List of Automobilista 2 Cars with Updated Tire Model

Theres no such thing as the fans barrier, some forum posts expressing right or wrong points of view make for spirited conversation, Nothing else.

All our products have flaws, and fan-bases that defend them.

R.Man said:

Do no waste your energy, whatever you'll say AMS2 fans will reject any possibility of issue by nature . I've exchanged with them enough to understand how they are. They will only say X feature was bad the day Reiza will update this X feature. Before that they will say it's perfect...This is how this community works. This is why AMS2 has difficulty to grow faster than it should, there is a tendency to insult people intelligence like they are doing with you right now. I remember when they tried to prove on Youtube that AMS2 had lift off oversteer.... An another example those guys happy with the highly marketing bluff "fake" new tyre model ( more updated parameters than new tyre model ) are the same that was very happy with the previous tyre versions and defended them fiercely. If you need to be heard directly create a Youtube channel with "what's wrong with AMS2" video series. Reiza will listen to you faster a you'll not have the fans barrier.

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LOL again the conspiracy theory.
Is that all you have to say when people just bring evidence like videos? Calling everyone else fanboys is the best you can do to prove a point?
Who said everything is perfect? We are saying that ABS isn't working much and has to be cranked to the max for many cars just to have a bit of it.
Who ever said that tires were perfect before? How many tire models did iracing, RF2 and ACC change in their shelf life. Their users keep saying their models are the best as well.

MadDriver11 said:

My results in the same test are completely opposite to yours.

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That's because you're clearly locking the front tires, which then will obviously make the car go in a (mostly)straight line.
I thought you'd notice that, specially with the massive tire screaming anyone can hear and the fact that your tires and brakes were cold, which will reduce the ability of both to have any sort of modulation when braking and will cause the wheels to lock (unless you have ABS).

Press J (or K, don't remember which one) till you get that "Anti-Lock Brakes" assist to Full (which is the only way of the wheels not locking IIRC) and set ABS to 10, which is also the only way of making sure the wheels don't lock up. Record setting both of these to the values I mentioned and try doing the same thing.

R.Man said:

Do no waste your energy, whatever you'll say AMS2 fans will reject any possibility of issue by nature . I've exchanged with them enough to understand how they are. They will only say X feature was bad the day Reiza will update this X feature. Before that they will say it's perfect...This is how this community works. This is why AMS2 has difficulty to grow faster than it should, there is a tendency to insult people intelligence like they are doing with you right now. I remember when they tried to prove on Youtube that AMS2 had lift off oversteer.... An another example those guys happy with the highly marketing bluff "fake" new tyre model ( more updated parameters than new tyre model ) are the same that was very happy with the previous tyre versions and defended them fiercely. If you need to be heard directly create a Youtube channel with "what's wrong with AMS2" video series. Reiza will listen to you faster a you'll not have the fans barrier.

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I noticed this kind of behavior in all sectors where people are strongly and emotionally attached to something and flaws are presented. It's a sad reality and I'm not sure why some people defend their product so much despite clear evidence of the flaw(s). Must be because there are so few modern-ish sim titles to play with and/or that they feel they'll be "betraying the movement" or that by admitting to the flaws they may think the developers won't feel they'll support anymore.

On the contrary, pointing flaws and trying to make the product better is exactly what someone who truly loves the product will do. In addition, contempt can be a very dangerous when the fanbase refuses to admit flaws, because the product will stay in a lesser state compared to as if the bug/flaw was fixed.

I remember a video where a guy pointed out to a Ferrari owner about how Ferrari can sell cars that don't work too well in some areas, and he explained in deep details what the flaws were (and the owner knew about them, of course). The owner response was to get mad and say "no, Ferrari is perfect". Complete denial of the problems. Contempt. It's like the attachment a child feels to his/her favorite toy. It also happens in groups, I believe it's called "herd mentality". If the mentality of the group is to praise what a developer does, no matter if it's right or wrong, this mentality will cause whoever tries to "swim against the flow" to also be contempt, to feel left out.
In the case of Ferrari owners there's also the aspect of market. If they say Ferrari cars aren't the holy grail they seem to be (and is the reason they pay so much for such cars), their market value will go down and the investment these people made won't pay back in a few years.

MadDriver11 said:

How many tire models did iracing, RF2 and ACC change in their shelf life.

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And that is the reason why it's important to bring up what one thinks is a problem: to at least investigate the possible problem and fix it in the next updates if need be. In the tire model example, AC1 had 10 tire model revisions exactly because Kunos and AC players thought there were some things wrong with the previous models. People brought it up, Kunos revised it and updated it.
Now imagine if there were massive resistance to people who were bringing the tire model problems in version 1.0. We would still be driving in version 1.0, not many people could have brought the issues up, Kunos wouldn't feel the need to improve the current model, and the fanbase would be contempt with the flawed version 1.0 because of people who resist having their current positions challenged, because of their emotional attachment to things.

Progress cannot happen if people don't allow themselves to evaluate their current position, which is why I still bring up issues I think are present

Amanda said:

That's because you're clearly locking the front tires, which then will obviously make the car go in a (mostly)straight line.
I thought you'd notice that, specially with the massive tire screaming anyone can hear and the fact that your tires and brakes were cold, which will reduce the ability of both to have any sort of modulation when braking and will cause the wheels to lock (unless you have ABS).

Press J (or K, don't remember which one) till you get that "Anti-Lock Brakes" assist to Full (which is the only way of the wheels not locking IIRC) and set ABS to 10, which is also the only way of making sure the wheels don't lock up. Record setting both of these to the values I mentioned and try doing the same thing.

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I sure realize they are locking and that is what happens when I drive and I give as much input as you are giving in your video. I am already running ABS at high and I have made experiments with ABS at 10 in the garage. I can do that again and show you that the result will not change. Even at 10 if I slam the brakes the way you do I get some locking.
I have been spending two hours on TT with that same car and with ABS at 10 lapping.
I can also tell you, among other things, that braking gets increasingly less sketchy as tires heat up.
As a matter of fact my TT best lap was the last of probably 7-10 laps when tires got to around 70C and I could attack far more under braking.
Also, may I draw your attention on the fact that the car is set with wing 1 (out of 9) and BB at 60% whereas the Merc for instance starts at 65%. So it may just be the case that until tires are hot enough you may want to have a bit more forward biased setting.
There are many things more at work in Madness Engine than meet the eyes and certainly many more than most other sims account for together with a lot of things to be still tuned and rightly highlighted by users as issues.
Hence prudence in conclusions is always needed.

Amanda said:

And that is the reason why it's important to bring up what one thinks is a problem: to at least investigate the possible problem and fix it in the next updates if need be. In the tire model example, AC1 had 10 tire model revisions exactly because Kunos and AC players thought there were some things wrong with the previous models. People brought it up, Kunos revised it and updated it.
Now imagine if there were massive resistance to people who were bringing the tire model problems in version 1.0. We would still be driving in version 1.0, not many people could have brought the issues up, Kunos wouldn't feel the need to improve the current model, and the fanbase would be contempt with the flawed version 1.0 because of people who resist having their current positions challenged, because of their emotional attachment to things.

Progress cannot happen if people don't allow themselves to evaluate their current position, which is why I still bring up issues I think are present

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No one here says development is done and everything is perfect. Everyone has a different opinion on what works and what not and how big is this or that issue.
But one thing is to say that there are things to be improved (for instance ABS is clearly to be improved a lot, I am one that complained about it heavily on the forums, as I was one of those who said that we could use again a bit more additional stiffness, more than one year ago when Reiza added damping to the carcass last time).
One other thing is to call fanboy anyone who finds potential or good serviceability or even find pretty much top notch aspects in what we have, knowing full well there will be further revisions by Reiza who follow their own plan to improve things all around anyway.

Thinking the way Rman does that because tires have been improved everyone who could like what we had before is a fanboy and an idiot is like saying Ferrari F2002 was a shitty car and not one of the most dominant F1 in history because the F2004 could lap the same tracks faster. It is complete nonsense.

MadDriver11 said:

Even at 10 if I slam the brakes the way you do I get some locking

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That's because you need to enable the "old school Pcars 2 style assist" by pressing J or K (one is for TC, the other for ABS), otherwise ABS won't work correctly in AMS2.

It should be pretty obvious to anyone candid that the car will travel mostly in a straight line while the wheels are locked. This is pretty sad because I thought at least one person would experiment the proper way and not try to prove me wrong while being disingenuous about it.

I'm not wasting any more time on this thread. Keep your GT cars' as they are, you deserve them.

Amanda said:

That's because you need to enable the "old school Pcars 2 style assist" by pressing J or K (one is for TC, the other for ABS), otherwise ABS won't work correctly in AMS2.

It should be pretty obvious to anyone candid that the car will travel mostly in a straight line while the wheels are locked. This is pretty sad because I thought at least one person would experiment the proper way and not try to prove me wrong while being disingenuous about it.

I'm not wasting any more time on this thread. Keep your GT cars' as they are, you deserve them.

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I have it already enabled at high. I already told you. Everything you have seen so far is on ABS high setting.
I will show you a video tonight of how that is not the problem. There is something to be polished in the ABS for sure, but that setting is not the answer. There are many people who actually have tried to toggle through that setting and are reporting exactly the opposite: low or high it does not change anything according to them.
If you like to think that what you see is the only absolute truth and anyone who experiences something different is either an idiot or is a part of a conspiracy of fanboys go ahead.
LIkely instead experiences are different because hardware settings are different and expectations are different too.

ABS scales are worth a look folks...not much to debate about that. They could be better

CrimsonEminence said:

ABS scales are worth a look folks...not much to debate about that. They could be better

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Please do

I've been doing some testing and I was able to kinda workaround the problem via setup. The problem is not gone, it's still there, but handling is much improved.
My best time with it was a 2:17:2 on Spa (still a far cry from the 2:15:1 I used to get).
It's still a work in progress and I haven't messed with the brake ducts, aero and camber. The car is much more stable, though much more understeery as well.

To anyone with the problem:

Damn, the other cars feel absolutely amazing. It's only the GT cars with this problem.
I'm driving a V12 F1 and it feels freaking great.

MadDriver11 said:

LOL again the conspiracy theory.
Is that all you have to say when people just bring evidence like videos? Calling everyone else fanboys is the best you can do to prove a point?
Who said everything is perfect? We are saying that ABS isn't working much and has to be cranked to the max for many cars just to have a bit of it.
Who ever said that tires were perfect before? How many tire models did iracing, RF2 and ACC change in their shelf life. Their users keep saying their models are the best as well.

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Dude when we read the comment in this topic, almost everyone is against you even some of your loyal AMS2 fans. Have the maturity to back off when you loose an argument. Your post are becoming ridiculous. The way you speak it's clear that you're in the famous AMS2 denial phase.

MadDriver11 said:

Some other drivers won't agree.. So who is right?

Moradness - We don't smash the brakes...

Watch Moradness's clip titled "We don't smash the brakes..."

clips.twitch.tv

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So use basic statistic methods....collect all the real drivers testimonies that agree then collect all from those you don't agree and compare the numbers. More is winning...

I agree that there is something off with AMS2 compared to other sims I drive. I can never trust the car in AMS2. In other sims I can already tell during braking if I'm making the corner or not but not in AMS2, I have to exit the turn all the way before I can be sure I made it.
It feels like the the tires are way too elastic and when you turn the car it rotates around a axis rather than the front wheels guiding the car and the rear is following.

I love many things about AMS2 but the driving isn't one of them.

Martin Vindis said:

It feels like the the tires are way too elastic and when you turn the car it rotates around a axis rather than the front wheels guiding the car and the rear is following.

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That is not how race cars driven at the limit behave.

Martin Vindis said:

I agree that there is something off with AMS2 compared to other sims I drive. I can never trust the car in AMS2. In other sims I can already tell during braking if I'm making the corner or not but not in AMS2, I have to exit the turn all the way before I can be sure I made it.
It feels like the the tires are way too elastic and when you turn the car it rotates around a axis rather than the front wheels guiding the car and the rear is following.

I love many things about AMS2 but the driving isn't one of them.

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I feel the same way. There are many cases where I feel like the rear is gone and I'm 100% gonna spin it... then the car says NOPE and the rear gets grip again, without even needing to correct it. No other sim does this.

Xamantu said:

I feel the same way

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But it's only with their GT cars, right? GT3 + GTE (haven't tested GT1 much yet).
All the other cars seem to handle very well..... oh, with the exception of the Super V8.

Amanda said:

Damn, the other cars feel absolutely amazing. It's only the GT cars with this problem.
I'm driving a V12 F1 and it feels freaking great.

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Try the Ginetta G58 from the P1 class. You will love it and ABS and TC much more