PC1 Banned for no reason!

[Mapu]

Actually Bell, [...] you say it was fun for while, that's nice for you. [...]

This actually is Mr. Bell strongest statement, along with "hello haters" that disqualifies him for staking out any claims. Building up or gaining credibility? Not in this case!

It was fun for a while? Come on, this is laughable. For how long was it fun? For as long as our pro-pCars chaps were able to uphold their hands in the shallow argumentative quarrels, even dragging historic events and ideologies into sim racing mentalities, even combing them with sim racing and business models? True, that was fun to read but senseless! When were companies, products, personalities, feelings etc. hurt? By speaking out opinions? Critique, discussions that arise from it and freedom of speech is what upholds our basic social structure. I believe nobody wants to miss that. What was the initial content that caused the turn up? A specific word, a sentence, a personal assumption or maybe a false interpretation of a sentence? It must have been a recent comment since it was "fun for a while". I however don't see anything shocking in the latest comments.

Since when would it be fun to watch a so called "defamatory" campaign being fought against ones own reputation? Or like Mr. Bell writes, since when would it be fun reading of "litany of lies and libleous[sic] statements about" ones own company and product?

These topics are online and open to read and reply for the audience since a long time. Once again my question, what happened lately to turn up now? For so long until somebody finds the right moment to jump out of the bush and shout: "Arseholes, I got you now?" Sorry but either that moment has been missed long ago or somebody jumped too early. However, it does indeed look like some people have a tendency in making it too easy for themselves. I call it naïve fallacy when looking at the hilarious threat that came with it in a (not so) subtle way.

Some insults may exist here and there, but a strong person stands above them instead of making a fool out of her/himself by dragging these harmless insults, and with them their personalities, deeper into the mud by calling for stronger responses.

No Porsche from me.

 

[Kazumi]

VGChartz is known to be unreliable and the figures quoted above are complete fabrications. I happen to know for a fact that Shift sold between 8 and 9 million copies so those figures are off by more than 100%. The figures for Shift 2 were never released by EA and that's the reason I questioned the source... I knew full well that there were no accurate sales figures for Shift 2. As an excercize, try to find another source for Shift 2 sales. You people have been around long enough to know that just because something is published on the web doesn't mean it's accurate.

EA marketing sure did their job with Shift 1

I don't really see how you can say your numbers are facts though (no offense). Also you can't include the PSP versions as they were made by another british developer (and are no port of the other versions), not SMS.


I leave the numbers game to other people. It's enough to see console people suffering from innumerable bugs and issues (and being unable to fix them) which shouldn't be there in the first place and never got fixed and/or addressed in their versions of Shift. I hope one day SMS will be able to deliver a racing game without major bugs and issues on consoles, but maybe they got other priorities and we should respect that.

 

[Ian Bell]

You are welcome to report anything you consider goes personally against you or others, and therefore violates our Terms of Service.

We will inmediately take action to correct such behaviours, but we won't defend any commercial interest and therefore we won't censor any personal opinion about a product or the way it's developed if it doesn't violate our Terms of Service.

This is something is part of RD philosophy as community and independent website, as much as it is to defend developer's work by being one of the most commited communities in the encouragement of legal software use.

Check here

This is really all we have to say on this matter, as I say you can report anything you consider is out of the rules and our moderators will evaluate it.

Regarding the title of this thread, you should read it as "Rob Every says he was Banned for No Reason", like every other thread in this forum, are users who create the threads. You can read "really dissapointing" or "terrible force feedback" in other games forums, and inside sometimes users agree and sometimes don't, and sometimes the OP gets corrected... that's how an independent forum works.

Have a nice day.

You seem to have very little experience of libel law. Your terms of service can claim the moon is made of cheese, that won't change international law.

Our job shouldn't be to moderate your forum, as your posts suggests we do, at least in terms of reporting.

Personal opinion and defamatory statements have a very particular distinction. This pCARs forum is full of the former, the fact that the post has a user name at the top does not make it the latter.

This is all I have to say on the matter here. The rest we'll take to our lawyers.

 

[Ian Bell]

Actually Bell, can you point out the lies and defamatory and libleous statements anywhere?
You say it was fun for while, that's nice for you. I suppose you mean in the way your trained troll (Pimphand) riles members up? He admits to doing so on your controlled site No Grip too. And while we are on the subject can you also point out to me what legally dangerous statements are being made? Actually, can you threaten the site owners like that? I'd ban you if I owned the site purely for the threats.

You do seem to be an oddly aggressive person 'Jackson'.

I assume you'll not be taking up our kind offer

 

[David Ignjatovic]

While it was fun for a while it's been going on a little too long.

Personally, I think some of the SMS heavies have mismanaged the whole "community" thing, especially your WMD moderators who often come across as attack dogs.

 

[Ian Bell]

I was under the impression that site owners aren't liable for libelous comments made my others. That's usually what comes first in the fine print when joining a public forum.

Even if that's not the case, I'm still not sure how people moderating this forum would determine what is and what isn't a part of the "litany of lies and libleous statements", if they're not involved in the project.

Nice introduction indeed.

They most certainly are (the site owners).

 

[Ian Bell]

Personally, I think some of the SMS heavies have mismanaged the whole "community" thing, especially your WMD moderators who often come across as attack dogs.

We disagree David. There's you, Andy and about three other haters rilling around any forum that will accept them abusing pCARS. The overwhelming majority of the feedback we receive is extremely positive.

Abuse is fine BTW, it's your right. Those that post libelous statements are an entirely different issue.

 

[Ian Bell]

Now that's a bit strong. Come on, you wouldn't like that kind of thing on your forums would you? You can't just come on here and call people haters. That is plain wrong.

Sense of humour bypass there Andy. I held you in higher esteem than that, you seem to be a sensible chap, if misguided on pCARS of course

 

[Ian Bell]

It's easier to keep conversations nice if you ban and delete opposing views

Few people left because of this thread? They left then, they were not ban at least.

If we start censoring and we loose our independence many more will leave because they wouldnt want to be in such place.

I don't see insults on this thread to be honest, just hard critics sometimes, but you can report anything you perceive as offensive.

Just because you are 'independent' does not give you the right to harbour a litany of posts that are defamatory to a commercial company. You have a responsibility to moderate your own forum. The thread title alone, as I say, is a lie. IT's been here for many months though. I'm certain you were informed of this many months ago.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

We disagree David. There's you, Andy and about three other haters rilling around any forum that will accept them abusing pCARS.

I don't abuse pcars, I just give my opinion on it......also, I've said many times that I think people should buy into pcars, but don't expect iracing/rf2 type physics etc.
I'm actually quite mystified as to what you're worried about, for example, I look forward to Dirt4 because D2/3 were good games, so I suspect the same will apply with pcars, make it good, and you'll win people over.

 

[Ian Bell]

So after six years (or seven if I include GTR) of full support for your titles (GTR2, GT Legends, Shift 1 and Shift 2 Unleashed) with forums, daily club races and high quality leagues this is the way you make your first post, after all those years, to say hello to the simracing community you love so much?

Because five to ten people in this thread obviously don't like pCARS as a game we are now all of a sudden "haters"? (adding a smiley won't make it less offensive).

I have bought all games mentioned above and also will include pCARS once it is finished. If that makes me a hater then so be it.

Again Bram, it was a joke. Not quite up there with 'Hello Moose ****ers' at the Montreal comedy festival but I thought it set things off in a nice light.

Last time really, the title of this thread is a lie, it's been pointed out to be so. Any site would have at least checked if a member is opening threads with a title like that to ensure their accusation was accurate. This site has let it stay up there frankly as a pCARS hate general thread. It's not good enough.

If you don't see this thread as being a hate fest then I can only assume you haven't read it. Maybe I was referring to those that don't like pCARS? Maybe I was also lumping in teh outright lies and libelous statements.

 

[Xosé Estrada]

You seem to have very little experience of libel law. Your terms of service can claim the moon is made of cheese, that won't change international law.

Our job shouldn't be to moderate your forum, as your posts suggests we do, at least in terms of reporting.

Personal opinion and defamatory statements have a very particular distinction. This pCARs forum is full of the former, the fact that the post has a user name at the top does not make it the latter.

This is all I have to say on the matter here. The rest we'll take to our lawyers.

So be it.

 

[Ian Bell]

I don't abuse pcars, I just give my opinion on it......also, I've said many times that I think people should buy into pcars, but don't expect iracing/rf2 type physics etc.
I'm actually quite mystified as to what you're worried about, for example, I look forward to Dirt4 because D2/3 were good games, so I suspect the same will apply with pcars, make it good, and you'll win people over.

Dont expect it yet? You are aware we're working on the new physics system, I've told you so on our and another forum.

I'm not worried about anything. I actually enjoy reading troll posts. I don't enjoy us being defamed as a company though and when I see quotes from here on other forums and those quotes are lies it steps into legal territory.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

Dont expect it yet? You are aware we're working on the new physics system, I've told you so on our and another forum.

I'm not worried about anything. I actually enjoy reading troll posts. I don't enjoy us being defamed as a company though and when I see quotes from here on other forums and those quotes are lies it steps into legal territory.

I look forward to the improvements and have spoken about the NTM etc, as for damage control, that's up to you, handle it however you like, though I think you need to be mindful of any bad publicity etc, ie, big bad developer cracks down on his own community.

 

[Ian Bell]

With respect David, this forum isn't our community. It's become a gathering place for pCARS haters. Some of whom haven't even tried the game and don't want to...

 

[Kjell Eilertsen]

With respect Ian, in here you'll actually find more people who are genuinely interested in pCars and who want to see it succeed than you'll find haters. It's just that we dont troll the threads to the same extent as said haters. No reason to judge the entire RD community based on a few of the members.

 

[David Ignjatovic]

With respect David, this forum isn't our community. It's become a gathering place for pCARS haters. Some of whom haven't even tried the game and don't want to...

Try this Ian....."**** them and anyone who looks like em".
What do you care, even great sims have "haters".
If Andy is a hardcore simmer, then IMO, he should wait for the NTM, as he wants full sim and nothing less.

 

[Rupe Wilson]

Mr Ian Bell has paid a visit to our forums and all we can do is stick the boot in...
we had a perfect chance to discuss and talk openly with the developer, just like we do with AC and we end up in a war
How SAD is that..
@ Ian bell, i think some of your post should be a private conversation with admin.. we don't need to see this ...
maybe a hello haters i'm here to talk so lets talk, ask me a question and ill answer what i can..
if your abused then report it .. then you will see the admin working as they do in other posts were people have overstepped the mark..
I so want to get into this sim but i am put off by this kind of stuff from both sides..

 

[Mapu]

Washing dirty laundry in public. In general fun to look at but leaves a bitter taste. Enough said.

 

[Kazumi]

Again Bram, it was a joke.

But you were aware that most people wouldn't read it is a "a joke"? Most of your posts here make you look quite serious about a few things. Or are you implying everything you're saying today is supposed to be a joke?

If you don't see this thread as being a hate fest then I can only assume you haven't read it. Maybe I was referring to those that don't like pCARS?

Anyone is free to dislike pCars, with or without reason. That doesn't make them "haters". Why do you guys think so?