I'm thinking to buy CSW base with the gt2 rim and the v2 pedals, I'm actualy between this and the T500 RS, but I have found reports for bad reliability on fanatec products but there are all 1 year ago. Is there any new feedback on this? Have they fixed the problems or they are still there?
What to buy? Fanatec CSW or T500RS
- Thread starter Ilias Axarlis
- Start date
Kjell, I know a guy in Sweden that has had 3 CSW fail, and in each case Fanatec replaced the product, no arguments, and not once did Fanatec offer to send replacement motors for him to fit himself or refer to having the CSW fixed by a nominated repairer. As you stated, under warranty it is fanatec's or a nominated repairer's responsibility to perform any and all warranty repairs, not the consumer.
As we know if a product fails under warranty that warranty is there to protect the consumer, it also puts the product owner, Fanatec in this case, in a position of repairing or replacing the faulty product, but for Fanatec to ask the consumer to repair that faulty product themselves is a breach of that warranty, regardless of voiding the warranty or not.
UFwho,
In light of what has transpired in the past 12 hours with the retailer, I personally would be at the door of my local consumer office and be raising the roof over your problem. If in fact you find that the laws are in Fanatecs favour, take the replacement motor, fit it, test it, then sell it. Then I would look at other wheel options to satisfy your sim-racing needs. I dont blame you for being as angry as you are over the treatment you have received in regards your warranty claim, I would feel the same mate.
One thing that I have made obvious a few times in my previous posts is that even though Fanatec products are German in design, they are Chinese in manufacture. The design is purely a blue print, a piece of paper with technical drawings and specifications on it. Just because Fanatec's slogan is about quality German engineering doesn't mean it's a quality made.
Cheers!
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Yes, but I reckon he bought it from Fanatecs website and not some dodgy local distributor (since there are none in sweden to my knowledge), hence Fanatec was the ones having to take care of the issue directly. I don't get why this cruicial difference is so hard to comprehend?
Sure, but first off, considering they probably have a deal with the distributor to take care of these warranty claims, they had no obligation to help him what so ever. Second, did they expect him to change the parts himself, or offer him to do it as part of a quick resolution? I know when I got my fans replaced on my GT3, they asked me if I could do it myself, if I didn't want to I would have to send them my wheel and wait for them to replace them and return it to me, that would have taken days if not weeks, instead I got the parts in the mail a couple of days later and fixed it myself with no warranty void for opening my wheel. I consider this option GREAT customer support, not poor.
Dunno but to me it sounds like he should be pissed off with this local distributor not handling his issue correctly, rather than Fanatec. But it's all guessing as I have no idea how the deal between all of these parts are in detail and how these conversations have been worded specifically.
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Good customer/business relations are a two-way street, many people believe that it should only be on the business to respect the customer. "The customer is always Right" was coined as a business philosophy, it was never intended to be taken literally by customers. Too many people today have unrealistic expectations of what is feasible - especially for small businesses. I'm not saying that is the case here but, having respect for the business is also necessary if one wants the warranty process to work smoothly. Being a little flexible in how such things are handled can keep the lawyers working on more important issues.
Unfortunately, there are people who take unfair advantage of warranties, insurance companies, etc. They make it harder and more costly for all of us in the end and companies have to build in loopholes so they can have a way out of "impossible situations". Understanding the "fine print" within any warranty usually requires a law degree or enough money to pay someone who does.
I can see both sides of the issue as I am both a consumer and a small business owner. I feel most people do not have that same perspective and make too many assumptions about what is actually covered by any warranty. In many cases, the company retains the right to refuse warranty claims if they suspect that the claim is unreasonable, fraudulent or does not meet the requirements of the warranty limitations. Virtually all warranties are "Limited" somehow.
Unfortunately, there are people who take unfair advantage of warranties, insurance companies, etc. They make it harder and more costly for all of us in the end and companies have to build in loopholes so they can have a way out of "impossible situations". Understanding the "fine print" within any warranty usually requires a law degree or enough money to pay someone who does.
I can see both sides of the issue as I am both a consumer and a small business owner. I feel most people do not have that same perspective and make too many assumptions about what is actually covered by any warranty. In many cases, the company retains the right to refuse warranty claims if they suspect that the claim is unreasonable, fraudulent or does not meet the requirements of the warranty limitations. Virtually all warranties are "Limited" somehow.
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i also think its a retailer problem. if it had to do with the company u could find bad reports from every1 for example in this threat we have UFwho who has this experience with fanatec and in the official thread there are ppl telling stories of very good customer support. Be nice with one customer and trick the other one its kinda wierd either the customer expect things that cant be done or the retailer sucks. i see that on my job too i dont have two ways to treat customers but sometimes the customer doesnt know what hes asking. if i was in ur position m8 i would have taken the new motors and if it was not functional again i would send it back to fix it or change it or whatever. The problem here is that u refused to get the motors and u are asking for a new base and it seems that the retailer is trolling u also.
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Regardless of who is responsible for UFwho's warranty work, or wether he refused to accept and fit replacement motors himself, he has a product that is faulty and he can't use, if you look at UFwho's post's he has been given the run-around by both the distributor and Fanatec, the fact is, someone is responsible for the repairs, sure it would seem that the authorised dealer is responsible as they were the last point of contact.
But it would of been in Fanatecs best interest to take control of the situation themselves instead of trying to lay responsibility on the distributor, after all they are representing fanatec by being an authorised dealer for fanatec products.
Most warranties DONT include clauses that state the consumer must make good any repairs themselves, and if they do I wouldn't buy that product, period.
UFwho had a right to refuse to accept and install replacement motors himself, it is not his responsibility to carry out repairs on a product covered by warranty, nor is he compelled to do so.
Fanatecs warranty policy seems to be the same world wide, there is not different warranties for different countries, but there are different warranty laws put in place by each countries Government to allegedly protect consumers, it would seem that many companies/distributors take advantage of the fact 90% of consumers are not aware of the consumer laws that protect them from this type of problem.
UFwho, I would be seeking consumer legal advice, someone is responsible, and it's not you. Please let us know how things go.
Cheers!
But it would of been in Fanatecs best interest to take control of the situation themselves instead of trying to lay responsibility on the distributor, after all they are representing fanatec by being an authorised dealer for fanatec products.
Most warranties DONT include clauses that state the consumer must make good any repairs themselves, and if they do I wouldn't buy that product, period.
UFwho had a right to refuse to accept and install replacement motors himself, it is not his responsibility to carry out repairs on a product covered by warranty, nor is he compelled to do so.
Fanatecs warranty policy seems to be the same world wide, there is not different warranties for different countries, but there are different warranty laws put in place by each countries Government to allegedly protect consumers, it would seem that many companies/distributors take advantage of the fact 90% of consumers are not aware of the consumer laws that protect them from this type of problem.
UFwho, I would be seeking consumer legal advice, someone is responsible, and it's not you. Please let us know how things go.
Cheers!
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But he didnt want them to repair it, he could tell them that i dont want to repair it my self ill send it to u and u make the repairs. I dont believe they would refuse. then he packs the thing up goes to fanatecs partner gives him the package they deliver it and then fanatec will fix it or give him a new one. i cant give u a new one if i dont see whats going on with the broken one i cant do it because u just ask it. if he was mt customer i would say to him bring it to me m8 leave me a phone and ill call u, fanatec would send the motor to me and everything would be ok. instead of this he said no i dont want to repair it no i dont want to send it and he is expecting fanatec to give him a new one. this is not going to happen, if they dont see the old one they not give him the new one. actually this is a good idea ill say the same to them and have a free CSW base at home. Also warranty outside europe is 1 year not 2. Correct me if im wrong.
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This may be a good place to mention that there will be a very good upgrade available for the CSW by way of new Buhler motors with a custom cooling solution. This is a mod currently in development by eKretz over at GTplanet. Check out this thread for more info: http://www.gtplanet.net/forum/threads/fanatec-csw-csr-elite-modders-thread-update-1-2014.274631
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Could I ask who the disti is? Without info it's hard to judge your case. On the note of consumer laws/affairs: A direct exchange for a product is ONLY warranted withon 7 days of purchase as it is then classified as DOA. Anytime after that it is RTB repair warranty. Should they fail to rectify the issue within 3(!!!) attempts you have the right of turn of contract iE refund or replacement for new. THat is all there is to it. I can NOT understand why you would buy from a third party if you can buy from Fanatec direct. Was it a case of saving 50 bucks or similar? If so you have saved money at the wrong end and now blame Fanatec. Completely unacceptable.
Look I can understand your frustration having a broken toy (hate that myself), but you will need to give more info if you would like some correct advice as to what to do next.
a) which part of the world did you buy it in ?
b) who is the disti ?
c) how old is the wheel ?
d) what have you done so far to get this corrected ?
e) why did you not buy from Fanatec direct ?
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I think Fanatec only has official distributors in countries where they don't ship to themselves, but I might be wrong on that.
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This is complete rubbish!
Just because it is made in China (by the way what is not these days?) does not make this a rubbish construct. It is also not just blueprints and then the assembling line does their own thing. It's a matter of getting it assembled PRECISELY the way as intended at a fraction of the cost. The same issues would occur if the units are assembled in Germany mate. When I hear nonsense like this I loose it. Seriously.
Motors overheating is a matter of the motor manufacturer creating a bad batch not a flaw of the assembling line or QC.
Show me the Logitech or TM product that is not made in China. I rest my case.
I would also like to point out, that China is probably further evolved than Europe and the States when it comes to manufacturing. The days of cheap plastic moulds 'Made in China' are long gone. Also on that note: there is only ONE piece of plastic on the entire wheel base: The top window. Your statement would be correct if screws would fall off inside, the drive would break due to poor assembly etc. Have yet to hear about that. So let's leave the truth where it belongs, shall we?
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Not correct. In Aussie for example you can buy Fanatec from Pagnian Imports OR Fanatec direct. My point is though: IF I can buy from Fanatec direct I would ALWAYS do so as to having the better end in case of disaster. (which CAN always happen-better to be safe than sorry)
P.S.: Just found out there are also distis in Canada and the US. I think that is where the majority of issues come from tbh. That being said Pagnian was always very good here in Aussie. Go Hess!
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MarkVenom u absolutely nailed it. The info is, the motor failed after 3 months or 4 if remember, he said that in page 3 4 or 5 and fanatec said that they are gonna send him new motor. He didnt want to change the motor alone but he didnt want to send the base to fanatec hes just asking for a new one. Also his retailer told him that he has 2 years warranty which is wrong because out of EU it is 1 year.
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For a start I have never stated that the product was a "rubbish construct" not in any of my posts if you cared to read them all, and if the product WAS assembled PRECISELY "as you put it", then there would be no faults, would there. In addition to that, if their QC dept was on the ball any BAD BATCHES of components should of been screened out long before being boxed for shipping.
And to correct you, again, there are actually 3 visually noticeable pieces of plastic on a CSW base, the window, as you stated, the on/off button and the back panel.
Speaking of leaving the truth were it belongs, maybe you should check your facts before you put your foot in it next time.
Cheers!!!
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Don't take it personally. Nothing wrong with anything you've said. I'm convinced these guys either work for Fanatec in some capacity
or their equipment hasn't broken yet. They are waisting their own time to try to shoot down comments that for some strange reason seem to piss them off. This guy wants to know why I didn't buy directly from Fanatec!! .....IN GERMANY??!!! I'm not even sure why he feels the need to ask. Here is a question for him: Why would Fanatec allow anyone to be a distributor? None of this "back and forth" will change the fact that Fanatec continued to let faulty products or "Bad Batch" items go out the door long after they knew there was a serious problem. DO NOT BUY FANATEC!!!!!!!!
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OR at the minimum, they did not intsruct any resellers to hold inventory until this was all figured out.Don't take it personally. Nothing wrong with anything you've said. I'm convinced these guys either work for Fanatec in some capacity
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There is fanatec USA but u didn't know that I guess. We all know that the first had problematic motors, some of them, but that doesn't change the fact that u are asking something that can't be done.
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Don't take it personally. Nothing wrong with anything you've said. I'm convinced these guys either work for Fanatec in some capacity
Nope, I don't work for Fanatec (I wished I was though! LOL fun fun), yes some Fanatec gear I had DID break so stop assuming things and ask if you need to know.
Secondly Fanatec direct means buying off the local webstore not Germany. Tells me a lot tbh. You didn't know that? I have to agree with luisax86 in that regard. Also I would imagine, that if your attitude towards them follows the same tune when DEMANDING help that you would end up on the bottom of the importance list. I would treat you just the same. Honey catches more flies than vinegar as the figure of speech goes.
Your obvious hostility and borderline insults achieve nothing nor do they make your point anymore credible. I stand corrected about the 3 parts of plastic though. That is about it. You DID say in your previous post and I recite: 'Just because Fanatec's slogan is about quality German engineering doesn't mean it's a quality made.'
If you deny, that you meant the manufacturing/assembly then I have to say your validity just reached rockbottom my friend. As for the QC statement about motors I have to say, that this is also something that is quite outrageous actually. As Mr.T has pointed out: Many such issues can only be found once multiple thousand units are in circulation with clients and then get corrected during the manufacturing and reactively as the problem arises with live units. Not even Mercedes-Benz can guarantee a 100% fault-free rate.
Talking facts: Current CSWs are using Mabuchi 550 motors rev.2. Revision 1 CAN (emphasize CAN)fail under certain circumstances, thus the relatively easy going process of obtaining spares from Fanatec. In most cases they don't even require the usual video of the fault. The offer to send out the parts for self-repair instead of time consuming RTB repairs is quite convenient and goes to show how amicable Fanatec is. I hope this is clear enough for you to understand and please refrain yourself from telling me, that I cannot read correctly-I do not appreciate that mate.
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