Cars 1999 Nissan Primera BTCC 1.1

[Patrik Marek]

I'm sure people will come out with more safe setups . If you think this is unstable and uncatchable wait till you see BMW
thanks all for feedback

 

[Kyuubeey]

A suggestion I would have for Giuseppe is to migrate to using load curves for the tires. It can fix a lot of issues in cars with a bit more aero like this; and cars in general.

 

[CC]

I'm sure people will come out with more safe setups . If you think this is unstable and uncatchable wait till you see BMW
thanks all for feedback

Hi,
Yes I just did 5 laps each with these downloads here,

the version 1.0 was the best for me the power understeer exiting a corner the balance was just perfect through the wheel felt very more realistic than the v1.1 its almost wild the torque steers much more straight which a lot of front wheel drive cars do from road experience I just think its way too much exaggerated with the 1.1 the 1.0 was much more tame and balanced there,

regarding the oversteer coming into the corners again its much more over exaggerated for a road car saloon would be much more correct, these BTCC cars with the suspension and dampers would lean more than just simply letting go, for me ill stick with v1.0 for now thx for the updates like always much appreciated,

and yes maybe with a good setup be much faster although I am over 1 second slower with the 1.1 over the my RSR top ten time.

https://i.gyazo.com/b402a47b030386065ee742e6c7947faa.mp4

 

[Kyuubeey]

While feedback is fine, have you actually done real research on BTCC cars or worked with some of the teams? I was not convinced either until I did.

I was pretty sure the aero is completely off and I argued it, for example, but it doesn't seem that way after learning more.

 

[CC]

While feedback is fine, have you actually done real research on BTCC cars or worked with some of the teams? I was not convinced either until I did.

I was pretty sure the aero is completely off and I argued it, for example, but it doesn't seem that way after learning more.

I have owned vauxhall cavalier sri what handled better than this 1.1 version don’t need to speak to a btcc team to confirm that lol

 

[Kyuubeey]

I have owned vauxhall cavalier sri what handled better than this 1.1 version don’t need to speak to a btcc team to confirm that lol

Okay, well, I was trying to give you some help so as to not embarrass yourself, but you seem to be doing that just fine.

Anyway, I don't know if the car is accurate or not, I'm yet to even drive it on 1.1. I just gave you some advice on how to approach evaluating simulation vehicles.

 

[Patrik Marek]

@Ben Lee will be able to answer a lot of question, since he was the main person talking to people driving these cars in real life

 

[Dave_6]

I thought it over rotated myself until I figured out how to drive it. Now it's fun and feels like what I recall reading about these cars and how they were setup.

 

[RacingManiacGT1]

Haven't tried the update but the previous one is just about going for throttle and lots of it all the time.....

 

[Patrik Marek]

Haven't tried the update but the previous one is just about going for throttle and lots of it all the time.....

Being on throttle when turning is the key to keep it under control

 

[arixant]

making me want to finish my jtcc pack now lol. maybe once im free again.

 

[Ben Lee]

For those struggling with oversteer, check the front camber and also the rear tyre temps. If you are losing the rear say for example at Donington which effectively has 1 left hander, it’s likely because the default front camber is way too high. Teams used front camber as low as -2.5. If you have a front camber of -4 on that corner as default and the rears are cold, then the rear of the car can come around. The camber setup at Oulton Park Fosters, which like Donington has 1 left hander is -4, and -2.5. The rears are -5 and -5. Brands Hatch is much the same, the rear right tyre never really gets up to temp, so you need to lower the front right camber a lot.

There were also some damper changes with the precise purpose of making the car more controllable off the throttle so I’m surprised if people are finding it worse.

The aero, so this was revised a number of times but in all variants we kept a heavy front bias. The race car engineering magazine Alfa Romeo 156 supertouring article said the aero split was 68% front, so we used that as a base. The BMW will have more of an equal split front and rear.

 

[Kyuubeey]

For those struggling with oversteer, check the front camber and also the rear tyre temps. If you are losing the rear say for example at Donington which effectively has 1 left hander, it’s likely because the default front camber is way too high. Teams used front camber as low as -2.5. If you have a front camber of -4 on that corner as default and the rears are cold, then the rear of the car can come around. The camber setup at Oulton Park Fosters, which like Donington has 1 left hander is -4, and -2.5. The rears are -5 and -5. Brands Hatch is much the same, the rear right tyre never really gets up to temp, so you need to lower the front right camber a lot.

Makes me wish for default setups per-track sometimes. Some racecars are just undrivable on some tracks if the setup is made for an opposite one.

Would be cool to have a separate .ini file where you can setup the car on a per-track default basis, with ingame option to reset to the suspensions.ini, aero.ini etc. defaults if need be. Then those .ini files would be bundled with the car and installed at the same time and automatically read.

Oh well...

 

[Patrik Marek]

heh, nevermind

 

[Kyuubeey]

You can save custom setup though ? And add track in the name ? Or call it less oversteer , more oversteer ... Etc

You can, but it's not as automatic and modular as it should be. I suspect most users won't even *look* at the setup screen, so it should be the default.

 

[Ben Lee]

Its also important to know that in the early laps the rear will be incredibly loose and if the rear tyres never get up to temps, you will need to probably lower the camber for that front corner.

Another point to make is that our development never stops, so if we think that we can improve a car, we will look at it. One thing we tried to explore was to reduce the amount of rear squat under accelleration (it gains about -1.5 degrees of rear camber under squat), however Giuseppe and I wasnt able to, so that one remains on the shelf for further exploration.

 

[Kyuubeey]

A little weird why you can't get it solved when I've already done both on my end. If Giuseppe would actually get on Steam some time, I could share the info.

Of course, my analysis can be completely wrong, but it's basically a trailing arm, so you should construct it as one, not like the thing there is currently ingame. Less squat, less camber and toe gain. At least that's what the few pics I have and the pic of the CAD model shows. I don't see an upper arm, so it must be a trailing arm effectively.

 

[nastypasty]

oh good point, I think it requires Custom Shaders Patch to be installed

Could you drop a link here for that patch please? Had a quick search for it on my phone whilst at work and not finding anything. Thanks.

 

[manc0ntr0]

I wonder if this could be something coming from the Custom Shader Patch mirror, certainly not seeing the issue in the editor
there is a small gap there, but nothing like what you have here

I have the same problems with more than one car and, as you said, it's something relative to the shaders patch mirror plugin. I deactivated it and now mirrors work OK.

 

[SaXXXon]

Could you drop a link here for that patch please? Had a quick search for it on my phone whilst at work and not finding anything. Thanks.

it does not allow to post here. but it's the top link when you google it