Season 11 - General Discussion

[Sean Greenlaw]

Im sure you will have some great racing here and welcome Johan

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

F3000s is more sharp and unforgiving than Formula Masters. Different grip, less downforce and the suspension is pretty stiff. It turns where you sit, not at the front, if that gives you right mental image. More rear slips expected, drivng with throttle but you get better sensitivity in steering and control is better too. A bit more demanding but not a t all a huge step, takes one or two days at most.

A lot difference comes from different layout, IFM is long and narrow, F3000 is wide and short. IFM has less contact patch due to narrower tires but more grip and F3000 has nice wider shape contact patch between tire and road with more realistic tires. I started with IFM too, went to F1 and now we are on F3000. Out of those three, the current format is the most enjoyable and i think that it benefits me the most too.

EDIT: yeah, more torque and power too.

 

[Helder Filipe]

Maybe off-topic...but just to share with you...a few days ago, i showed a video of MMG F1 onboard at Hungaroring and Monaco to a friend loool it looks easy and we make it seems easy really, he was simply impressed with the speed and reactions of the car, with Monaco was impressed how we can manage it so fast around the walls, but, he gaped, with the curve 4 at Hungaroring, spontaneous change direction to the left and very direct steering he was like "awesome"!

After they i give to him a wheel loool with F3000... I do not need to tell you guys what happened, then...

Also showed the Marko's video compilation of Season10 ehehe

Welcome Johan!

 

[Johan Meuris]

First of all: thanks for the WARM welcome guys, really appreciate it. I'll place lots and lots of (stupid) questions so you all have been warned

Also, I have an old wheel: a formula force ex,

As you can see, no clutch. Is it manageable for this kind of cars or not? 'cause my brother is telling me to buy a new wheel. Though I drive it with the IFM cars but I must admit, it's sometimes difficult as it has a dead zone (then the wheel start turning slightly from left to right etc, mainly on the straights).

ps: I saw Marko's video too: awesome!

 

[Nicolai Nicholson]

You do not need a clutch Johan, I don't have one (I use Logitech Momo Racing Force Feedback)

 

[Johan Meuris]

You do not need a clutch Johan, I don't have one (I use Logitech Momo Racing Force Feedback)

thx

 

[Johan Meuris]

Ok I made a login on prestogp, now I need to post a time or something? So what do you need to do, drive and then, will it be posted automatically or do you need to input it somewhere?

ps: where to download the tracks?

ps2: the timesheet is a bit "not clear" to me on prestogp , don't get it atm, you have columns like vote1 etc.

 

[Helder Filipe]

Johan the PrestoGP servers will recognize you on the servers automatically if you join with the same Nickname as you Signed Up in the site! I think it's it...

The "vote" columns is some tracks we still dont decide which we will run lool

Download here: http://www.racedepartment.com/forum/threads/general-info.64079/

This topic is still with last Season (S10) tracks...maybe Nico or someone will update it soon, and you can download also the actually track of the server in the topic of the race, normally we create a topic with all the information, even about Race Tests, etc...

 

[Reik Major]

Welcome Johan! Have fun here.

 

[Nicolai Nicholson]

Download here: http://www.racedepartment.com/forum/threads/general-info.64079/

This topic is still with last Season (S10) tracks...maybe Nico or someone will update it soon,

Just updated it now. As you can see I am unsure of track choice for Spa and Hungaroring.

ps2: the timesheet is a bit "not clear" to me on prestogp , don't get it atm, you have columns like vote1 etc.

The time tables are not perfectly programmed, I'll be the first to admit that. Our next practice race is at Monza, so that is what we focus on now. The best laptime you do in a qualify session online on our servers will be displayed in the table. If you click on "Monza" it will sort the table with the fastest driver on top etc. Your name is now classified under what is named as FPES div 1 (red colour), so if you remove all checks except the one for FPES div 1 you will only see the times of the active league members.

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

Momo Black FTW! The most used wheel amongst champions of PrestoGP (hehe, statistics..)

IFM has an awful numb steering around the center... There are some tweaks in the controller.rcs that can take care of that. In F3000 i feel they are not necessary but if you must, find FFB sensitivity line and increase that. It changes the FFB force curve (it's not the same as steering sensitivity that changes the steering input curve) To have it more responsive in the middle, increase sensitivity (overdriving this will makes the wheel oscillate on straights and can very easily lead to clipping of force that leads loss of details) or decrease it (numb feeling but better feel on high forces) Reaching either limit might cause unexpected behavior like strong sudden jerks or drops in force... I did a lot of testing of those parameters and don't need to adjust for F3000 at all.

In the past i used 80/80 with heavily tweaked* controller.rcs file but now i use steering force (130%) and less overall FFB strength (68%) just to accentuate the actual steering column movement in the center but i may lose some details at the higher torque (for ex fast corners). Artficial FFB part of that equation should give me grip loss still (and it does, all i lose is the info if for ex 120% or 130% more load on either side on high speed corner, that's not a biggie because if i lose grip there, FFB will reduce the steering wheel motor torque and i'll get the message..) There are two different things, steering force is the actual steering column feedback what you get from real car and FFB is everything else like lessening torque when you lose grip. Too bad FFB as a term is used for.. well, i'll explain the difference (when will i learn to write short posts..)

Unfortunately in Race07 the FFB setting controls both the maximum force of artificial FFB effects (rumbles, grip loss, grip gain) and steering column. Play with those values, both ingame and don't forget windows settings (control panel, usb game controller, properties, advanced, easiest to find is use windows search "game controllers") but try to avoid combinations that'll go past 100%. All i can say that defaults are pretty darn good in this game

The order of importance is:
Windows setting is the actual maximum torque you can get from your wheels motor. You can cause clipping here, the usual settings are 101% (for those who enjoy mathematical nonsense**) or anything between 100% and 80%. For dampers and springs most use 0/1%, anything under 10%. Self centering spring activated but most use 0-10% on that too. And then the most important tickbox, let the game adjust FFB..
FFB strength in Race07 is the overall force of all effects, both artificial and simulated. Anything past 100% WILL cause clipping. Overall actual wheel motor torque will be a ratio of win force / game force. So while we took that tick box earlier, it'll still in calculation.. If you go past 100% the game will stop at 100 and discard values above so you can get clipping.
Steering force is simulated, "real" steering column movement. AFAIK, this is the only setting that you can tweak past 100% as it is a ratio, relative not absolute value. Again, this is just how i understood ot is that 100% steering force = 50% FFB + 50% steering force.. Everything else in this game works like that... R3e has this already "fixed"

EDIT: Clipping = trying to go past the maximum allowed value, whether it's real world as your motor can get any more voltage from the powersupply than it already does (should not happen but wouldn't be surpised if it happens..) or virtual as in "you can't have larger numbers than x.."

* Incr. sens, reverse damp&spring and friction, grip/mass transfer 7/3, front/rear4/6
* 101 is a primer number...

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

What about weather, is Daniel still doing them? If he is i would suggest dry weather temperature changes during the race. Using some sort of guestimation how the weather is in that part of the world and making just gradual changes; i would love that coming in to play a little bit more. For ex at the moment it's really hot in Hungary, we could've had 28C or even 30C qualy and similar in race (in race session temp always drop towards the end unless clouds are simulated too, in which case it can rise.....) That would mean manual dry weather creation with Autosim (analyzer) weather generator..It's really fast to make it, there's also suitable randomization for dry temp changes to adjust temps by couple of degrees and adjusting timing by few minutes. So with just one or two different base-weather files you could make changing temps for the whole season really fast. Then Daniel just chooses which one to use, he flips that magic coin and chooses wet, he does it like it is so far (slightly more favoring the drizzle..). If it th coin flips 100% dry then make it with ASA-WG...

It isn't huge risk to get a little bit more heat on the sessions, radiators and ducts come in to play too.. Warmup has to be roughly the same temps as race start.

 

[David Turnbull]

Also, I have an old wheel: a formula force ex,

i used to have the logitech driving force wheel, not ex version, but the only diffrence was the shape of the wheel, mine was more square than your round version. Logitech Driving Force

the oscillating left to right is caused by the force feedback being too high for the wheel to handle, race07 has alot of effects and the wheel has a limited number of effects it can produce.

try these settings.....

Logitech Profiler

overall - 100
spring - 0
damper - 0

enable centre spring
centre spring - 0

max degrees of rotation.

Race07 Settings

force feedback effects - medium
force feedback strength - 80-100 depending on personal feel
reverse effetcs - on
steering vibration - 0
engine - 12
brakes - 18
kurbs - 35
impact - 100

in the settings screen before the ffb where you set sensitivites, leave all at 50%, wheel and pedals, what i did to minimize the deadzone in the wheel was actually add some deadzone myself, i set it to 1 in the options, this may sound silly but it actually worked and the wheel became fairly decent until i got my g25, i still have the formula force and would use it again as a backup anytime.

hope this helps

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

Braking vibration becomes with high effect settings, engine with max. Neither are used at medium level.

 

[Henrik Jordfald Olsen]

Just wanted to say I am happy to be back after some turbulence in life.
Can't wait to get back into some racing with you guys.

 

[Reik Major]

Sounds good Henrik. So you may also join some of the pre-season test races? Would be good to get them crowded.

 

[Henrik Jordfald Olsen]

So you may also join some of the pre-season test races? Would be good to get them crowded.

Absolutely - I have not been "sim'ing" for about 6 months, so I definitely need to get back into the groove.

 

[Reik Major]

You will find the groove quickly again for sure.

 

[Henrik Jordfald Olsen]

Yeah, had a little go at Monza today - went pretty ok.

I am however looking for some F3000 setups.
Went through the posts and found some, but I bet there are some better setups out there.

Would be great if someone could post what the different settings do - I have no idea whatsoever.

E.g - to get better turn-in in corners - what settings should I alter?

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

Almost always softening/decreasing any parameter in race07 setup will increase grip and stiffening will increase control..I'll give my "checklist", this is the priority if i just want better turn in
Front antiroll bar is the usual first place to start when looking for just better turn in.
Caster decrease, front suspension softening, using negative Toe-in, dropping front ride height, decreasing differential coast, softening rear rebound values or softening front bound, Camber increase..

I think that covers the "checklist", the order varies from person to person, that's just what order i use.. But explaining what those do would take multiple pages.. Google is your best friend. I'll just give you one, toe-in as that causes the most confusions.

Remember when reading guides that most do not use toe-in values but instead toe-out (or both). Positive toe-in makes the car stable and hard to turn, negative toe-in is the same as positive toe-out: When in doubt, use your feet, when your toes are pointing in, that's positive toe-in, when they are pointing out, that's toe-out. All other terms are the same, just brought out the one that's constantly used differently depending who writes the guide.

Using your feet also explains what that setting does, when your toes are pointing out your car wants to turn, it really does not care which way it does so. Toe-in is the term used by Race07. This means positive turns tires inwards, negative outwards. Negative values makes the car turn, positive values turn the wheels inward and the car doesn't want to turn, it rather just plow on straight.

Both extremes will cause more tire wear. What i've seen from other drivers setup, they have slight positive toe-in that's unusual in racing but no doubt it's a compromise to give some inherent stability to otherwise twitchy and sensitive setup. "Civilian" cars use toe-in at front and rear.