The SimFeedback-AC DIY Motion Simulator thread

sjb266 · Sep 17, 2018

Hey guys. Thought I’d create a thread for those taking the plunge into this brilliant DIY project..
I will be starting mine soon and I know there are others thinking about it.. so feel free to share your knowledge and experiences so we can all enjoy this platform to its full potential. A huge thanks to the developers who have really knocked this one out of the park!

Website: https://opensfx.com/2019/02/20/welcome-to-our-new-site/

Github: https://github.com/SimFeedback/SimFeedback-AC-Servo/wiki

For all the internals for the actuator contact Amy - skye@ntl-bearing.com
She can supply everything you need. Just remind her you want the ends of the shafts chamfered and make sure she sends the right sized ball screw - we have had a couple of issues reported. She is very helpful though and the cost is pretty good.

Huge thanks to @RowanH for writing a comprehensive user guide which can be accessed here - https://www.rowanhick.com/sfx-100-build-and-running-guide

In addition, @anton_Chez has contributed a list of post numbers for some of the important settings etc..
Post #320 SFX-100 thread
Post #327 SFX-100 thread for Discord correlation
Post #339 SFX-100 thread
Post #418 SFX-100 thread
Post #424 SFX-100 thread
Post #439 SFX-100 thread
Post #449 SFX-100 thread
Post #517 SFX-100 thread
Post #554 SFX-100 thread
Post #580 SFX-100 thread
Post #826 SFX-100 thread
Post #837 SFX-100 thread
Post #864,866,867,868,870,887,889,897 SFX-100 thread
Post #911,914 SFX-100 thread
Post #988,992,998 SFX-100 thread
Post #1147 SFX-100 thread
Post #1492 SFX-100 thread
Post #1511,1517 SFX-100 thread

I will try to keep this page updated with links to source the parts in other parts of the world. Just post whatever links you have and i'll add them here.

Please note: Not all the parts listed below are essential for the project. For the essential parts refer to the original shopping list.

Australia:

Thanks to @AussieSim for the following links:

10A power lead(s) * 4
https://www.jaycar.com.au/2m-black-mains-extension-lead/p/PS4152

Top quality wire stripper
https://sydneytools.com.au/product/boxo-cutws205-multifunction-wire-stripper

RCD/safety switch power block
https://www.bunnings.com.au/arlec-4-outlet-heavy-duty-portable-safety-switch_p4420028

WD-40 lithium grease for the ball screws
https://www.bunnings.com.au/wd-40-specialist-300g-high-performance-white-lithium-grease_p6100408

Vibration pads
https://www.bunnings.com.au/whites-on-site-100-x-12-5mm-rubber-anti-vibration-mat-4-pack_p3961547

WD-40 Dry PTFE spray for the slider (free shipping)
https://au.rs-online.com/mobile/p/lubricants/7577134/

Arduino Leonardo (free shipping + frequent 10-15% off discount)
https://www.arrow.com/en/products/a000057/arduino-corporation

DB25 cables * 4 (free shipping)
https://www.arrow.com/en/products/ak401-2/assmann-wsw-components-inc

PETG * 3 (free shipping)
https://www.arrow.com/en/products/petg17bk1/mg-chemicals

WAGO-like connectors to avoid a breadboard (perhaps use genuine ones if you are doing 240V AC)
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32906719488.html

D-Sub breakout boards * 4
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32297675967.html

3D printer Creality Ender-3 Pro
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32918302452.html

Wires from Arduino to D-Sub breakout (remove black plastic from the WAGO end)
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32887680826.html

Crimp connectors for AC wire leads
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/32813550981.html

sebna · Jan 26, 2019

Mascot said:
They are slow to react for sure, but my biggest complaint is the total lack of transparency and their non-existent comms. There's simply no excuse for ignoring emails from customers in 2019. If I wasn't aware of this thread and how poor Kinetic have been in this regard (for pretty much everyone here?) then, after two weeks of nothing and multiple unanswered emails, I'd have opened a PayPal or VISA dispute to get my money back, thinking I'd been scammed. It's not good service no matter how grateful we are that they are the only supplier of a vital component.

Anyway, my goods are now on the way but if it wasn't for this thread I'd have had a very uncomfortable few weeks of hassle. There must be lots of worried SFX builders who AREN'T aware how lethargic and uncommunicative Kinetic are.

Reading about all the drama with getting those extrusions I think I will order them on Monday even tough I do not plan to build or buy rest of the parts for another 6-8 months. Just in case they would decide it is too much hassle to supply those to individuals at the quantities we are ordering.

Cheers

Fran Toledano · Jan 26, 2019

Hello friends.
A new kid in town.
For now I'm reading all avaible information and doing the shopping.

I'd downloaded the simfeedback software and do a donation to became a full access to it, but the paypal account returns me the donation.
Anybody knows why?

King regards from Spain and a very great project!

sjb266 · Jan 26, 2019

@Fran Toledano Don’t skimp on the donation.. it’s not a $5 or $10 donation type of project.. this is why your money is returned..

Maybe wait unti you’ve built it and tried it before you donate.. you’re getting the equivalent of a $10-15k motion system.. please donate accordingly.

anton_Chez · Jan 26, 2019

Just to put it in perspective, we're not donating for just the access to the expert mode. The project has helped bring a project that would normally cost 5 figures and upward, as Simon has mentioned. The ability to have access to a community based project that everyone can be a part of and experience what many would never have been able to should be considered.

Talkwrench · Jan 26, 2019

Why not make it a licence purchase for a stipulated fee?

BluePotato00 · Jan 26, 2019

Talkwrench said:
Why not make it a licence purchase for a stipulated fee?

Then there would be people who would have donated $100 that only donate the, say, $30 minimum.

Or maybe it's a tax issue if donations are treated differently than fees for a license.

anton_Chez · Jan 26, 2019

Not necessarily. People are willing to give more even if they are not required to. Especially people that are as passionate about something as to be involved in something like this. I buy albums and compilations that I enjoy listening to even though I subscribe to Spotify. I feel it's not enough for the enjoyment that the artists bring me. To me that's as good as a donation as I listen to everything through there even after a purchase.

I guess a minimum amount stated, say, $50 USD or Euro, accompanied by a message encouraging people to donate more if they feel they'd like to support the project, would be a good way of eliminating confusion. I'm sure Saxxon has his reasons and that's completely his right.

Specialist68 · Jan 26, 2019

I Think the maker of the software can make the answer why he refunded the donation.
Otherwise they have much effort in it so….
But is should be clearer what the donation must be
( just my 2 cents )

HugoB · Jan 26, 2019

I think most people have like a standard donation amount for software that asks for something, like open source projects etc. Looking at the amount of people here that report their donation was returned, I think it's around 10$ or so? The thing to consider though, and what makes this project different from most little software programs that like a bit of donation, is that in this case (SimFeedback) you are also donating for the amount of effort put into developing the actuators, designing the 3D parts, testing the actuators, tuning the actuators to work with the software and with different simulators and finally you are donating for the effort to make an understandable wiki guide and also a support channel at Discord. And I must say, Saxxon66 has always been very fast to answer any technical questions that have come up on the Discord. Also, with your donation you are helping the developers stay motivated to look into new features or more plug-ins for games.

Especially the actuator hardware part is something you need to consider, it's not just another weather app or zip app, it's actually a product. Well, you have to make it yourself, but the whole R&D is still done for you, and because of this, you are getting motion that can compete with 10k-30k systems, but for under 2k. This is certainly worth a lot of appreciation

Edit: you don't even have to donate, you could use the software in the standard mode, your motion will still be awesome and you can even tune most import stuff, just like a D-Box

Fran Toledano · Jan 26, 2019

Ok. What’s the minimum acceptable donation?
Regards.

HugoB · Jan 26, 2019

Fran Toledano said:
Ok. What’s the minimum acceptable donation?
Regards.

It's true that nobody knows that.

So follow your heart

Or better, build the actuators first, try them out, see how you like it, then decide what you want to donate

Ringorian · Jan 26, 2019

Fran Toledano said:
Ok. What’s the minimum acceptable donation?
Regards.

You build something which cost you 2000 Euros in total and ask for the minimum donation that you maybe save 10 or 20 Euro, wow . .. I would say 100 Euros is not enough for this project, but its not me .. go with the normal version, this works with no donation.
If you need a price tag, check d-box, Prosimu, Sim Department, Motionhouse .. Cheapest is about 5000 for 4 Actuators ..

MADShootStuff · Jan 26, 2019

Whoo hoo!

Specialist68 · Jan 26, 2019

Ringorian said:
You build something which cost you 2000 Euros in total and ask for the minimum donation that you maybe save 10 or 20 Euro, wow . .. I would say 100 Euros is not enough for this project, but its not me .. go with the normal version, this works with no donation.
If you need a price tag, check d-box, Prosimu, Sim Department, Motionhouse .. Cheapest is about 5000 for 4 Actuators ..

Prosimu uses software of 50 euro that is commercial I don't know for sure ..simtools

Ringorian · Jan 26, 2019

Specialist68 said:
Prosimu uses software of 50 euro that is commercial I don't know for sure ..simtools

Go for it ! So you don´t have to rant about kinetik, donations or anything else ..
The Simfeedback Software already works with no donation ..

As other people here have written, people which do not understand that its not only software for what you donate should go the commercial way with actuators and the software . . BTW i think Commercial Simulators have to use the commercial version of sim-tools .. which is more expensive.
If Saxxon would have gone the commercial way we wouldnt talk about donations .. cause most of us would not have bought a commercial setup because of the cash it would cost ..

He also could have not made it public, thats could have been the dumbest option .

Specialist68 · Jan 26, 2019

Ringorian said:
Go for it ! So you don´t have to rant about kinetik, donations or anything else ..

As other people here have written, people which do not understand that its not only software for what you donate should go the commercial way with actuators and the software .. BTW i think Commercial Simulators have to use the commercial version of sim-tools .. which is more expensive.
If Saxxon would have gone the commercial way we wouldnt talk about donations .. cause most of us would not have bought a commercial setup because of the cash it would cost ..

Hold your horses! why are you angry? I just defend that software must be payed not to be 10 euro
You do not understand me!

saxxon66 · Jan 26, 2019

Usually I do not discuss donations on public forums, but seeing so many people responding, here is my response.

1. SimFeedback is not a commercial application, it is a hobby project all done in my spare time
2. It is a mix of open and closed source, the closed source part is not public domain
3. It has a licensing system build in to protected the SFX-100 project from commercial abuse
4. You can use the software for free in its normal mode
5. If you would like to use the expert mode you need to donate
6. There is no "official" minimum, but I will refund donations that are so small that it will make me a loss.
I say no "official", but like all humans I do have my good and bad days. And therefore I have a hard limit, to make it fair for all. I am not going to publish this, because it would feel like a price tag on it.

Every refund has a refund message (PayPal) attached to it:
"Thank you for your donation, but I will refund your donation due to the small amount that will not cover the transaction fee, handling, taxation, accounting, ... expenses and is causing me a loss. Sorry"

Lately, in addition, I am asking for some pictures or posts to proof that the person, who has donated is building the system, to prevent any commercial build.
So please donate while or after you have built your system.

Donation is all about appreciation.

@Fran Toledano
Doing this project and only asking for: "How much is the minimum?" after all other responding, ...
Maybe you think about it again.
Up to now I have not denied someone a license, but seeing you spamming all forums and asking
"How much is the minimum?", I need to think again too.

Talkwrench · Jan 26, 2019

I don’t understand, why the mystery, why not just put a price tag on it???? Clearly we’ve all invested serious money building our rigs and we knew those prices up front. Stating that D-Box cost this and prosimu cost that is irrelevant! We didn’t buy those systems because we knew it was expensive. Why not just stipulate what amount is expected then people can decide if they can really afford to see this project through.

MADShootStuff · Jan 26, 2019

I'll put a number on it and my reasoning:

$100 USD as a minimum

I was initially thinking $60 USD as that it the standard price for a AAA game across most platforms.

After a similar post a while back I thought about it a bit more and realized that was a bit low. I considered how I deal with gratuity in other situations, because that's what this is - showing your appreciation to @saxxon66 for not only the countless hours he out into this but also continued support via discord and the fact that he went out of his way to make this an accessible option for all of us. He could have just built one for himself with bespoke parts and posted a video . He didn't though. He took a large amount of his personal time and effort to make sure that YOU can do this.

5% of the total project cost seems like a reasonable minimum baseline. Especially when you consider the alternatives.

HugoB · Jan 26, 2019

Yes, he could have just enjoyed it for himself... and we would still be sitting motionless on our seats.. But instead he chose to not only share it with us, but he also chose to use off-the-shelf parts that anyone can purchase

(instead of specialist or CNC’d parts). This kept the cost for us low, but the research and time needed to achieve this feat was massive.