2021 Formula One Saudi Arabian Grand Prix

Dethrone1427 · Dec 6, 2021

RichardHessels said:
I am fan of Hamilton and Max.
If Max would not have tried a killer lap at Q3 he would be 3rd on the grid anyway.
When Hamilton cuts out other drivers from the track, he always does the innocense act.
Verstappen tried everything he could, because if he did not try, he would still end up 2nd.
The Mercedes was again a bit faster.
Be glad we been on the edge of our seats, on this horrific track.
Without Max poking around it would be another sleepy race with hamilton half a lap free of the rest.

Be glad? I dunno man, that was some fairly uncomfortable viewing last night. Max was, "overly robust", I think you could say politely (!) In his driving tactics, "really rather dangerous", is another way you could put it. At the start of this year I was a Red Bull fan, I'm no longer due to Karen Horner. And at the start of the year I was of the view that Max was ready to take the fight to Lewis. I don't think he's quite there yet, and I'm not sure he'll ever get there (much like Senna - who was a flawed genius behind the wheel). He just cannot and will not concede a corner, and it borders on being a liability to go wheel to wheel with. Whoever he's racing against therefore cannot really judge to what level he'll go to in order that he retains the place. I've lost a lot of respect for him and RB. And for him to say, "we're talking about white lines more than racing" - dude! It's because you're going over them and taking people with you! You seem to be making up the rules as you go

pcraenme · Dec 6, 2021

mopro said:
Congrats to Ham! he's obviously more mature than Max, but Mas is younger, he'll get there.

Don’t know if ‘mature’ is the correct word here when I hear his board radios… Lewis (and Mercedes) exactly know what they can get away with with the FIA it seems… you may call that ‘mature’ but ‘clever’ or ‘sneaky’ may be the better expressions here.

randomcallsign · Dec 6, 2021

you only hear from the radios what the production lets you know.

muzikant · Dec 6, 2021

MPortnoy said:
You're just so blinded by your fanaticism it's ridiculous.

Silverstone was not "dirty games", Hamilton understeered into the corner due to the speed he was carrying which combined with Verstappen's aggressive driving and closing the door resulted in a collision.
What Verstappen did in Imola, Monza, Interlagos and Jeddah just to name some was running Hamilton off the road and sometimes even colliding with him ON PURPOSE to avoid letting him through at all costs, LEARN THE EFFIN DIFFERENCE.

The reason why the FIA has penalized Max more than they have Hamilton is not because of any conspiracy, it's because he deserved it but you just can't accept the truth can you?

ridiculous? Max is my compatriot and I like those kind of racers, Villeneuve , Senna... you know what's just ridiculous punishing the others for the same and giving others no penalty at all and giving advantage. Also this weekend where Hamilton didn't get a penalty for ignoring the yellow flag and Max the same the week before. And everything else you say Monza Imola..I don't feel like going into it we just can't go racing like we used to instead of every week these idiotic penalty stuff and engine punishments.

muzikant · Dec 6, 2021

pcraenme said:
Don’t know if ‘mature’ is the correct word here when I hear his board radios… Lewis (and Mercedes) exactly know what they can get away with with the FIA it seems… you may call that ‘mature’ but ‘clever’ or ‘sneaky’ may be the better expressions here.

exactly they are protected that's why they could come back in the championship.

randomcallsign · Dec 6, 2021

muzikant said:
ridiculous? Max is my compatriot and I like those kind of racers, Villeneuve , Senna... you know what's just ridiculous punishing the others for the same and giving others no penalty at all and giving advantage. Also this weekend where Hamilton didn't get a penalty for ignoring the yellow flag and Max the same the week before. And everything else you say Monza Imola..I don't feel like going into it we just can't go racing like we used to instead of every week these idiotic penalty stuff and engine punishments.

But muh Silverstone, m9

Mike Kadlcak · Dec 6, 2021

And again.... King of dirty driving has outdone himself yesterday.

This is pathetic... in the days of Senna, Berger, Piquet, Prost ... this behaviour would have got all his points stripped and banned for at least one year from Grand Prix racing.

Mike Kadlcak · Dec 6, 2021

muzikant said:
exactly they are protected that's why they could come back in the championship.

really? who is protected? Didn't you hear the radio comm to RedBull from the pathetic Masi the way they talk to them? c'mon! Everyone knows that whats going on.

muzikant · Dec 6, 2021

Mike Kadlcak said:
really? who is protected? Didn't you hear the radio comm to RedBull from the pathetic Masi the way they talk to them? c'mon! Everyone knows that whats going on.

what about the penalties warrom is mercedes not penalized for the yellow flag... and early this year for cutting the bend 27 in bahrain? it smells

JayOTT · Dec 6, 2021

I am flabbergasted and appalled that the stewards punished Verstappen for being crashed into. The number one rule of traffic accidents on the normal roads is that if you get rear ended, the other driver is at fault. It takes an extreme set of circumstances for that to not be ruled the case, both on the public roads and a racetrack, and those circumstances were not met because Hamilton had plenty of time to assess what was going on and cease tailgating Verstappen, either by overtake or move to one side. Since he did neither of these things, the crash is clearly Hamilton's fault.

zwiss · Dec 6, 2021

JayOTT said:
I am flabbergasted and appalled that the stewards punished Verstappen for being crashed into. The number one rule of traffic accidents on the normal roads is that if you get rear ended, the other driver is at fault. It takes an extreme set of circumstances for that to not be ruled the case, both on the public roads and a racetrack, and those circumstances were not met because Hamilton had plenty of time to assess what was going on and cease tailgating Verstappen, either by overtake or move to one side. Since he did neither of these things, the crash is clearly Hamilton's fault.

Telemetry proved that Max braked excessively at the last moment when Lewis was already too close to avoid him. Simple as that. Horner and Max will be silent on this one. Max fanboys won't.

JayOTT · Dec 6, 2021

zwiss said:
Telemetry proved that Max braked excessively at the last moment when Lewis was already too close to avoid him.

And that's Hamilton's fault for being there. All Max is trying to do is let him through, you cannot blame him for trying to slow down more when he saw that Hamilton was also slowing.

Richard Wilks · Dec 6, 2021

https://i.ibb.co/WyQQNNT/arabia-2.gif

randomcallsign · Dec 6, 2021

JayOTT said:
And that's Hamilton's fault for being there. All Max is trying to do is let him through, you cannot blame him for trying to slow down more when he saw that Hamilton was also slowing.

Choose a line. Keep there. Dont loiter. Slightly lift dont hard brake. Dont wander center. Thats it. Verstappen failed all of this.
Car behind cant know if the car in front is seeing anything wrong (there were some 2 RF and 5 VSC this race).

zwiss · Dec 6, 2021

JayOTT said:
And that's Hamilton's fault for being there. All Max is trying to do is let him through, you cannot blame him for trying to slow down more when he saw that Hamilton was also slowing.

You CAN blame him for braking EXCESSIVELY when knowing another car is right behind him. And they did.
Max was playing tricks and the FIA found out. Simple.

JayOTT · Dec 6, 2021

zwiss said:
You CAN blame him for braking EXCESSIVELY when knowing another car is right behind him. And they did.
Max was playing tricks and the FIA found out. Simple.

Excessively implies that he slammed on his brakes. 2.4g is not full braking force, so the argument that Hamilton was brake checked would not hold up in small claims court, and should not hold up here either when he had plenty of time to go around.

MoerasGrizzly · Dec 6, 2021

JayOTT said:
And that's Hamilton's fault for being there. All Max is trying to do is let him through, you cannot blame him for trying to slow down more when he saw that Hamilton was also slowing.

Throughout the myriad of F1 seasons I've watched thus far, no driver has tried to "let someone through" by slamming the brakes. To quote the stewards here:

In deciding to penalise the driver of Car 33, the key point for the Stewards was that the driver of car 33 then braked suddenly (69 bar) and significantly, resulting in 2.4g deceleration.

The obvious solution here would have been to let Lewis overtake Max on the DRS straight that was coming right up. As it stands, Max Verstappen's move is either that of an iRacing rookie or deliberately malicious, and I refuse to believe that Max is an idiot.

randomcallsign · Dec 6, 2021

JayOTT said:
Excessively implies that he slammed on his brakes. 2.4g is not full braking force, so the argument that Hamilton was brake checked would not hold up in small claims court, and should not hold up here either when he had plenty of time to go around.

He slammed on the brakes. Incident was done at 100kmh from 300 just a couple of second before. Small claims court would favor the car behind, despite road rules and SCC having nothing to do with F1 racing.

Richard Wilks · Dec 6, 2021

Again this brake check talk?

They were BOTH at fault. Max was being cheeky and slowing down in his own terms to get the DRS advantage. Hamilton was hanging back because he KNEW this, he admitted as much on interviews, and stood right behind Max instead of picking the racing line, that was GIVEN to him.

Max got a 10s penalty for braking too much. But its a clear situation of takes two to tango, and these sorts of games should not be allowed from any of the parties involved. And here i can again rant and rave against the idiot DRS thing, a kneejerk solution for a problem that should have been dealt years ago in a proper manner.

JayOTT · Dec 6, 2021

randomcallsign said:
Small claims court would favor the car behind.

And that's proof that you have no idea how the law works at all. The trailing car in an end-to-end crash is assumed to be at fault at the start of any trial, and has to prove beyond reasonable doubt that they had no way of avoiding a collision due to mitigating circumstances. Since Hamilton had plenty of time to move to the left before the alleged 'brake check', his claim gets thrown out.

2021 Formula One Saudi Arabian Grand Prix

Who will win the Saudi Arabian Grand Prix?

Max Verstappen

Lewis Hamilton

Other Driver

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