PC3 Project CARS 3 to Change Focus?

[Paul Jeffrey]

Slightly Mad Studios Head Ian Bell recently revealed PCARS 3 is in development, and now hints have been dropped that the direction of the title might change for the next release.

The Project CARS series of games have, up until this point, been heavily focussed on a wide selection or road and race cars from a wide variety of different disciplines of motorsport - giving players the opportunity to drive such varied machines as top tier open wheel cars, to stockcar, touring cars, GTs, historic and road going performance machines.

Although the scope of the previous two versions of the game are indeed admirable, some could argue that potentially Slightly Mad Studios looked to become a jack of all trades with their game content, and as a result became the master of none.

This appears to have been noted by the decision makers back at SMS, as Ian Bell once again took to the internet to drop a few hints about the next release - suggesting that maybe Slightly Mad Studios would look to return to their roots somewhat, and produce an experience more akin to the earlier Need for Speed Shift release of 2009.

“I’ll let you know that pCARS3 will be more ‘focused’… More ‘fun’…" said Bell over on the GT Plant forums. "We went to insane lengths with variation in pCARS2 and with that comes infinite balancing issues. We’ve learned a lesson here and although we have no intention of reducing content, we know what we need to fix, where we made design decisions that were, let’s call it, ‘sub-optimal’…​

“pCARS3 will be more of a spiritual successor to Shift, but with all of the sim goodness everyone appreciates… The key focus though is on fun and not biting off more than we can properly chew and digest.”
​

Ian Bell does refer to the desire to retain the "sim goodness" of PCARS 1 & 2, however the shift (ha ha) towards an experience more closely aligned to the Need for Speed series does suggest that the new title could take itself a little less seriously than has been the case in the past, and leads one to wonder if a more arcade slant is to be applied to the title than has been the case in the past.

With PCARS 1 & 2 failing to match the quality of other sim racing titles the likes of rFactor 2, Assetto Corsa, RaceRoom and AMS, and with new games from Reiza Studios and the Early Access Assetto Corsa Competizione from Kunos in the works, a move towards a more fun and light hearted experience is probably not a bad idea for PCARS and the new title - quite how the end result will pan out remains to be seen.

One thing is for sure, however SMS pitch the new title, it will be very interesting to hear and read what is said on the build up to release of what is surely going to be another very interesting piece of software from the prolific game studio.

Check out the Project CARS 3 sub forum here at RaceDepartment for more news, discussion and features on this sequel release to the hugely popular Project CARS franchise of games.

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[Mircea Rad]

You're not reading very carefully. I said LIVE conditions, meaning they don't try to simulate changing conditions as they would (randomly) change in real life. Of course they simulate various conditions of temperature, grip, wind, tire wear, etc. depending on what they expect to see in real life (or what they actually see in real life, keeping in mind that simulator work is most important in a race weekend to extend data gathering beyond the free practice sessions). But they are always using fixed sets (plural) of conditions in order to get valid data and compare different set-ups and car components. Otherwise the whole telemetry is pointless. Keep in mind that the main reason for running a professional simulator is to decide what parts to use and aid in car development. Driver training is just a side benefit, since engineers need also human input. Also, by driver training, I meant that a driver can learn/understand things like steering wheel buttons, differences in set-up, specific tire wear, etc. Not actually training someone to drive an F1 car. Once you get there, it's pretty clear you know what you're doing.

I'm 100% sure they do not simulate marbles for the sole reason cars don't race on tracks covered in marbles.

 

[whip]

I'm 100% sure they do not simulate marbles for the sole reason cars don't race on tracks covered in marbles.

 

[BrunoBæ]

Conserning this discussion about racing games vs pro team simulation software then my guess is that if as example Ferraris and McLarens sims is on such an outstanding higher level against commercial computer "sims" - then these teams would probably make some "downgraded" commercial versions of their simulators.
Because even because of their brand name they would be best sellers from day one

Something to support this heretic guess could be that (if I remember right) Ferrari some years back announced a change in their sim software.
Because from a sim based mainly on nKPRO they now would base it on rFPro.
So when people regard as example Ferraris "own" sim as something sooo weird and advanced that normal people almost cannot comprehend it - then I consider it entertaining but probably far from reality.
Again if I remember right then Ferraris argument was that rFPro allowed them to cusomize the sim more to their demands than nKPRO allowed.

So much about godlike pro racing sims

 

[Mircea Rad]

@whip Exactly my point. You don't see the cars running on part of the track covered in marbles, do you?

But anyway, we are off-topic. What I wanted to point out is that what we want as gamers is not 100% identical to what pro simulators do. Yes, we would love the same details in car components (tire model, suspension, aero, etc.), but then we want to put all of it in a situation that best describes live changing conditions as accurate as possible. Which is far more complicated than using fixed conditions.

 

[whip]

@whip Exactly my point. You don't see the cars running on part of the track covered in marbles, do you?

how do you think they overtake?

 

[Amir Vodokotlic]

Is Ian Bell is running some kind of investor scam in Singapore or where ever he lives now.

Opens new twitter account.

Says 60FPS per eye.
https://twitter.com/bell_sms/status/1080468977019584512

Get's demolished in comments but instead of correcting his tweet, he keeps doubling down on it.

edit: Bell said take it down.

 

[Mircea Rad]

Like this

You're missing the whole point. Nobody sets-up their car specifically for overtaking on marbles.

 

[protonv5]

That's exactly my point. A more than competent sim driver testing and judging pcars2 by playing it the way you play wreckfest and stating it is bad because people you're racing with on the lobby are more competent because they refined their setup before entering the lobby. Being a professional and competent driver doesn't make you a professional and competent reviewer. I admit he has made other more interesting videos but I've watched much better reviews from young youtubers racing irl as professional rookies. And his unconditionnal love for iracing makes all his content unreliable. Even the die hard fans admit iracing flaws.

Someone as competent and popular has the duty to be professional when giving his opinion on a title. It's called responsability. At the end of the day there are some people jobs at stake...

SMS sucks. Does that ruin their reputation? No. They are capable of doing that all by themselves. They have a choice to release a killer product and stand behind it. But instead, they churn out broken stuff and then abandon it a few months later. Is that Nicki's fault? C'mon.

 

[CC]

I swear Ian Bell is running some kind of investor scam in Singapore or where ever he lives now.

Opens new twitter account.

Says 60FPS per eye.
https://twitter.com/bell_sms/status/1080468977019584512

Get's demolished in comments but instead of correcting his tweet, he keeps doubling down on it.

What a great read man wow
is this guy a clown or what.

 

[Andy_J]

I swear Ian Bell is running some kind of investor scam in Singapore or where ever he lives now.

Opens new twitter account.

Says 60FPS per eye.
https://twitter.com/bell_sms/status/1080468977019584512

Get's demolished in comments but instead of correcting his tweet, he keeps doubling down on it.

How can his new console be beyond next generation? His console will be next generation surely? He is one strange millionaire.

 

[Deleted member 379375]

Maybe he has cracked quantum computing?

Or is it just alternative facts

 

[Serj]

Imagine Milestone...

Bells team can only catch the hype. This dude has a lot of experience with his past Sim Bin. So when they advertising pCARS1as everbest sim in the world bla bla bla....they should prove it in real. But its not happens. Bells team, better banning all users if forum WMD, but dont accepts that product is bad. Bells team need to change phylosophy if they want to create something good in the future, but with accepting that pcars 1 and 2 are products so so.. . Imho.

 

[Timmy UK]

I swear Ian Bell is running some kind of investor scam in Singapore or where ever he lives now.

Opens new twitter account.

Says 60FPS per eye.
https://twitter.com/bell_sms/status/1080468977019584512

Get's demolished in comments but instead of correcting his tweet, he keeps doubling down on it.

With all respect to you, I would be very careful about making serious claims about Mr Bell’s operations..
You have no evidence whatsoever to back up what you have claimed.
He likes to sue..
And does, often...x

 

[apex11]

how do you think they overtake?

DRS mainly.... then engine boost mode....and then just because its a Mercedes with a grid penalty.......

 

[RKip455]

Its not a hate blog post for me... just saying they should have the bugs corrected.

I'll buy PC3 cause I buy every game sim like, sim, simcade. Dirt 4 was horrible... but I own it.
I also disagree that arcade racers are console only... really! Wheels today work on consoles and PC... so thats changed.

Dirt 2.0, PC3, ACC, GTR3... I'd say not to bad for the 2019 outlook so far. I'll get them all. With literally thousands of dollars in my PC / Console setups (PC, XB, PS all with wheels) I buy almost everything to support racing game developers. But never Rocket League an such games.

Here's to more options in 2019!

 

[apex11]

With all respect to you, I would be very careful about making serious claims about Mr Bell’s operations..
You have no evidence whatsoever to back up what you have claimed.
He likes to sue..
And does, often...x

Classic....
2019 and still the internet isn't growing up...

 

[ChaosZeroJK]

With all respect to you, I would be very careful about making serious claims about Mr Bell’s operations..
You have no evidence whatsoever to back up what you have claimed.
He likes to sue..
And does, often...x

You mispelled "buying the silence of those making bad comments on his games".

 

[roadyroad]

I think this "needing therapy" is way over the top. I think it's rather you, confusing hardware with software. This is a nice motion rig, but sims like AC can also be used with motion rigs.
AC has made a turnover of around 50 million bucks until today. They could and probably have spent the majority of that for development. Now Ferrari and the other F1 teams have a big budget, but it's not unlimited.
In 2016 their R&D costs have been 380 million € (total costs 500m€). I don't think they even spend 10% of that costs for simulator software, that would be madness. That leaves us with less then 38m€ per year. Still a bit more then the 50 from AC over 5 years, but I don't think they can afford to spend much more. The software might be a bit better and closer to reality, but they are surely not leaps and bounds ahead. When we get to the smaller teams, their budget is 3 times less, so they even have less to spend for their simulators.


As for the rest of this thread - it just shows that most people nowadays have serious reading comprehension problems. There was no mention what so ever, that the next iteration of Pcars will be more "casual, arcade" or however you wanna call it. When you see people making up stuff like that out of nothing, you really don't wonder anymore, how people like the blond old man can become powerful politicians

I agree on the last statement, it's not written the physics will be dumbed down in pcars3, on the contrary, I understand more homogenity will allow SMS to deliver better physics.

On the figures you mentioned, you really don't have any idea about what is included in there, unless you have a spy in the racing teams. What do you include in the R&D budget? Investments? Yearly expenses? These are 2 different accouting things. The amortization of the investments are included in the R&D if you read the accounts in some countries. For international comparisons, using IFRS norms, amortizations are not in the R&D expenses.

In general, IFRS or not, If you speak only about investments, you do not include at least a part, if not all, of the R&D department.
But if you use the expenses, you may not includes a part of these expenses transfered to the investments...
Just a few points to make yoj understand it is impossible for you to know the real R&D figures.
And you miss ine crucial point : F1 teams use simulators and update them. They do not need to invest each year in a full new simulator (and it would be impossible).
Another thing is you use cash figures, not budget. It is another thing which ignore all the previous investments and expenses.
Just don't make these analyses, they're going nowhere. Don't take that as an offense, it is just a reality everyone has to understand, or at least be aware of (accounting games are part of the business of these companies) before making simplified judgments.

 

[Timmy UK]

Classic....
2019 and still the internet isn't growing up...

My dear boy, just some friendly advice to one of your fellow school classmates..
Nothing more, nothing less..x

 

[roadyroad]

So them rising to prominence in viewership by running a variety of mods and leagues, often using free content, or even praising said free content as being some of their favorites, is reversing the roles? Much like the games which they have to purchase, which provided them with the platform, and that is your perspective?

In this day and age with technological advances and hours needed for content to be realized, people pushing out quality material which often times parallels or surpasses first-party material, should only be grateful for someone else playing it while said player is receiving thousands in donations, and modders maybe have 1-3 people donating for every 10,000-15,000 individual downloads? Will you be grateful and hope someone else is also grateful and can send over $1 or $5 or $50? Will you acquire books or procure documentation or engineering information, or learn a skill, or develop part of a content to support a modder or modding group? Not everyone is SimBin who had a keen eye back in the day to assemble a group of people to pursue professional endeavors.

Modding is born from passion and words of gratitude are certainly welcome. But to forego the notion of giving back some to the community which can contribute so much to the joy and entertainment of dozens of thousands, is short-sighted and selfish. Have you ever used Wikipedia or other online libraries (archive.org, etc) for your entertainment or research? Have you ever donated a single pound/euro/dollar? What about "buy x to support such and such developer" but not spare the same thought to others in not the same professional scenario? This is not meant to say it should be mandatory. No. But you could say it is in their interest to maintain development around the niche market which they built their revenue stream. If you have $1,000 in the bank from just playing games, why not spare $10-20 for VRC, Lilski, Patrik Sander, RSR Formula, Brun, A3DR, Apex Modding, Sergio Loro, etc? Think of powerhouse modders we have lost, such as Virtua LM, CTDP, or emac? Or guys soldiering on in games such as Grand Prix Legends or Grand Prix 4?

You have your perspective twisted.

Apologies for the off-topic commentary here, this was the last post .

There are not doing the same business. You buy a magazine which publishes books reviews, they won't give a cent, a penny... To writers. The reviewers just let you know about books you may be interested in and give you their opinion. Without them you may have never heard about these books.
Writers of the book take advantage of this exposure (if their product is good) and the magazine get money for his work. The same for youtubers. If modders do not sell their product, it's not their problem. It's a decision from a modding team and if they decided to go the free way, the youtuber do not have anything to do with it.

RSS team sells mods. YouTubers review their products, you are free to buy. Other modders do not want to sell their product, whatever the reason is, as writers just published free books. It's a way to promote oneself.

What you propose therefore is that if a youtuber is not willing to give money for a free mod he could show to his viewers, he must not show it. How great, that's a nice idea. Deaths of modding team will be faster than before. Many modders use free mods to build a curriculum vitae and a good repitation to sell their work or laknch their own business. You know, Simbin...

Of they have to pay to show free mods so they have to pay to show paid content. That's strange because the issue currently is more about youtubers being paid by publishing companies, the business is the other way...

What you are saying is that a nice gesture from a youtuber towards a free modding team should be mandatory. Sure, if I was a youtuber you could forget the free mods on my channel

We are not speaking about twitch superstar who get 10 000$ to push a game from a big publisher. We speak about small channels specialized in simracing!