• Welcome to the largest (sim) racing website in the world!
    Blurring the line between real and virtual motorsports.

Featured Thoughts and Considerations after the Canadian GP

Discussion in 'Formula 1' started by leon_90, Jun 12, 2019.

  1. leon_90

    leon_90
    Columnist for RaceDepartment Staff

    Messages:
    735
    Ratings:
    +1,099
    canada_mercedes_hamilton.jpg

    A discussion about what is probably not working as it should today in F1.


    After the events that unfolded during the recent 2019 Canadian GP, we are left to wonder if Formula 1 is really heading into the right direction or, maybe, it is going straight into a concrete wall that might mark its definitive end. At least, as the most prestigious series in the motorsports, the pinnacle of racing and technology.

    For those who might not know, this is what happened: Sebastian Vettel, who was leading the race in his Ferrari, was handed a five seconds penalty for unsafe re-joining on the track after going wide at Turn 3. When back on track, he slid almost against the outer wall, closing the way for an overtake to his following opponent, Lewis Hamilton on Mercedes.

    In this instance, I believe we have witnessed everything that is wrong or simply not working as it should in current F1.

    To start with, the penalty should have been handed after the race, not while it was still running. We could go on and on discussing if the penalty was right or wrong. I believe we all have different opinions on the subject and it would be pointless to discuss this. I think, however, that everyone can agree that by handing the penalty to Vettel during the race, they killed the race itself. The German driver lost focus, because you can be a professional and have your mind in the game as much as you want, but it is inevitable that knowing something unsettling like this, it gets to the back of your brain and it stays there until you cool it off. Hamilton instead, had no longer any interest in overtaking the Ferrari, and risking an accident by doing so. He knew that everything he had to do was to pursue his opponent and stay behind him at a reasonable distance. The battle for 1st place was finished and so was the race, with a third of the distance still to cover. For a series that is seeing a worrying drop in audience on media platforms and in attendance levels on track, and that is constantly looking for ways to level out the field for spectacle, what was the point of that? They could have waited the end of the race, take the chance to listen to both sides of the story, confront again the replays, and then act. What they did was instead shooting themselves in the foot, and attract in the following days such a level of bad publicity and discontent that it will take much effort to clear the air now.

    vettel_hamilton_podium_canada.jpg

    Second issue is, the uselessness of appealing against an FIA decision. Ferrari did the only sensible thing they could, move against the penalty inflicted, asking the FIA commission to look again at the case and judge whether it was correct or not to blame Vettel for closing Hamilton into the wall with him. Again, we could argue if the penalty was rightfully inflicted or not in the first place, but anyone can agree that it is a right for someone to defend himself against what he/she believes it’s bad justice. What should happen is that, if you are found innocent, your sentence should be re-formulated. This is not what happens with FIA though. Even if they understand that a penalty was misgiven, the result of the race remains sealed. It is as if you go to prison, your lawyer proves that it was not you to commit the crime, the judge declares you innocent but you still have to serve your time in jail. We need a solid commission from FIA, having nominated members that stay always the same from race to race, able to be consistent with their judgement and following clear indications about general situations that may occur, and against which it is actually meaningful to appeal. What we have now is not consistent, not reliable and unethically unfair.

    Third issue, drivers need to be sportsmen again. In this case, it was Hamilton, but every single one of the current F1 drivers is the same. Every time there is as much as a bit of contact, or a driver closes the line, they cry aloud on team radio asking FIA to take action. What about going heads down and race instead? As someone said, this is what happens with drivers that have been grown in a vivarium, rather than making their own way into the series as it happened in the past. Now we have these kids, rich enough or talented enough to be spotted by a sponsor at a very young age, and nursed into becoming a racing driver. Obviously, they lack the roughness of spirit of someone who has made himself. Drivers of the past raced one another, never gave up position without a fight, but at the same time never put another driver in harm’s way, because they knew that going off track might result in a serious injury or even death. Nowadays, we have drivers who think that everything should be handed their way, but they themselves have no obligation towards others (the behaviour of lapped drivers is the most striking example). Therefore, when they decide to block aggressively, they do incredibly stupid things, putting in danger other people lives, because thank God safety today is what it is, and so they take unnecessary chances knowing, or rather assuming that, everything will result in nothing serious. They take it as a game, rather than a sport. This is what is seriously wrong with modern F1 drivers. They need to be trained to have a different consciousness about what they are doing, and what are they supposed to do on track. They need a fresher and healthier mentality.

    rindt_stewart_silverstone_1969.jpg
    Stewart and Rindt were locked in a wheel to wheel battle for much of the 1969 British Grand Prix

    Finally yet importantly, cars do not help in the matter. These sort of vessels, torpedoes 4 meters long with tons of downforce, do not make for a great spectacle. The fact that the pinnacle of racing and technology, as we were saying at the beginning of the article, as turned into a levelled out, single make series, does not help either. Everyone with the same engines, same tyres, same gearboxes (intended as gear ratios), same strict regulations for suspensions, brakes, aero. Do I need to state the obvious? This is no longer Formula 1. We need innovations, diversity, and freedom of interpretation. Obviously, this would create many problems, with the FIA that would need to be on the lookout for any infringement in the rules, but we cannot relinquish what is the spirit of the series just to make sure everything is as under control as it possibly could. We do not need less safety, as many state, to have again a challenging and fun series. No. We need bravery, the will to do things different, to think differently and accept to be different. We live in a world that is so afraid of what is diverse, that it is trying to water everything down to the same thing. No. Differences are what makes us unique, and give us strength as humans. Competition can only come from a confrontation of different solutions and ideas, stating from time to time which is the best among them. This is key to growth. Of course, the same can apply to track layouts, indecently similar between themselves. Moreover, they cannot talk about costs, when the names involved today are the like of Mercedes, Ferrari, Renault, Alfa Romeo, Red Bull, McLaren, Williams, which are all billionaire companies related one way or another to industrial production.

    We need F1 to have courage again, which comes from the Latin and it means, “To act with the heart”. In an aseptic society, at least sport should remember us that we are creatures made of emotions and sentiment. That we haven’t got just a brain to feed, but a hearth to get pumping too.

    vettel_hamilton_smile.jpg

    Like what we do at RaceDepartment? Follow us on Social Media!

    Instagram
    Youtube
    Twitch
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
    • Love Love x 15
    • Like Like x 10
    • Agree Agree x 7
    • Disagree Disagree x 5
  2. LeSunTzu

    LeSunTzu
    Premium

    Messages:
    548
    Ratings:
    +983
    That will draw clicks and please a lot of people, but it does not make any sense.

    F1 cars are the fastest ever; driver safety is objective number 1; safety on a city track requires drivers to behave because there are almost no run-off areas. With that in mind, if you think it goes into the wrong direction to give a penalty for dangerous behavior on track, stop complaining about F1 and watch super trucks or nascar where they can afford being less keen on safety.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 27
    • Agree Agree x 22
    • Love Love x 1
  3. ears

    ears
    Listen, we're bona fide, we're not from London.

    Messages:
    1,033
    Ratings:
    +498
    I do know, but I do not agree that this is what happened.

    Vettel didn't run wide, he made a mistake and cut the chicane.

    And whether or not he slid almost to the outer wall is down to opinion.

    I don't think he did. The stewards studied video evidence - including video feeds we did not see - and they thought he gained control earlier too.
     
    • Agree Agree x 16
    • Disagree Disagree x 8
    • Haha Haha x 1
  4. LeSunTzu

    LeSunTzu
    Premium

    Messages:
    548
    Ratings:
    +983
    He did not slide to the wall for sure. No slide at all. He corrected some small oversteer and was just slightly less than 2 meters away from the wall in the end.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 3
  5. Authense

    Authense
    So fast I am slow Premium

    Messages:
    151
    Ratings:
    +53
    Shouldn't race driving be dangerous in the first place? What is the point if it was no longer dangerous at all? Hell, what would Max do in that case?

    A penalty for dangerous "behavior"? Really? Some comments debate deliberate vs. unintentionally running wide and cutting Lewis line etc. How would they know anyone's intentions?

    But what is the "behavior" part in what we can see on TV anyways?

    It is a split second, some action on the wheel, some on the brakes, some attempt to save the car. And in between those hundreds of a second, Vettel makes a plan for how to be a very misbehaved driver? And of course, "fairness" and "safety first" forbid trying to bring it back, trying to make the best of it.

    If there is a rule now that even without hitting the wall or hitting Lewis, you get a 5sec penalty for just trying to safe the car, then this sport is toast.

    Sorry, but you couldn't even save the car any better in 100 attempts in any of our Racing Sims and please, of course with all aids off.
     
    • Agree x 16
    • Disagree x 6
    • Like x 3
    • Beer x 3
    • Love x 1
  6. neuer31

    neuer31

    Messages:
    646
    Ratings:
    +174
    I think moreover they also saw that he could have cut over the grass a lot more, making a much safer rejoin to the track. I am happy that I am not the only one seeing that Vettel could have made a much more safe entry and that he possibly didn't, to keep the lead and "block off" Hamilton.
    Great, lets have death races ...
    Since when is entertainment more important than the lives of the ones (drivers, teams, marshals, spectators, etc.) involved?
    We both know it feels more than just an instant, you have enough time to think and react accordingly, you can chose between focusing on keeping the lead or rejoining safely. It is obvious what Vettel chose.
    You have no idea of racing, he was not out of control. On the grass he had full control, he chose that reentry angle. Okay unfortunate how he hit the kerb with the rears, but even after catching that, he chose to again open the steering wheel. If you can't see that you are (a) blind (hater/fanboy)

    If you are driving yourself, you would know that dangerous rejoins are unacceptable.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
    • Disagree Disagree x 21
    • Agree Agree x 8
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Authense

    Authense
    So fast I am slow Premium

    Messages:
    151
    Ratings:
    +53
    There is some space between "death races" and "race driving being dangerous" - but if you believe it got to be either one of them or Kindergarten bobby car races, well then there you go...
     
    • Agree Agree x 6
    • Disagree Disagree x 3
    • Like Like x 2
    • Beer Beer x 2
  8. Koen Verlinde

    Koen Verlinde

    Messages:
    637
    Ratings:
    +211
    Doesn't matter what we think or suggest, as long as people of the FIA or Liberty Media and once well respected people like Pirro make decisions like that while still receiving millions of currency, things will not change.
     
    • Agree Agree x 9
    • Beer Beer x 2
    • Disagree Disagree x 2
    • Like Like x 1
  9. falster

    falster
    Premium

    Messages:
    207
    Ratings:
    +91
    Lets not at all bother talking about anything then.....

    Decent enough piece to be honest. always going to be polarising when you do a sort of OP-ED piece,

    but you could come on here, or indeed anywhere on the internet stating blue is blue and youll get 50% agreeing 25% disagreeing 15% arguing because theyre bored 5% branching off onto a completely irrelevant discussion and 5% coming on and saying Trump is bad....for some reason..... (interestingly 99% of the time seem to be non US citizens...always makes me smile)

    I have enjoyed F1 and indeed motor racing for the best part of 35-40 ish years on and off, and as much as I love most disciplines, I think they are all headed for a change. what with hybrid tech and the idea of developing out Petrol engines changing a hell of a lot of ideals, manufacturers leaving, newer generations of drivers, the overall state of play with governing bodies etc.

    I think its getting harder and harder to enjoy the things you used to, due to things like this. I also don't feel they are spectator sports anymore, not as much as they used to be.

    Look at NASCAR for example in the states, its a huge part of their racing history, but in the last 10 years since 2009, the stadiums are barely full, the crazy rule changes have really ruined aot of racing, and the older more interesting characters of the grid have retired/moved on, I think Tony "smoke " Stewart was the last one.

    we will see I guess.
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
    • Like Like x 4
    • Agree Agree x 3
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  10. Authense

    Authense
    So fast I am slow Premium

    Messages:
    151
    Ratings:
    +53
    Well, besides thousands of hours in Sim Racing I am out on track with my GTS 991 almost every month. And you? :cool:
    Bring it up...
     
    • Beer Beer x 1
  11. Koen Verlinde

    Koen Verlinde

    Messages:
    637
    Ratings:
    +211
    Not what I meant, certainly not up to that degree.

    What I did try to put forward was that trying to bring forth solutions or suggestions to multimillion dollar companies or concerns or whatever they are from a simcommunity with maybe a few hundreds or thousand of members isn't even going to shiver their daily agenda.

    So to conclude my point:
    We can talk all we want about it, it's not going to change their point of view. Not unless they see their revenue decrease which remains the only important thing for them.
     
    • Agree Agree x 7
    • Beer Beer x 1
  12. Authense

    Authense
    So fast I am slow Premium

    Messages:
    151
    Ratings:
    +53
    Totally agree, Koen.
     
    • Beer Beer x 2
  13. falster

    falster
    Premium

    Messages:
    207
    Ratings:
    +91
    was just sort of playing a devils advocate again, up to a point. As most of us are here, id imagine we will always have an interest in Motor racing.

    Some times its good to get a good discussion going
     
  14. falster

    falster
    Premium

    Messages:
    207
    Ratings:
    +91
    At me?

    weird flex but alright
     
  15. HK2014

    HK2014

    Messages:
    128
    Ratings:
    +52
    About the run-off areas i have to disagree. modern F1 tracks are purposely built/modified to have those big run-off areas wich is a shame because most of the time it does not penalize enough drivers that go off track. then of course we have some tracks like monaco, canada, singapore where the walls are very close and there are almost no margin for error but it is why it makes it exciting.
     
    • Agree Agree x 8
  16. Koen Verlinde

    Koen Verlinde

    Messages:
    637
    Ratings:
    +211
    Good discussion is one thing, getting an echo chamber is sadly occurring too often. Regardless I already communicated my point about this - which doesn't devalue the opening post or yours, or any other - so I let you all to it :)
     
  17. falster

    falster
    Premium

    Messages:
    207
    Ratings:
    +91
    er, righto.
     
  18. MarkR

    MarkR

    Messages:
    514
    Ratings:
    +539
    The human desire to race and win is centuries older than cars and will outlast the near future electrification/automation of personal transport.

    Horseracing, in particular, has had the formula perfected for generations.

    + Handicapping works superbly, ballast or BoP does the same job for cars. Horseshoes that don't last a full race never did catch on.

    + Course types and surface 'going' mean there is no one horse for every course.

    + Danger, risk and courage are part of the spectacle.

    + All the 'drivers' have one horsepower to work with though that is never equal.

    - Cheating, organised crime run gambling, and attempts to gain illegal advantage are rife. Name a sport where this isn't the case?

    F1 is ignoring these centuries-old racing truths.

    - F1 was the pinnacle of motor racing innovation. Now it's a rule-bound sport dominated by those who find the technical loophole or out budget the rest.

    - No BoP or ballast when teams are dominating makes the spectacle predictable. Monaco has been reduced to a marketing exercise.

    - Courses have become homogenous due to the Tilke effect.

    - Budgets, teams and development costs are massively unbalanced.

    The answers:

    +++ Allow F1 to once again be the true pinnacle of motoring development. Almost anything goes to achieve the absolute fastest vehicle to lap the appointed tracks. Combustion, hybrid, electric, hydrogen, ?? power should be racing side by side by now. That's where the true innovation will come from.

    +++ Handicapping to prevent domination and keep the on-track racing interesting.

    +++ Varied courses and circuits to stop one setup dominating. Multiple tyre manufacturers all racing to develop the absolute fastest and most durable tyres.

    +++ Danger, driver ability and real racing would be reintroduced by the search for innovation and the effect of handicapping.

    +++ Get in touch with the global trend for caring about use of resources, divide team points by the total budget and energy used by each car. Let's see who really wins on cost per point.

    -- Cheating, rule-bending, unethical driving behaviour and gambling will only increase as the prize and prestige increases.
     
    • Agree Agree x 5
    • Like Like x 2
    • Beer Beer x 2
    • Disagree Disagree x 1
  19. Diogo Goetz Brand

    Diogo Goetz Brand

    Messages:
    220
    Ratings:
    +143
    I do think that Formula One is not as entertaining as it might be, but not punishing dangerous maneuvers is not the right way to make it exciting.
     
    • Disagree Disagree x 6
    • Agree Agree x 3
  20. JTRaceFan17

    JTRaceFan17

    Messages:
    120
    Ratings:
    +57
    Let the drivers drive, the teams setup their cars like the drivers want (Including gears because fixed gears are nonsense), and the engines get closer to what F1 was back in 2013!! High revs FTW!
     
    • Agree Agree x 6
  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.