Is Classic Content Overlooked in Simracing?

[Bruno Iwanczuk]

You make some valid points which make perfect sense at first. But, you lend nothing to this conversation because your intent is clear. You don't want to have a civil debate, you want to troll and screech. Your last sentence proves that. Please do everyone a favour and stop posting, you are only derailing this thread.

PS: I don't care if you reply, I won't be reading this thread anymore.

My intention was to share my opinion and know how many people agreed with me, and im not trolling i really think this car is a peace of crap in terms of design, because in my opinion it's ugly as hell. Obviously it's a outstanding machine as a racing car, that's out of discussion.

 

[Kenny Paton]

Bruno Iwanczuk I suggest you dial it back a bit before you end up leaving the discussion.
Just some friendly advice.

 

[Bruno Iwanczuk]

Bruno Iwanczuk I suggest you dial it back a bit before you end up leaving the discussion.
Just some friendly advice.

Can you say it in a different way? My english is not very good i didn't understand. What is "dial it back"?

 

[Kenny Paton]

Bruno Iwanczuk
You've already made your point so no need to keep repeating it, most people have already grasped what you're getting at.

 

[Jonathan Young]

This may be an unpopular opinion, but I actually think that sims are significantly under priced and that because of that software developers are not motivated to develop content that many of us would like, but perhaps not millions of us.

This is a niche hobby and as you start to further segment the content and player base with very specific content like vintage cars, it becomes more niche. That shouldn’t matter as long as developers are able to correctly price their offerings. If AC sold a million copies at $60 and was profitable, then it should be possible to sell a GTL2 at a higher cost in the understanding that it would sell fewer copies. Everyone here understands basic economics I know, so I won’t labor the point.

But would people be willing to pay a higher price?

Firstly, we know that on the whole the sim racing community (or at least the hardcore) skews older and for the most part, that means wealthier too.

Secondly, people routinely spend two or three hundred dollars on Logitech setups and quite a few of us spend very much more than that on our rigs. This is a hobby that people ARE willing to spend money on. It seems like daylight robbery for Kunos to charge as little as $25 for the first release of ACC, a next gen sim title.

Even with this logic, it might be considered too risky to develop a niche vintage title with the intention of charging $100 or more for it. But we live in an age where you have marketing options surely? You could initially offer the game as a Kickstarter offering, reducing much of the risk. You could also have a paid DLC strategy, perhaps with different eras of cars bundled together. And if you look at how successful iRacing have been with their expensive subscription model, you can see that there’s potential for innovation in how sims are priced.

If we want a vibrant sim racing community and would like niche but top quality sims to play then we should accept that we should have to pay a premium for it. The alternative is that we either rely on mods or accept that premium titles will have to be crowd pleasers otherwise the financial risk is to great for devs and publishers to take. I would love an historic motor sports sim and I’d be willing to pay for it!

 

[Scarystuff]

My vintage community have a race tomorrow evening, so I would like to invite people from this thread to come and join us

Game: Assetto Corsa
Who: Vintage Appreciation Community
What: Ferrari 250 GTO
Where: Donington Park 1938
When: 19.00 CET Sunday
How: Discord.me/VintageAC
Server: Mod Edit: link removed.
No password, no signup, just show up with your happy face on. If you want your face to show up in the livestream, send me your best mugshot in PNG format. Server is up and in practice mode until 19:00 CET. Then 10 min quali and 2x 20 minute race with reverse grid.
Time until race:Mod Edit: Link removed.

Hope to see many happy people then

EDIT: As most people I didn't bother to read the TOS when signing up for this site, so I was unaware that I was not allowed to link to our race server. However if you do a search for Discord.me/VintageAC in the server browser (turn all filters off) then the race server is one of the three servers that pops up

 

[raiod]

yes!! 1966 season, i would love to drive this kind of cars

Well some of them are still in action today, and like the old days racing on dirt roads

 

[Miguel Batista]

I Lovell cars. I have two offline championships going. One where I am driving the 908 vs the 330 and gt40 (super fun) and another where I am using the excellent gpl mod by Bazza. Just the other day I was on a 3 wide battle in Zandvoort between Jacky Stewart's BRM and Jim Clark's Lotus 49. I was in another Lotus. Again, simple cars. I also enjoy gt3 and there is something to be said about buttons. I love to feel the balance of the car changing and making adjustments to brake bias and traction control to correct it. I wish we had slip diff adjustment on the fly in ac for cars that have it irl. It is a whole other layer of control we have access to. But yeah, more classic cars! For me, one of Kunos biggest mistakes was to indulge the community and include the 2017 Ferrari f1 car that nobody uses instead of the 512S which would play nicely with the 917.

 

[Sergio Loro]

Well some of them are still in action today, and like the old days racing on dirt roads

yes!! i went at some of this events, pretty cool

 

[VirtuaIceMan]

New "Classic Racers" hillclimb based game on Steam https://store.steampowered.com/app/1037480/Classic_Racers/ (only supports keyboard at launch though).

Based on the wonderfully named mobile game "Baguette, Fromage et Pistons", as it's French themed...

 

[Easty]

What I have found is that the older cars are harder to drive. with the new cars they tend to have traction control, auto blip , sequential gear shifts and ABS. And then people turn on other driver aids in the game settings, and I don't care what sim you drive , its turns it basically into an arcade game ( if the car dosnt have those aids in real life and you turn them on , you are not racing a simulator ). If you think you are a good driver with all that turned on you are only kidding yourself.
With the older cars, more often than not, people do a lap or 2 , spin out a couple times from trying to drive them as a modern car, spit the dummy and go back to modern training wheel cars.
Pushing in the clutch, lifting off the gas for gear change and MANUALLY blip the throttle are too much effort for some SIM? racers.
Some fast drivers are not willing to take the chance of not winning when it comes to the historic cars.

 

[Miguel Batista]

Yeah. That is why manual cars should have a long delay when using an auto clutch. Not only is it much faster to use the paddle shifter as you can't miss shift. Gaza in the GPL mod added a 50ms delay iirc and it works quite well. Sure you can participate in a race without a clutch but your shifting is less efficient.

 

[VirtuaIceMan]

It's now free to play, as the developer didn't make many sales, added Col de Turini and Monaco stages: https://store.steampowered.com/app/1037480/Classic_Racers/

 

[roadyroad]

Woooow what's that??? Need to try it!!! Amazing

 

[newbert]

It's now free to play, as the developer didn't make many sales, added Col de Turini and Monaco stages: https://store.steampowered.com/app/1037480/Classic_Racers/

Does this support a wheel or just gamepad/keyboard?

 

[VirtuaIceMan]

I think it supports devices now but not sure. It's free, give it a go!

 

[Jugulador]

I love classics. IMHO, 1967 was the year. When engines were very refined but downforce was not a thing yet and electronics were very simple... there was a full analog feeling in the cars. But I really understand why people don't appreciate that much.

Most of people (enthusiasts... not those who give a s#1t to every car) see sport cars as a consume dream... they want more tech and more speed, because those are straight and simple things to understand. If modern cars can be used on a consuming mindset, the classics are more like art appreciation: You need to know what are you looking at, what it means and the context of it's creation. It's not that some people can't understand... like art, there is aways people that simple don't care about it... and people that will never appreciate it.

The simulators gave us some of the appreciation about it... but never the feeling. I aways ask the question that "you prefer speed sensation or real speed?" A guy that go to a real racing track with a modern car (specially if it's not a pure racing car) will miss a lot of "communication" between the driver and the track... he will even don't fell most of his car, because of electronics and modern design. In simulation and videos we just see the real speed, that is pure visual... but with vintage hardware, it's all about the non visual.

I had the privilege of drive some really old vehicles... cars that were build for race. Cars that are slower than things that I drove on daily commute. But those vintage cars gave me a much more active experience... a more complete.

I think that modern cars are too good to be funny. You can push them as if that is nothing. Even modern analog vehicles are kinda boring... no matter if you are cornering at march 1 and your tires are still silent... it is just boring. If I want to simply go fast I buy an airplane ticket... If I am driving an sportive car is because I want to fell it all.

 

[Jean-Paul Sarti]

To paraphrase what somebody once said of science fiction, “the golden age of motor sports is 12”. I was 12 in 1966. For me cars with wings covered with sponsor logos (Can-Am till about 1970 excepted) aren’t nearly as interesting as later cars. And I’m glad real racing is safer, but get no pleasure from negotiating simulated chicanes.

I’m grateful that the makers of GPL coded it in such a way that it will still run on modern computers and that it’s been served by an active modding community. That despite the fact that it’s pretty crude compared to modern sims. And I’m grateful to the modders who create vintage content for current titles.

If anyone is still reading this thread and has recommendations for vintage swimming I’d love to hear from them.

 

[mantasisg]

I was negative 35 years old in 1966. Reincarnation ?

THERE IS CAR IN REINCARNATION

I'm such mature and serious bloke.

 

[XRRoy]

My intention was to share my opinion and know how many people agreed with me, and im not trolling i really think this car is a peace of crap in terms of design, because in my opinion it's ugly as hell. Obviously it's a outstanding machine as a racing car, that's out of discussion.

TFW when a 1967 Cougar smoked your fancy Porsche...