayton DAEX32EP-4s as well as a Amp similar to the Behringer NX3000D with DSP - but quiet and very important - a effective isolation system for the bass shakers/transducers.

What I want to achieve is multiple tactile effects with equipment that operates quiet (so no noisy amp fans etc) and a tactile immersion that adds to my personal racing experience only without sharing it with the neighbours

I am still not yet finished reading through the 204 pages here and also of related threads, but hope by then I have enough expertise to figure things out myself, in the meantime any suggestions on how my setup should look like for my goal etc are very much welcome!

 

[Chipless]

My apologies if this should be asked somewhere less general, but I'm just switching over from Game Vibe within Sim Tools to SimHub, and can't find a SimHub support thread on here.

I am trying to replicate the RPM effect I can get with Game Vibe within SimHub and it seems like the built-in RPM effect in SimHub isn't doing the trick. It feels like I need to adjust not only the volume/gain based on RPM (which SimHub allows easily with the custom curve, which is great), but I also need to adjust the ramp up of the actual frequency (e.g. Hz). It feels like the frequency does not ascend in linear fashion with the RPMs. Is there a way to accomplish this within SimHub?

 

[EsxPaul]

@Chipless Have you taken a look a playing with the effects configuration. There's a section about halfway down the page that shows how to adjust response curves to your liking.

 

[blekenbleu]

can't find a SimHub support thread on here

That is, indeed, a SimHub weakness. Owner @Wotever is most often on Discord,
although he also has this support forum and this Wiki.
While there is plenty of SimHub-related information here and elsewhere, finding it wants
some proficiency with various search tools and techniques and identifying best key words.

 

[Fosgatt]

Hi Everyone,

My rig came with a Dayton SA100 and a TST 209 under the seat. I've recently replaced the TST209 with the TST429 and it feels great.

What would be the recommended place to install the TST209, if I were to have both working together? I was thinking maybe under the pedals, but not sure.

Also - would the Dayton be capable or handling both?

I am using the Simvibe software and have the effects of the engine vibration, gear change, impacts and road texture.

Any advice is appreciated.

Thanks

 

[stigs2cousin]

Heel plate exciter worth it?

As I had a channel available on my amp and an BST-2 lying around I did some tinkering with "exciting" my heel plate.

I used some 12mm wood composit board ( Siebdruckplatte in German) in the first iteration only isolated from the DIY aluminium rig by double 6mm rubber strips.

The felt vibration was underwhelming and a buzzing noise disturbed me.
The thought was then that the vibrations were "escaping" into the aluminium frame.
Dialling it up was not an option as I have a "pesky neighbour"

Then I took some pains to isolate the heel plate from the aluminium with stacked up rubber isolators which are quite soft, i can easyly bend them by hand.
Though the heel plate moves around when moving my feet the feeling is still not very satiesfiing. The board is vibrating quite strongly, it just doesnt´t add that much to the driving experience.


For explanation:

I use an AST-2B4 basshaker directly under my seat cushion for road information and gear shift, a Dayton Puck in the backrest for gearshift and rpms and two DAEX32EP-4 on brake and throttle pedal for wheel lock/slip.
The pedal exciters are the most usefull for driving, rpms are used as a "shiftbuzzer" instead of shift lights.
The road impact/vibration ( at least in Asseto Corsa) add a little to the immersion but don´t help immensely with the driving/positioning of the car.
(Disclosure: wheelbase is SC2. So this relays more and better info than the basshakers)

Had I known up front I wouldn´t have bothered with the shaker under the heelplate, it adds little to the experience.
It might be worth your while if your still on a belt drive wheel base or want the most out of your equipment since the whole basshaker update was way cheaper that the upgrade to a DD wheel. ( all around cost about 350€ with a used 5.1 amp for power.)

MFG Carsten

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Funny as I've come to the same conclusion, the only effect that I really feel from transducers under pedal plate is the one that is transmitted through the frame to the seat, could as well just bolted them to the seat for more impact.
Well, guess they called Butt kickers for a reason.

 

[RCHeliguy]

I like feeling my front wheels starting to slide under my foot plate and I have some other effects coming through. This needs to be separate from feeling my rear wheels sliding with the Concert on my seat.

However, if I bare down on the brake and lift my heel, I don't feel the vibrations any more.

I tried adding another transducer attached to my pedals so I would still feel it if I lifted my heal and for me that was too much. I liked being able to decide how much I felt depending on the situation.

Obviously this is a personal thing, and you need to find what works for you.

 

[stigs2cousin]

As stated above wheel slip and lock can be indicated with small exciters on the pedals.
I like this approach because the different driving situations are divided between the appliances:

wheel slip from steering comes from the wheel ( as in real life)
wheel slip by engine comes into the accelerator and
wheelslip by braking into the brake pedal.

My "doesn´t cut it" remark refers only to the road surface feedback through the heel plate.


As you said, it takes some experimentation to find your personal preferences.
And the exchange with likeminded to discover new ways "to skin the cat"



MFG Carsten

 

[RCHeliguy]

wheel slip from steering comes from the wheel ( as in real life)
wheel slip by engine comes into the accelerator and
wheelslip by braking into the brake pedal.

I understand the logic behind that, but I still like feeling the rear wheels slide at the back and the front wheel slide at the front. Different strokes.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

In real car, is there really anything coming through the pedals besides ABS pulsation and locking/unlocking with non ABS ones?