BUILD LOG: Racing + Flying VR Rig

Callsign BH · Dec 31, 2020

Hello all! New sim racer here and looking to start a bit of a build log for a couple reasons:

It seems like you guys like this stuff like I do
Because I know I am going to need some guidance and input along the way

Before I get into the present and future of my build, first I'd like to briefly share a bit of background. I'm 100% new to sim racing (currently focusing on ACC only, as I love GT3 cars), but I'm not new to simming in general...

BACKGROUND

Around mid 2014 I heard about Digital Combat Simulator (DCS) and given I spent my entire adolescence wanting to be a fighter pilot (before the Navy told me the dream was dead due to me being red/green colorblind) it seemed like something that might be relevant to my interests. Boy was I right! As I assume most of you have experienced, I quickly fell down that peripheral rabbit hole. Said "rabbit hole" become more of a "black hole" that I was falling down at hyperspeed, and the rest is history. From one HOTAS to the next, I ended up becoming very enthralled with the high-end boutique peripherals. Over the ~6 years since I started on DCS, I've gone through waves of being on and off with playing - "off" times being mostly due to my career taking too much of my time and/or other personal life obligations - and I've ebbed and flowed with my level of seriousness with playing. I've joined virtual squadrons and fought in the SATAL league there, I've read military flight manuals front to back to learn more about operating the jets, etc. To this day I still retain a love and enjoyment for DCS, although I haven't played much the past year or so.

Around June of 2020, after years of thinking "I should get into sim racing" (and being told as much by some of my flight sim buddies), I started to get serious about it. Again, I fell down that rabbit hole and became determined to get a racing rig put together. The twist this time was that my wife and I were expecting our first child in July, and we had just bought a new home that was undergoing a lot of renovations...plus there was a small global pandemic going on. Not exactly optimal timing, but life rarely lines up perfectly, so I said "Screw it" and proceeded ahead anyway. With the learnings from my flight sim hardware shenanigans, I subscribed to the "Buy Once, Cry Once" philosophy from day 1 here with the racing build.

I had never sim raced before, but I own an AMG and have always loved fast cars. In 2018, I did an AMG Academy Track Day @ Leguna Seca which was incredible and gave me confidence that I would love sim racing the same as I do flight simming. That day I was told by "Nipper" (my instructor for the day) that I "was a natural", but still I never took the leap to get a racing rig put together. Now that has changed...

PRESENT DAY BUILD

At the end of July, after the baby had arrived, I started ordering the racing rig hardware and checking hourly for the out of stock items to come back into stock. Below is what I settled on for the build and I ordered as soon as the items came back into stock:

Rig: SimLab P1-X (Black)
- Add-ons: SimFeet + Seat Rails + Seat Slider + Keyboard Tray + Mouse Tray + Cup Holders
Pedals: Wave Italy WAVE FORCE MONZA - SIM PEDALS PRO
- I ordered the 2 pedal set with no clutch, as I have 0 intentions of ever racing a car that doesn't use clutch paddles
Direct Drive Base: SIMUCUBE 2 Pro
Rim: Ascher Racing F-28 Wireless
- I wanted the F-64 but ran out of patience in waiting for Martin to get this back into stock
- I might add a new rim in soon, but TBD (would be a F-64 or a Gomez rim)
Seat: Sparco Evo II QRT

The Ascher rim took the longest to come back into stock, which was painful, but by the end or end of October I finally had everything I needed. Those few months of waiting were rough. Unfortunately, the waiting didn't stop there as our new home had some undisclosed water damage/issues in the basement, which required a very costly waterproofing system to be installed. This also meant that the finishes of the basement needed to be totally ripped out as they dug the perimeter of the cement up to install all of that. While this was quite costly, it did mean that I had a clean slate to work with for remodeling my man cave...so that is exactly what I did.

The contractors were here for a month or so getting all of that done, and at this point everything is mostly finished besides some things I am going to DIY myself, and then having the painters come (which we cancelled in early December due to COVID spiking again, and we will likely have them come in the Spring once things hopefully have settled down).

Here are some photos of the build....

PROGRESS SHOTS:

FINAL PRODUCT:

I have since cleaned up all the wires with some TLC on cable management. I will get more photos of that up soon.

NEXT STEPS:

Add a pedal slider to the racing pedals
Add tactile feedback to the rig
Add my flight sim peripherals to the rig
Build button boxes for both racing and flight
Add motion

With the guidance of @Mr Latte , I've gotten a small start on adding tactile feedback to the rig. Yesterday I ordered a Behringer NX3000D + 2x ButtKicker Concerts. Configuration of the two BK-CT's is TBD, but I am likely going to add one to the seat and one to the pedals. Unfortunately, the amp is on backorder under the end of January (yay, more waiting!) but once that is here it will mark the next big progress I am able to make on the rig. Once I get this all set up, I will work on adding anywhere from 4-8 exciters onto the seat. On my old flight setup, I used a JetSeat SE from Andre, which was very nice, but I know it will pale in comparison to what I am working on for this build.

Regarding adding my flight sim equipment to the P1-X, I still have some more thinking/planning to do on this one. Since we all love photos, here are some shots of my current gear...

FLIGHT GEAR:

Rig: WheelStandPro for TM Warthog
- Add-ons: Left Side RSG module
Pedals: Slaw RX Vipers
- Add-ons: Motorcycle damper
Throttle: Custom made Throttletek F/A-18C throttle
- Add-ons: Made with Halls sensor instead of a standard pot, and I procured ~$500+ worth of custom switches for them to use in the build, these are the OTTO mil-spec switches that are used in the real jet
Stick Base: Virpil VPC T-50 base
- Add-ons: Sahaj 15cm Black extension
Grip: Thrustmaster F/A-18C Replica
- I also have my old A-10C/F-16 Warthog grip from when I had a TM Warthog HOTAS

I've got some plans to change some of this stuff up a bit as well, but one step at a time...

Regarding the button boxes, I have about $1500 worth of mil-spec switches, rotaries, and other misc stuff that I purchased when I was planning to build a 1:1 replica cockpit of a F/A-18C Hornet. These are mostly Honeywell and EATON/Cutler Hammer, and are incredibly high quality with a great tactile feel. I've also got a landing gear handle from a GR-4 Tornado fighter jet that I will need to build into one of the botton boxes as well, as well as a landing HOOK handle. My point here is that I've got a lot of the materials already on hand that I can use for a racing box, I'll just need to add a few things here or there maybe.

While I've never soldered a thing in my life, and am largely not "handy" whatsoever, I did acquire all the necessary soldering equipment before...despite never finding the time to use any of it

Hopefully that changes in 2021, but I'm not so sure given it seems that newborns take quite a bit of your free time, and I've got a lot already on my plate. Someday, though.

That is all for now....the baby needs fed again...but I hope you've enjoyed reading. I'll get the specs of my rig and VR put up sometime soon. Looking forward to hearing everyone's thoughts and feedback!

Happy New Year to all!

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Edit to add PC specs:

GAMING RIG:

GPU: Nvidia RTX 3090 Founders Edition
CPU: Intel i7-9700K
- Still searching daily for a AMD 5900X to come into stock and allow me 2 seconds to be able to add it to my cart before the scalpers, and which point I will just go ahead and update the mobo, RAM, AIO, etc.
Motherboard: Gigabyte Z390 Aorus Master
AIO Cooler: Corsair H115i RGB Platinum
RAM: 32GB Corsair Vengeance Pro RGB 3200
Monitor: Dell U3415W Curved 3440x1440
VR HMD: Reverb G2

Callsign BH · Dec 14, 2021

Great insights @metalnwood, thanks for sharing! Totally understand everything you’re saying. For all the of the reasons you mentioned, I’ll likely migrate over to the side stick bc I can just leave it there. I am 10000% like you that any significant “change over time” means I’ll just leave it set for race or flight for long period bc I am also lazy

I doubt I’ll ever venture into rotary flight, at least not seriously. It’s cool and I understand why some love it, but it bores me. I actually hate all ground pounding (A-10, Harrier, etc). I’m a fighter jock through and through.

The button boxes I built and install will need to be well thought out generalized hybrids for flight primarily, but with a little race crossover. The primary concern I have it being able to get a 3rd (center, low) MFD on my rig…bc I’ll likely knock it with my legs when racing.

metalnwood · Dec 14, 2021

The p1 probably gives you a reasonable option to mount a 3rd mfd from the wheel mount, behind it just under the servo base. First thought would be on some hinge like the 8020 locakable hinges.. that way it can swing down vertically and swing up to be stored horizontally.

Callsign BH · Dec 16, 2021

Not going to be any updates for a little while, I’ve got the rig all wrapped up, covered, and sealed off while I do some sanding to finish a butcher block countertop to install in the man cave, and I also need to finish up a little drywall work…

Don’t need to be getting the rig all dusty and dirty.

Callsign BH · Dec 19, 2021

Man cave is slowly coming along, and the rig is opened back up. The couch was delivered today and I hung an old Samsung 55" up (replaced it with a LG C1 OLED upstairs, to go along with the other LG CX OLED on the same floor). Countertop for the bar cabinets is also finished, with the exception of needing to wet sand it once it cures fully, then wax and buff it.

I’ve got some more odd and ends work to do myself down here, but the next major step will be for the painters to come in and paint the walls/ceiling white, as well as paint the fireplace stone white, and the bar/cabinets in matte black. As with most things nowadays, they are booked a few months out, so that will probably be happening Q1/Q2 of next year. The good news is that I can get back to racing....

I’ve got the next 2 weeks off work, so going to get the BK LFE and CT wired up and tested here very soon. I’ve also (obviously) got a lot of clean up left to do down here.

Callsign BH · Dec 21, 2021

BK LFE cables have been modified (I bought a 25’ SpeakON cable, and split it to length for mounting to my rig, and put some double screw Nakamichi Banana Plugs on). Tested it out with a tone generator and it’s working well.

Video was a quick test at 10hz, and attached a couple photos of the banana plus with heatshrink, as well as it mounted on my "test board" along side the TST-429's.

https://imgur.com/a/L5s5ESF

Callsign BH · Dec 29, 2021

Moved the Steam VR 2.0 Base Station off the tripod and mounted it on the wall today. Not really sure it’ll have any “benefit” on quality of tracking, but it gets it out of the way. It surely won’t hurt tracking.

The downside is that now the wire will trigger my OCD until I can find my snake to run it behind the drywall…but with the mess of everything else and my cable management being put on hold for now (until I do the shaker installs), I’m just going to have to deal with it. Small drop in a big bucket with all the other wires/cables that are laying about nowadays.

Callsign BH · Jan 19, 2022

Long story on the journey of getting a second NX3000D here, with the lack of stock in the US, but it’s finally here and installed. Received and sent one EU 220V back (was sold as a 120V US version), then found 1 in stock on Amazon Warehouse (again, supposed to be US 120V), but it arrived and was 220V as well….

The one from Amazon arrive with a US plug, so at first I thought I was golden. When I plugged it in and turned it on, it fired up fine. Next day I realized the fan wasn't spinning. At that point I realized the back said "220V" (not 120V like my other one), so I contacted Behringer Tech Support and was advised to do the standard jumper wire mod. Another good opportunity to test my soldering skills, or lack thereof. Below is the final product, I swapped the fuse out as well based on the markings of the board.

Luckily, I fired it up after the modding (including replacing the fan to a Noctua) and it's working just fine. Need to get some hot glue on the fan plug, but will do that another time.

Now I’ve got both units mounted on the rack and waiting for the RaceBass seat plate and isolators. Those should arrive next week, and then it’ll be install time. Install/use of all these units has been about 13 months in the making at this point.

Once the RaceBass stuff ships I’m going to take a few days off work (while I have the nanny here to watch the kid), so I can complete the install, getting the settings/effects loaded, and get everything up and running…then of course, have some actual free time to test and enjoy it.

Can't wait!

Callsign BH · Feb 4, 2022

Just a quick update here, arrival of the RaceBass mounting plate and isolators is taking longer than I alluded to in my prior post. Now I’m hoping to receive the items next week perhaps…

In the mean time, I’ve gone about some houskeeeping with getting the needed hardware to mount the shakers, brackets and plates, and overall trying to get some organization of all the spare bits and pieces, etc. I’ve collected since starting the build.

Still have a small pile of hardware to sort, label, and store....but that should be completed this weekend.

Past that, I think I'm ready for install whenever the RaceBass stuff arrives.

Pretty boring update overall, but hope to have something more exciting pics and updates to share soon.

Deleted member 1451080 · Feb 4, 2022

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Callsign BH · Feb 4, 2022

To be clear @TonyMM all that hardware is not for the RB install, it’s just what I’ve accumulated over the year of rig building.

The only "need" for RB is some M8 bolts for mounting the the brackets, and the T nuts for the same application. Isolators come complete unless you want to add/swap something yourself. You also need the bolts for mounting the transducers per usual.

Deleted member 1451080 · Feb 4, 2022

Deleted

cnhoff · Feb 4, 2022

TonyMM said:
... as you will have to "tune" your setup, also in order to achieve the best balance between amount of isolation that you need vs. the amount of tactile effect that you want. It also depends on the car that you drive in the game

TonyMM said:
So if you want a perfect setup (and I think you do....) you will definitely experiment with different lengths of screws and different springs in order to achieve different compression/ isolation effect...

Keen to read your next experiments

Sorry, but there is no need for what you are saying. Basically you preload the springs enough so the whole setup stays stable when you are not sitting on it. If you don't preload enough, the bolt might become lose, when you sit on it, but that is also not a catastrophy in my opinion, everything is held down by body weight in that situation. Relaxing the tension on the bolt might even help with isolation. I also cannot imagine a reason why you should "tune" the springs for different cars, conditions or whatever.

With the right spring length there is only a couple of mm of meaningful preload anyway and personally i have hardly felt a difference between different preloads, which is not surprising if you take the magic dust out of the equation and realize you are not changing much of the springs mechanical properties in this resonant structure by loading it within the linear range.

Guys, it is a well known assembly that has been in use for fridges, ACs, even skyscrapers for dunno, a century or more...any mediocre mechanical engineer would be amused about how much hype is actually raised about those 6EUR springs and 2EUR rubbers. They are easily done on your own, because all of the materials and concepts involved are readily available for a couple of bucks.

One guy adapted those first for our hobby, that is an achievement, sure and this solution is working very well, i would not want to got back, especially on the seat. On the pedals, simpler solutions might work just as well, because of the lack of mass in the resonant structure.

Deleted member 1451080 · Feb 4, 2022

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cnhoff · Feb 4, 2022

TonyMM said:
Thanks for your Feedback! Very interesting!

Yes you are right, there is maybe too much hype for this 6+2 eur product as you say.

My point about tuning depending on the car was that different cars on different tracks (sos with different suspension setups and therefore different type of vibrations in the cockpit) would may need different setup in terms of the balance between compression and isolation. That's what I experienced for example in my ex race cars on different race tracks. But I may be absolutely wrong as you write and in this case one size fits all would be right and no need for different size of screws and springs etc.....

Do you think that this rubber/spring combo should be the same for different weight of people, let's say, people with 150 lbs and people 250lbs? What do you think? (I suppose you are a mechanical engineer, hence my question)

I am not a mechanical engineer, no.

I would not expect much difference if you consider this range of springs compress on the order of 2mm when loaded with 100kg of mass. Typically you would install 4, so the guy's weight is split into 4 roughly.

The isolation might improve for heavier guys as the resonance frequency decreases though, but i would not expect a noticeable difference.

Deleted member 1451080 · Feb 4, 2022

Deleted

blekenbleu · Feb 4, 2022

TonyMM said:
different cars on different tracks

Track car spring rates are about keeping tires in contact with other than smooth pavement
and e.g. minimizing overload of outer tires in corners.... NOT isolating road vibrations from the chassis.

Sim isolation springs are about tradeoff between deflection when braking (stiffer is better)
vs absorbing and returning tactile energy to the sprung mass (softer is better).
A light guy with load cell will want stiffer springs than a heavy dude without load cell.
Of course, springs too soft can also resonate with the sprung mass at an obnoxious frequency.

Deleted member 1451080 · Feb 4, 2022

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Mr Latte · Feb 5, 2022

TonyMM said:
WOW I was just about to order these Racebass isolators and the mounting plates but honestly I am surprised by the amount of additional hardware (bolts, screws, washers, etc...) that I would need.......It is a DIY solution also at the end....LOL...

And I was quoted for 4 x RaceBass isolators incl. shipping $245
For the 4 RaceBass isolators and the mounting plate and brackets incl. shipping, I was quoted $480

That's a LOT of money when I still have to get the proper screw length, etc....also

I may go with the DIY spring/ rubber combo (the RB are the same) that many people use meanwhile and add some aluminum profile.

Anyway, enjoy your build and have fun sim racing/ sim flying !

Phewww, I am glad that you are not intending to buy.

I take nothing to do with orders or shipments but have heard that DHL shipping rates are quite expensive, then again I've been quoted quite large sums of money for shipping if buying various pedals from USA.

Point to highlight, nobody, involved with RB or Simtag is on here trying to shove products in people's faces, poach for members to join, gain sales or try to convince people. We have plenty of interest and more and more people coming on board as we see the first customers now taking delivery of the products that took a lot of effort to get a company to make with small margins. Yet not one single other company has offered tactile installation solutions to this level before. Give Simtag some credit man, finally, a company is seeking to take tactile more seriously....

Please note that "RaceBass" / "Racebass Audio & Tactile Immersion" is now an official registered trademark, it may or may not become something as a brand or it may disappear, that is up to the communities interest.

Now, is it a surprise that still..... The same people on some threads, we see RB gets accused as selling effects or putting effects behind a paywall. Also that it's not clear how to become a member etc, why would that be?

RaceBass members donate what they want, donations are split to those involved and who put a lot of time and effort into different aspects in forming this community. Mark has done a huge amount of work and not taken a single dime. For the record, effects are neither sold individually or in packs. You don't pay a little and get some, then pay more and get more. I also have no knowledge of Simtag informing people that it is expected or necessary to give any sum or generously in donations?

We have nothing to hide about this and will even reach out to Wotever to come to see for himself if he wants, that we are not going behind his intentions to use his software for profit.

Let me prove a point here....
We started a private community, to get away from all the differing opinions. approaches. Offering a community that is non-toxic, for people interested and eager to come on board with the concept. Providing a focus and new goals for tactile, based on the concept I have worked on and the multi-tier and multilayer approach I started to build effects for the hardware it uses. This same hardware, that now so many people copy in using. The idea of the isolators, that people want to copy and probably soon also the idea for better attaching the exciters to seats that have recently been shared in our own community.

Some people expect us to just let everyone get access to the effects I want to develop. Some may ask, what's the issue with that if you are not selling them or working behind a paywall? The reason is very simple, we offer a recommended installation approach, with recommended hardware, we then build our own effects to the standard we seek for that hardware. The only way we can be sure people experience these effects to the way intended is in using the very approach we offer.

Having anyone and everyone able to use the effects, what they will offer for users with very different hardware, different rigs and installations will not be achieved properly. They won't get the effects operating as intended or the immersion so much time is spent in the development of them. This may not matter to some but it matters to me.

This then causes problems, confusion, dissatisfaction and takes away any reputation we seek to try to achieve with what we are doing. We are trying to get people out of the mess tactile transducers/setup/installation and hardware can become and offer what we believe is the best performance pathway to the best tactile immersion with specially developed effects for its own community and tuned by its own community.

We also seek to protect our own efforts just as Wotever does not want others profiting from his software. I do not want to see other companies starting to offer tactile solutions copying my concept, and then using my own effects outside of our community, for them as companies to offer as their own and to help them gain extra hardware sales.

Invitations/Membership will be based on our own approval. Regardless of how much or what people may buy from Simtag. We seek a non-toxic interaction, use real names and are not interested in further debating, other tactile options or approaches. So it's maybe not best suited to certain people here or on Simhub Discord who want to do things differently or have problems following our guidelines.

metalnwood · Feb 5, 2022

Thats pretty much all I have asked. Yes it's been a number of times I have asked and the answer has never been clear. I asked just a simple question in heli's thread and it isnt because I care about you charging, I dont care if you want to charge. I want to know who I am paying and what I am getting. If I was to spend $ with simtag and didnt get profiles I would be quite unhappy if that was not clear.

I have said many times your work is worth something an up until now its not been clear what your pricing model is.. You have said there was speculation from 'some members' when you werent giving information. That speculation just happened to be true. Once again, so what? I dont have a problem with someone making money from their efforts.

Unfortunately I am one of those 'members' who wont be named you refer to so I get the point, invites to the discord will not be forthcoming. Any purchases to simtag to enable that will not be happening.

As much as you as trying to distance yourself from simtag you need to talk to them and ask what they are saying to customers. You can't just say 'hey, i dont know what they are saying I am not them'. If they are wrong, correct them. If they are right make it clear that buying gear from simtag in to way guarantees you access to profiles and if you do get access you will pay more for them.

Mr Latte · Feb 5, 2022

metalnwood said:
Thats pretty much all I have asked. Yes it's been a number of times I have asked and the answer has never been clear. I asked just a simple question in heli's thread and it isnt because I care about you charging, I dont care if you want to charge. I want to know who I am paying and what I am getting. If I was to spend $ with simtag and didnt get profiles I would be quite unhappy if that was not clear.

I have said many times your work is worth something an up until now its not been clear what your pricing model is.. You have said there was speculation from 'some members' when you werent giving information. That speculation just happened to be true. Once again, so what? I dont have a problem with someone making money from their efforts.

Unfortunately I am one of those 'members' who wont be named you refer to so I get the point, invites to the discord will not be forthcoming. Any purchases to simtag to enable that will not be happening.

As much as you as trying to distance yourself from simtag you need to talk to them and ask what they are saying to customers. You can't just say 'hey, i dont know what they are saying I am not them'. If they are wrong, correct them. If they are right make it clear that buying gear from simtag in to way guarantees you access to profiles and if you do get access you will pay more for them.

You are welcome to send me personally, in DM any responses you have had with Simtag in that they stated to you to send a substantial sum of money (similar to cost of springs) in donation as you alluded to. You made an accusation, how or why would I have access to their customer communications/inquiries. So yes I ask you now outright to provide proof for me to take to them.

There is no "if they were wrong" either what you said is true or just more false information and your comment about this is the first I am aware of such.

I have already discussed this in a meeting earlier tonight as I was concerned so it will be looked into.

There is no distancing from Simtag. The early intentions were that buying RB products from Simtag was a way to ensure people were using the approved isolation and installation we encourage people to have. To then offer them an invite to become a member seemed a reasonable thing to do. However, anyone can buy that hardware and use whatever tactile transducers or effects they want with it. They don't even need to be interested in anything regards RaceBass at all.

We already have several members that have their own solutions in part, regards plates or brackets that suit their own installations but the official springs have been popular choices for people. There is no "you must buy all this stuff" rule. Those people get the same help and are treated no differently to those who may buy the whole bundle. At the same time and this is common sense, people want to show their support and buy the official solutions because they respect the work that Peter/Mark and others in the community are doing and appreciate what we are trying to achieve. Some are excited and want to be part of it all. For me that's awesome and seeing people want to stick a RaceBass logo onto their rig, wow!

It was commented by someone here a while ago that buying hardware to gain access to the RB effects and community could be deemed a paywall of sorts, when that was not and is not the intention. Therefore to clarify, Race Bass community is its own entity, Simtag sales do not influence who we grant access to nor does it control any aspect of it.

If someone has reasons to query if they would be granted access to the community, then why is that? For the vast majority of people of course it should not be a problem.....