AMS 2 | Latest News From The January Roadmap Release

racingdud3

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Sep 16, 2018
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I am happy and I still will if it stays out of AMS2 tracks...I am bored to know tons of resources have been wasted on other titles for a single track good only for hotlapping alone and totally useless in multiplayer events, so I hope they will never do the same error...

About people complaining of roadmap...well...nevermind, not worth my time really...
This article shows some other view of the things... Take a look in what position is placed, LOL.

https://www.carthrottle.com/post/the-10-best-racing-tracks-in-the-world/


Its a great racetrack, may be not in your opinion but many ones would love to have it on ams2...

Yeah not simple to create it .....but man Great things of life are not easy!
 
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Dann Murillo

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Wasnt Azure confirmed since first trailer?
I think his comment regarding the confirmation of Azure is because not as much content has been confirmed to the public vs the backers. The backers currently know ever car & track that is coming upon release. Yes we have seen a Monaco-esk track in the development updates and trailers, however, I am not sure Reiza has flat out confirmed anything publicly? I could be wrong but I do not recall it being directly stated/confirmed. ;)

All that aside I am beyond excited for this sim! 3 weeks away from the beta. Very anxious to see what Reiza has done with the Madness engine. Considering the magic they did with gmotor in AMS, I can only imagine how far they will take Madness. In Reiza we trust. :cool:
 
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Ben Lee

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How does the backers thing work? Do you get access to an early build of the game or something?
 

racingdud3

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Sep 16, 2018
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Hahaa i have to say that i was confused and sad watching monaco on that list ...

But considering all the great racing sims have Nordschleife (it must be beacause some reason and not only for hotlapping) and because the awesome racing action you can have (not same title but on Assetto Corsa Simracingsystem platform) as i have had there appart of the cruissing fun you can also experience it should be included.

I respect your opinions but I dont consider the Great Nordschleife as only a hotlapping circuit. :D

But your wishes may be will be answered with not having that track on ams2 because the license must be so expensive, and many simracers will miss it.

BTw lets see what decides Reiza.
 
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David Wright

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Sep 27, 2009
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Really looking forward to this, especially the future expansion plans (lukewarm about the AMS1 content). I have a big soft spot for PC2. The content is amazing. Unlike some/many I prefer PC2 FFB on my G29 to many other titles. The default loose setup is a very strange design choice but not too hard to sort out. Fix the track-cutting detection and penalties, polish the AI, add a custom championship and I'll be a happy man.
 

ermo

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Dec 24, 2009
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Reiza's marketing approach is very different from that of SMS.

If Reiza can come out with a functional (but possibly bare bones) v1.0 where the fundamentals are clearly in place, I can certainly live with a few rough edges here and there as long as it is clear that Reiza listens to the community and prioritises accordingly (and I haven't seen anything so far to suggest that they won't).

It'll be quite unfair (but natural) to compare the polish of AMS with that of AMS2 on relase. However, AMS2 will need time to gel and be fettled "just so" -- exactly like ALL other simracing titles (see AC and ACC for example).

I just hope that Renato & Co. will be able to weather any initial criticism (RD can be a pretty harsh place!) with their pride and morale intact while keeping their collective heads down and focusing on achieving the goals of their planned development programme, which most likely includes making AMS2 a kick-ass driving and racing simulator with some of the most advanced core simulation tech and some of the best visuals on the market.
 
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leo523

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Dec 12, 2019
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If it handles like PCARS 2 then It's going to be hard for me to shell out to buy it. If they nail the physics then my wallet is open for business. I backed AMS1, PCARS1 and PCARS2 and regretted it with PCARS 1/2 but loved AMS but the game engine is what's truly worrying me.
I think that is the FFB of PC2 bad, not the physics engine.
 

BP

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Nov 1, 2016
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Just bought into the Early Access program and have no regrets...Kunos turned ACC around and I have even more faith in Reiza based on their track record to deliver a great product (FYI that wasn't a knock on Kunos). Even if it's not mind-blowing out the gate, guess what? There's about 10 other modern sims in my library to continue playing until it gets sorted? :confused:

It really is a great time to be a sim-racer :thumbsup:

See, i do not think SMS had "bad or stupid" devs. Probably made wrong choices i have no clue. But if Reiza is able to replicate the AMS feel within the Madness engine...why didn't SMS do so after the PC 1 debacle? SMS created the Madness engine, it is their own product, they must have all knowledge...i just do not understand. Now Reiza tries to create a new game within the engine with zero knowledge (and no Niels which is the real trouble for Reiza).
Creating a versatile game engine doesn't make you automatically capable of producing great games with it; for example the best engine designer at Honda, more times than not, does not automatically equate to being Ayrton Senna behind the wheel...or visually: chemists at the best paint manufacturing plant =/= Picasso by default. It can, but it's not guaranteed.

Also from what I recall reading in past articles, Reiza was given guidance with the madness engine by SMS (don't know if in written form or live instruction), so I don't think they're tinkering in the dark trying to figure out what controls what (i.e. your "zero knowledge" statement).
 

Boby Kim

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Aug 28, 2010
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I think that is the FFB of PC2 bad, not the physics engine.
Could be...in a real car you are strapped in so tight you are part of the car, and thus part of the moving mass. As the human body is able to train muscle memory, so can the body train G-force memory and a real race driver "feels" what the shifting mass is doing (plus all other senses) and correct is nessecary. We gamers cant train G force memory as there is no way to replicate moving mass.
The only memory we can train is the muscle memory from the ffb. Physics must be translated into FFB to replicate the Feel of moving mass. Especially rF2 is excellent in doing so. In PC2 i felt no FFB and thus no physics. Start the sim you race often, turn off FFB and race...be honest if you think the car still has great physics.
 

ermo

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Dec 24, 2009
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Could be...in a real car you are strapped in so tight you are part of the car, and thus part of the moving mass. As the human body is able to train muscle memory, so can the body train G-force memory and a real race driver "feels" what the shifting mass is doing (plus all other senses) and correct is nessecary. We gamers cant train G force memory as there is no way to replicate moving mass.
The only memory we can train is the muscle memory from the ffb. Physics must be translated into FFB to replicate the Feel of moving mass. Especially rF2 is excellent in doing so. In PC2 i felt no FFB and thus no physics. Start the sim you race often, turn off FFB and race...be honest if you think the car still has great physics.
I mostly agree, except that transducers and motion rigs can help with at least the change in acceleration part of butt-accelerometer (and visual) cues.

But that's obviously pretty high-end.

I'd also caution that "pure" FFB is not necessarily enough to everyone -- some people prefer/have become accustomed to exaggerated ("Physics must be translated into FFB") cues. More so if they have lower-end hardware I would argue.

As an aside, I just did a back-to-back comparison of my preferred PC2 FFB settings on my G27 in the GT86 on California Highway:

- Informative preset (which features some signal range compression useful to lower-end wheels)
- Gain 100 (full wheel torque range)
- Volume 30 (otherwise the signal will clip during steady state cornering and activate the auto-scaler, which makes for inconsistent feel),
- Tone 55 (to slightly exaggerate the mechanical trail side force Fy over contact patch/pneumatic trail Mz -- a value of 50 represents the mix of forces that the suspension setup would generate IRL)
- 10 FX (to add a touch of road vibrations and surface detail without overpowering the important weight-transfer effects)

Against the AMS v1.5.3 Puma hard top on the VIR Grand Course and ... holy cow. AMS just ooozes road feel and delicate weight transfer, while the PC2 experience almost felt overdamped and a little dead in the road-feel comparison somehow, though PC2 felt more like the steering wheel does in a real car if you disregard all the non-steering-rack forces that you normally detect via your inner ear / sounds / physical seat-of-the-pants feel when inside the car. I will say that the steering wheel conveyed weight transfer adequately (when weight is transferred, Fy increases/decreases, which is why I add a slight bias towards Fy in Tone) in PC2.

I'm guessing that AMS' track production tricks really make the FFB come alive whereas I know that e.g. the PC2 California Coast track features relatively large and flat physics grid road plane slices to offset its increased length and therefore memory requirements.

To verify the presence of "large and flat physics grid road plane slices" on California Coast, just drive slowly over one of its many crests and notice how you hit sharp edges in the road where the car abrubtly changes attitude as its front wheels traverse the edge of one road plane slice onto another.

You could say that this is probably a best-case AMS vs. worst-case PC2 scenario, but I feel that the edge cases are worth exploring. It's also worth noting that for these kind of flat tracks in PC2 which contain no laser- or drone-scanned surfaces, a bit of random noise is mixed into the signal to simulate surface asperities. This is controlled by the FX setting, so lowering FX will also lower the amount of random noise in this scenario.

I did notice that once the car began sliding past a certain alpha (slip-angle) in AMS, I was more of a passenger than I was in PC2 and here PC2 felt like the more true-to-life tire model calibration to me. I don't claim to be an expert here though and this was just a small comparison run (perhaps I didn't even warm up my tyres enough!). YMMV.
 
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Jach

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Sep 2, 2014
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Honestly this is rfactor 2 killer:thumbsup: I don't hate rf2 but considering it's still much of a mess I won't feel it a shame if the project dies
maybe time for a completely rework for them (something like rf 3) because AMS2 will leave S397 nowhere to hide
 

sonicviz

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Jun 21, 2019
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Honestly this is rfactor 2 killer:thumbsup: I don't hate rf2 but considering it's still much of a mess I won't feel it a shame if the project dies
maybe time for a completely rework for them (something like rf 3) because AMS2 will leave S397 nowhere to hide
I don't think so. PC2 engine has a few serious flaws, and unless AM2 addresses them it won't matter how many nice cars and tracks it has.

1. Gamepad FFB is terrible in PC2. Compared to AC/ACC/rF2 it's light years behind.
2. PC2 flickering fences and other visual artifacts make for a horrible VR experience, as well as annoying on flat screen. There's a few tricks to minimise this but it's a rendering flaw that needs fixing. Compare it to AC with latest CM/CSP and Sol which is smooth as silk, and great color (or ACC).
2. PC2 rain clouds that drift across the track don't blend at all and completely break the immersion. Might as well remove them.

I'd love to know if they are fixing these glaring issues for AM2, as I've not seen them mentioned anywhere as yet.


 
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Dann Murillo

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We haven't seen the flickering in the videos thus far - so hopefully that is a nonissue. Otherwise, you're saying if I don't use VR or a gamepad, I have a serious and glaring cloud issue. I think we will all be OK and have a nice new sim to add to our libraries. I bet it wont be everyone's favorite as it is impossible to please everyone, especially with this hobby or in this day and age. I am optimistic Reiza will deliver the goods and I so excited to try this out. :)
 
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fireballr18

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Mar 3, 2018
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Honestly this is rfactor 2 killer:thumbsup: I don't hate rf2 but considering it's still much of a mess I won't feel it a shame if the project dies
maybe time for a completely rework for them (something like rf 3) because AMS2 will leave S397 nowhere to hide
No. It's could only kill AMS :D.
RF2 is focused on different aspects, or should be in future. MP competition, more international stuff. I don't think AMS2 can offer Sebring, Le Mans, Nordschleife etc.
 
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