My first SimRig build!

[DrRob]

Gents,

after playing on a wheelstand setup for quite some years, I decided to upgrade to a proper rig. I was always hesitant to litter the living room witha full blown rig, so made do with a GT Omega "Classic".

The whole journey started for me with a PS3, GranTurismo 5, a 100" front projection home theater setup and a Thrustmaster T500RS with TH8A. Later I switched to a PC with R3E and AC, modified the pedals with stiffer Mardo Media springs, upgraded to a TM Sparco 383mod, added a Nextion display and braced the wheelstand including Sofa hook-up.

Now playing mostly ACC and got a taste of what it is like with a proper rig and DD wheel which left me wanting.
I guess it is time for a radical change....and even got permission from the missus.

 

[DrRob]

Cheers @Andrew_WOT !
Well initially I wanted to keep my options. Didn't want to miss out on the new X feet, but loved the idea with the casters.
With 4 casters I would have felt uncomfortable with our rather soft parquet floor. Wifey was even more concerned than I was. I ordered 2 sets of overall 8 casters. Installed 6 in the end: 4 at the back and two below the uprights.

To be fair it worked perfectly. I could get in and out of the rig without any fear of toppling the rig. Brakes worked as they should.
Seeing how less I used the casters in the end and how much better the looks are with the X feet I removed the casters.
Plus I wanted to have both from the start: X feet for normal use, lower on casters when needed, which didn't work. I talked about that earlier.

 

[DrRob]

@RCHeliguy I was more concerned about looks to be honest. As is, the rig looks quite slick. Bulky, yes, but even my wife likes the techno-style. Adding too much stuff might not look as clean and cabling will get in the way of clean looks.

Plus neighbors might get annoyed. I completely turned off the subwoofer on the homecinema setup and reduced the I-Beam volume, since I got complaints watching action movies. I remember the neighbor banging on my door while we were watching "Fury" with Brad Pitt. That tank was quite "present" at times. Needless to say I have quality isolation pucks under the sub and the sofa. But still...
This might all change tho when we move houses.

 

[RCHeliguy]

Everyone has real world constraints.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Cheers @Andrew_WOT !
Well initially I wanted to keep my options. Didn't want to miss out on the new X feet, but loved the idea with the casters.
With 4 casters I would have felt uncomfortable with our rather soft parquet floor. Wifey was even more concerned than I was. I ordered 2 sets of overall 8 casters. Installed 6 in the end: 4 at the back and two below the uprights.

To be fair it worked perfectly. I could get in and out of the rig without any fear of toppling the rig. Brakes worked as they should.
Seeing how less I used the casters in the end and how much better the looks are with the X feet I removed the casters.
Plus I wanted to have both from the start: X feet for normal use, lower on casters when needed, which didn't work. I talked about that earlier.

Hmm, some good points. You said you get some furniture teflon sliders. What size, I might go this route as well?

 

[DrRob]

Hmm, some good points. You said you get some furniture teflon sliders. What size, I might go this route as well?

I got the largest size with dia 65 mm. They are called "piano teflon gliders". They can take several 100kgs, so no worries with durability. Sorry I do not have a UK/US link, but I got mine here.
Over here they are available through ebay and amazon as well.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Great, thanks, what is the diameter of the rubber feet, I see it's larger than the pad on your picture.
And btw, I guess if you are planning to move it around on hardwood floor, felt pads would be a better choice as teflon is usually for carpeted surfaces.
Something like this can cover both cases, larger too, 3.5".

 

[DrRob]

Great, thanks, what is the diameter of the rubber feet, I see it's larger than the pad on your picture.
And btw, I guess if you are planning to move it around on hardwood floor, felt pads would be a better choice as teflon is usually for carpeted surfaces.
Something like this can cover both cases, larger too, 3.5".

Maybe I am misreading your request. The Teflon gliders are 65mm outer Diameter. The original rubber inserts are of similar size, the P1-X feet plastic cups are 80mm.
See here:

Generally I am avoiding rubber feet after getting a softener transfer from the rubber to the parquet floor. With UV light you'll get nice, black spots you can only remove by grinding.

I reckoned that for the P1-X I need a solid rubber puck to absorb vibrations plus a surface that will not harm the floor. Doesn't matter if you use soft felt pads or harder teflon pads, any dust that collects between the pad and the floor will bring scratches when you move the rig. Our parquet floor is really, really soft. I hate it.
Even moving the sofa with felt pads will give me scratches....
But cheers for the link anyway!

 

[DrRob]

Was using my free time to do some research regarding tactile transducers.

Thanks to @RCHeliguy I got aware of the Aura Pro transducer. I'd like to mount it directly to the seat below my bum. Will think of a reinforcing metal plate and drill through the resin.
I asked my brother as he did that before on his GT Omega rig, and he gave me a green light.

I found this small mono-sub amp with crossover: Nobsound G2. I'd like to use a Sim-Lab mousepad to mount the amp to the rig below the seat.

If that proves worthwile I will think about adding one more Aura Pro to the pedal tray. I would then add some rubber absorbers to decouple the pedal base heal plate from the P1-X pedal tray.
I already asked at Heusinkveld if the Sprints would possibly take damage when taking tactiler transducer loads. They seemed confident that the Sprints can take it, but without detailled experiences with that.

@all: Any of you can shed some light regarding pedals (electronics, mechanics) taking damage from transducers?

 

[RCHeliguy]

HE specifically said that their Sprints were EMI sheilded and transducer friendly.

I should add that mine have been rock solid and haven't had any issues.

 

[leosor]

Good advice from Barry there! Please report back, when you set yours up!

Been collecting all kinds of pictures of real world GT cars seating position to get a feel for how I want to set it up. Will mount the pedals in a way, that my heels will be the same height as my bum. There is a pic I borrowed from Skoda (Rally not GT mind you), but it captures really well the seating position I want.View attachment 332090

I'm also sketching a cockpit.

https://www.racedepartment.com/threads/my-cockpit-3d.176539/#post-3089823

I'm reading and finding a lot of disagreement about driver ergonomics.

Ref.: http://icas.org/ICAS_ARCHIVE/ICAS2008/PAPERS/002.PDF

 

[DrRob]

@leosor Thanks for sharing. Seems like you are going the traditional street car seating position. I've gone a different way with a bucket seat, which requires different setup than a typical car seat. Also I wanted to replicate GT3/GT4 cockpit ergonomics, which are different to street car ergonomics.

Looks good so far! I've seen your thread and will see how you progress!

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Not a transducer expert by any means, just curios why Aurora instead of more often recommended and more powerful BK Mini-LFE, or ADX Maximus if smaller size is needed.
As for transducers on pedals, I have read that vibration introduces jitter to load cell reading and it's better to mount them to rig frame instead.

 

[RCHeliguy]

If you can find an ADX Maximus, buy it! They are gone. By most accounts they are better.
The BK Mini-LFE is junk. People blow them up all the time or they overheat and just stop mid game.
The BK LFE on the other hand is a beast, but it requires serious power to drive it. It's rated for 400W at 4ohms.

So you have a $50 Aura Pro that runs well on under 100W at 4 ohms meaning a small inexpensive amp or you have the $300 BK LFE and an amp that can push it like a Behringer NU 6000 which is typically $550 or so. Don't bother with a BK LFE unless you have some power behind it.

The Aura Pro is at a sweet spot for price and performance and sips power. I know I don't have the best tactile system out there by a long shot, but with 4 channels it works surprisingly well in terms of adding to the immersion. Motion gives you all the big queues, but tactile adds texture and compliments a motion system well. I've had very good luck with mine that I've had for a while now. They haven't blown, or overheated and work well facing up/down or vertically.

With regard to pedals. The Sprints are transducer friendly. If you've seen my setup, the transducers are mounted to the heel plate which is isolated from the rest of the pedal deck. If I'm pressing hard on the brake and my heel is off the plate, I don't feel much. I get anti-lock brake pulses through my motion system.

FYI, as far as size goes they are all sort of similar. The Aura and ADX have 4 mounting holes on 4" centers. The BK LFE has four holes on 3.5 and 4.5" centers. The bigger issue is that the LFE is about 10lbs. and the Aura and ADX are about 4-5lbs. The mini-LFE has a tripod configuration.

I've heard from no less than 5 people not to ever get the BK mini-LFE's and from a number of others that they had driven their Aura's at well over their rated capacity for ages with no ill effects.

 

[Deleted member 197115]

Didn't know about problems with Mini-LFE, thought that's what SimXperience (Simvibe company) recommends for typical setup.
My set is 5 years old, still going strong, knocking on the wood. Was planning to get another pair for front of the chassis when P1-X arrives.

Wasn't aware that ADX is discontinued, thanks for the info.

 

[leosor]

@leosor Thanks for sharing. Seems like you are going the traditional street car seating position. I've gone a different way with a bucket seat, which requires different setup than a typical car seat. Also I wanted to replicate GT3/GT4 cockpit ergonomics, which are different to street car ergonomics.

Looks good so far! I've seen your thread and will see how you progress!

@DrRob It was good to have found your post. I will make an adjustment to leave the seat with tuning for street car and GT. I will continue to absorb knowledge. I will follow your post too.

 

[RCHeliguy]

I have started to LOVE being in a reclined position and my NRG Prisma has grown on me a lot too. I don't want to be in a street position ever again if I can avoid it at least on my rig.

Damn my daily driver! My car almost feels wrong now

 

[DrRob]

Since the power strip and the new keyboard are unfortunately still not with me, the cable clean-up has also not progressed. As I was focussing on ergonomics from the beginning of the build I continued working on creature comfort in the meantime.

I was playing with some pieces of left over memory foam to form a better lumbar support. As I was never completely happy with the result, I bought two back rest cushions from OMP (HB-662S and HB-692S) and concluded my search for a good lumbar support. I velcro'ed them to the seat back and the original cushion goes on top. Works a charm.
Since I also wanted a possibility to rest my head while driving to have less strain on my neck/shoulder muscles (i am prone to cramping here), I added a car neck cushion which I found on Amazon. Used some velcro strip to fix it to the seat. The cushion thankfully has some loops for fixation I could work with.
These additions helped me a lot to get even more comfortable in the SimLab seat even during longer sessions!


An other thing that bugged me was footwear. With the Heusinkveld I was neither happy with driving barefoot, nor with regular sneakers. The former gave me not enough support regarding the soles of my feet, the latter dampened the feel and made my feet sweat during longer sessions.
I found a perfect solution right in the middle! Cheapo Aqua Shoes from Amazon did the trick for me. The rubbery shoe sole gives plenty of grip and support, but is thin enough to not dampen the feel for the pedals. The rest of the shoes is very thin and breatheable fabric.
I can recommend these or similar Aqua or Beach shoes!


Another thing was a more elaborate dash for my Nextion. The previous laptimes counter is now accompanied by a fuel gauge plus rest driving time and PC health stats. When in idle / desktop mode it will show more detailled computer health stats.


Next will hopefully the long awaited power strip, cable cleanup and the new keyboard....

 

[DrRob]

As my new keyboard and the power strip arrived, I began organizing the cables.

The power strip is made for 19" rack installations and can be bolted to the aluminium extrusion. I did this with the power outlets facing down. All went well, until I realized, that I will get a problem with those pesky external power supply sockets. What a pain in the butt! I hate them.
So still running a make-shift solution with some more parts on order. Hopefully I will get a satisfying solution then. I ordered some shorter 0.4m power plugs for the SimuCube2 btw as the original ones were far too long.


For the cable routing I used some double sided velcro strip to tie cables together and added a surrounding neoprene/velcro cable conduit to the main stream of cables. I used the existing SimLab cable pods and removable cable ties to secure them to the aly construction. It worked out well in the end with a neat and tidy appearance.


As for the keyboard I wanted to order the OEM Havit non-numblock item with red Kailh switches. I have the blue Kailh version with num-block on my other computer. Really happy with it, but wanted to try the red switches on the new one. I ended up with the reseller version from Sharkoon due to availability and shipping costs. Downside of that one is the absence of the Havit configuration tool (config only per keyboard) and the slightly less neat key markings compared to the Havit product.


The Thrustmaster 383mod has served me well these past weeks, but with the keyboard in place it became evident, that it not only blocks the lower half of the screen, but also portions of the keyboard. As I wanted to use the computer also for non-simracing things without having to removing the wheel everytime, I was on the fence for a new wheel. To be honest the TM creaked quite a bit under the DD load at times, which also was a factor.


Hence I was mulling over the purchase of a new wheel. As these can pretty expensive, I took my time to look for a suitable one. Truth to be told from the start of the build I was aware, that I would invest in a more professional wheel someday.

For the longest time I was set on purchasing an Ascher F64-USB. It had the most sought after features of a rigid frame, rotary encoders, funky switches, lots of buttons and a compact size. The only gripe I had without ever holding the wheel was its small diameter of only 282mm. I wanted one with ~300mm+.
As the Ascher wheel was/is not available anyway, I ended up searching the market for some alternatives. And to end this post with a cliffhanger.... I found one which is en route to me via DHL.

Stay tuned!

 

[M D Gourley]

And to end this post with a cliffhanger.... I found one which is en route to me via DHL.

Stay tuned!

Oh, that's just bloody teasing mate......look forward to seeing the new wheel

 

[DrRob]

Ok, enough teasing. A parcel from the netherlands arrived today!

As you might have noticed JohnnyV is clearing out some of his wheels. He has some ads up for them.
I got lucky and was able to snatch his AMR Vantage GTE wheel off of his hands.
It is the third out of 3 custom made replica wheels, the only one with suede grips.

I can tell you it is a piece of art! And it feels as good as it looks! Wow!
The Asher shifters are great with a satisfying "click", same as the NKK switches.
Took it for a spin earlier in ACC and I felt right at home! Did not miss my Thrustmaster 383mod at all.
The only small gripe I have is the missing hat / funky switch. But overall I love this wheel!


Of course there were some problems earlier on, when I tried to mount the wheel.
It was made to be bolted to a Q1R quick release, which I do not have. Instead I have a 120mm extension with 70mm bolt pattern, which I wanted to directly bolt to the wheel back plate. But unfortunately the USB connector was in the way. It was JUST not fitting. So only a minor operation needed, I reckoned.
Well, took the dremel out and did a small cutout on the extension, now all good!


Thanks again for @JohnnyV for this excellent addition to my rig!
Couldn't be happier!