Tracks Watkins Glen International

[Taranta]

 

[ALB123]

At 1:45 the narrator starts talking about the pit area and how they had to make safety changes. At 1:46 you see a pair of skid marks going straight off the pit entrance road into what I'm assuming was a crash against the retaining wall. Yeah, I guess a few changes might not be a bad idea.

 

[Emery]

At 1:45 the narrator starts talking about the pit area and how they had to make safety changes. At 1:46 you see a pair of skid marks going straight off the pit entrance road into what I'm assuming was a crash against the retaining wall. Yeah, I guess a few changes might not be a bad idea.

The narrator is Oscar Koveleski, co-founder of Polish Race Drivers of America (Tony Adamowicz is the other), driver of Can Am car 54 ("Car 54, where are you?"), perennial joker, and all-around fun guy.

Besides running Auto World (a J.C. Whitney-esque catalog of model car stuff), he also competed in the original Cannonball Baker Sea-To-Shining-Sea Memorial Trophy Dash (driving a van loaded with five 55-gallon drums of Can Am racing fuel, along with Tony Adamowicz and Brad Niemcek) and at one point owned Shelby Cobra Daytona CSX2287.

 

[ALB123]

The narrator is Oscar Koveleski, co-founder of Polish Race Drivers of America (Tony Adamowicz is the other), driver of Can Am car 54 ("Car 54, where are you?"), perennial joker, and all-around fun guy.

Besides running Auto World (a J.C. Whitney-esque catalog of model car stuff), he also competed in the original Cannonball Baker Sea-To-Shining-Sea Memorial Trophy Dash (driving a van loaded with five 55-gallon drums of Can Am racing fuel, along with Tony Adamowicz and Brad Niemcek) and at one point owned Shelby Cobra Daytona CSX2287.

Ahhh...A fellow Polack! Sounds like you don't know much about the guy. It must have been so freakin' awesome running in that Cannonball Baker race. ::sigh:: Those were the days, I guess.

All kidding aside, that pit entrance doesn't look like the safest of pit entrances. I don't believe Lilski has committed to the project, but it would be interesting to see how the 1970s version compares to today's track from a driving perspective.

@LilSki - if you decide to do the 70s at some point in the future, will you be able to use much of your modern Watkins Glen circuit? Or would it just be easier to start over instead of trying to transform the modern track into the 70s track?

 

[LilSki]

Ahhh...A fellow Polack! Sounds like you don't know much about the guy. It must have been so freakin' awesome running in that Cannonball Baker race. ::sigh:: Those were the days, I guess.

All kidding aside, that pit entrance doesn't look like the safest of pit entrances. I don't believe Lilski has committed to the project, but it would be interesting to see how the 1970s version compares to today's track from a driving perspective.

@LilSki - if you decide to do the 70s at some point in the future, will you be able to use much of your modern Watkins Glen circuit? Or would it just be easier to start over instead of trying to transform the modern track into the 70s track?

Yes 1970 Watkins will be a thing. When exactly I cannot say. I might work on Greenwood or Augusta right after this Watkins just to change it up a bit. The plus side is these vintage tracks are overall much simpler to make due to the lack of track side objects.

Not sure yet how much the current track can be used as it does need to be 10 feet more narrow. I still have the track on the spline in older files so it should be simple to put it on the slim fast plan and then graft it into most of the existing terrain. Then some berms will have to created around much of the track. Also in many pictures the grass is wild and uncut so in many places it will have a "bridgehampton" look with the tall grass.

I'm really curious how many cars I can squeeze in the pit lane. I'll have to test to see how much angle a car can be to the pit box and have it still do the stop. Because unless they are at an angle you won't get much more than like 10-15 cars in the pits. At the angles shown in pictures I think I saw 30+ spots.

Also just to be clear we are talking about 1970 Watkins not 70s. As from 71/72 on it was the current layout it is today.

 

[Ryno917]

Also just to be clear we are talking about 1970 Watkins not 70s. As from 71/72 on it was the current layout it is today.

What years did they run with a chicane in the esses? IIRC there were 2-3 different incarnations of it throughout the years. I believe they were all after 1970, though (thankfully).

 

[LilSki]

What years did they run with a chicane in the esses? IIRC there were 2-3 different incarnations of it throughout the years. I believe they were all after 1970, though (thankfully).

1974-1985 had the esses chicane. I did have the thought of including it in addition to the current modern "classic boot" layout since the road they used is still there and is already modeled. BUT I really don't think it is worth any effort as I don't think anybody would ever use it.

 

[Tom Blackett]

I would use it

 

[CobraCat]

Yes 1970 Watkins will be a thing. When exactly I cannot say. I might work on Greenwood or Augusta right after this Watkins just to change it up a bit. The plus side is these vintage tracks are overall much simpler to make due to the lack of track side objects.

One of the reasons I have an affinity for the older tracks is the lack of track side objects. IMHO it gives circuits a more natural feel, closer to a public road.

I'd love to see more tracks with minimal TSOs, something akin to how Nords or classic Zandvoort looks.

 

[ALB123]

One of the reasons I have an affinity for the older tracks is the lack of track side objects. IMHO it gives circuits a more natural feel, closer to a public road.

I'd love to see more tracks with minimal TSOs, something akin to how Nords or classic Zandvoort looks.

Lilski already made the Holy Grail of tracks with minimal TSOs...New Jersey Motorsports Park!! I've never counted, but I'm going to guess there are probably 10 total orange cones at various turns and a couple of braking markers. That's it.

It's weird...for as much as I love the way it looks - at the same time I think Fat-Alfie's Thomson Road Grand Prix Circuit is spectacular with the massive number of TSOs. Heck, there's tree limbs hanging over the darn track! But at the same time, you totally feel you're in some 1959 or 1965 race with all of those signs everywhere.

Either way can be great and either way can be awful. That's what separates good artists from terrible artists, like me.

 

[LilSki]

This combo came for a hot lap challenge. Did some laps last night and made a quick video of the best one. Some minor additions to the track can be seen such as the distant terrain. I haven't driven the Cobra at speed in a looong time. It is a lot of fun once you get the hang of it.

Capture cut off the time but it was a 2:01.88 if I remember correctly.

 

[Jebus]

I would use it

So would I. If it was used in real life and there's cars in game that used it then I would use it too for sure.

I can live "just" with the current layouts too though.

 

[Ryno917]

This combo came for a hot lap challenge. Did some laps last night and made a quick video of the best one. Some minor additions to the track can be seen such as the distant terrain. I haven't driven the Cobra at speed in a looong time. It is a lot of fun once you get the hang of it.

Capture cut off the time but it was a 2:01.88 if I remember correctly.

Glad to see that I'm not the only one who doesn't consistently nail the apex in the heel the boot!

 

[LilSki]

Glad to see that I'm not the only one who doesn't consistently nail the apex in the heel the boot!

It's tricky in this car for sure. It is not a fan of the lower grip on the curbs so I tended to stay away from them.

 

[Ryno917]

It's tricky in this car for sure. It is not a fan of the lower grip on the curbs so I tended to stay away from them.

That car is not a fan of me being in it all, curbs or not!

 

[LilSki]

That car is not a fan of me being in it all, curbs or not!

Well the stock setup is pretty terrible. Once you calm it down some it is a lot nicer to drive.

 

[Ryno917]

Well the stock setup is pretty terrible. Once you calm it down some it is a lot nicer to drive.

I really need to learn how to set up a car.

 

[Shigeno427]

I really need to learn how to set up a car.

I'd always just assumed it was 'because Cobra' and have never even looked at the setup!

 

[ALB123]

I really need to learn how to set up a car.

I concur. Everytime someone writes, "The stock setup isn't very good, but once you make a few simple adjustments, she's a dream..." I feel like nodding my head in agreement, but it only makes the pain last longer. I never learned to tune!

I'm not going to come close to Lilski's time, but this is definitely the first combo I'm driving today.

 

[AccAkut]

I concur. Everytime someone writes, "The stock setup isn't very good, but once you make a few simple adjustments, she's a dream..." I feel like nodding my head in agreement, but it only makes the pain last longer. I never learned to tune!

also that those people then almost never explain just what exactly they changed Earlier this week I spent two hours with a (real life) setup guru...initial drive followed by ten minutes of him rambling about the flaws of the handling... followed by me asking "...how do i change?" - "Rollcentres need to be there and this degree in line to this unicorn and that inclination of Saturn-" - "...and how do I do that?"

we made it work in the end