Open Letter to Kunos Simulazioni and the Community

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OverTake.gg

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Dear Kunos Simulazioni,

There is no doubt that what you have managed to achieve over the lifetime of Assetto Corsa, from its early access period to it's current state (v1.1), has been incredibly impressive, especially considering the relative size of your development team (approximately 15 people, we believe). From the humble beginnings of a single track, and a couple of sports cars, Assetto Corsa has become one of the highest selling racing games on steam, and deservedly so, thanks to intelligent investment, ultra-high quality (and popular) content, unparalleled driving physics, and a vast expanse of modding capability. Assetto Corsa easily has the most potential to be something truly great out of all the current simulators on the market today.

However, despite all of these fantastic things, there is still one aspect of Assetto Corsa (that we here at RaceDepartment are especially passionate about) that is detracting from the rest of the game in a significant way: Multiplayer functionality, usability and netcode solidity. In its present state, we feel that the quality of the multiplayer experience is still vastly inadequate in comparison to not only the the rest of Assetto Corsa's competition, but inferior even to that of games seen in the early-mid 2000's. From a users perspective, the way Assetto Corsa handles latency differences and especially collisions, is not exactly what you would call a pretty sight, and this must be addressed if Assetto Corsa is to be taken seriously by online racing communities such as this one.

Having a well-oiled multiplayer machine, so to speak, is essential to the long term sustainability of a simulator to not only remain relevant to the consumer, but to have them coming back for more (iRacing, rFactor 2 and Game Stock Car Extreme are all excellent examples of this, and all of them, incidentally, are your direct competitors in the sim market). Unfortunately at the present moment, we don't feel that Assetto Corsa's multiplayer currently offers the stability and function required to keep the clients coming back for more. As a result, we've seen a distinct trend in our RaceDepartment club races where we have a vast influx of drivers soon after a significant update, and then a significant drop off in participation within a period of a week or so, as the drivers quickly realise that the other competing racing sims still offer more features and enjoyment during multiplayer races.

Properly functioning multiplayer races with fully supported features including sector splits, live timing, broadcast/spectator mode, stable netcode for high ping users, reverse grid features, multiple races, far more numerous number of grid slots (what GT series races with only 24 cars?), pitstop improvements and many many more features are all necessary for a complete and sustainable sim that will not only be profitable for you in the long run, but will also maximize the users enjoyment and will vastly increase the life span of the sim.

If you look at it from a 'man and machine versus the track' perspective, then few other racing sims out there can compete with what Assetto Corsa offers in terms of physics, sound and track immersion, providing what is probably the best hot-lapping and practice simulator available to the consumer ever created. However, looking at it as a 'multiplayer racing sim', then you quickly realise just how far Assetto Corsa seems to be lagging behind the competition.

We completely understand that such things take time to develop, and we are more than willing to be patient and wait for improvements for the multiplayer side of things to progress, however, Assetto Corsa has been in development now for more than enough time to warrant an acceptable standard of multiplayer functionality and stability. Given the huge level of success that Assetto Corsa has experienced, we believe that budgetary constraints might not represent such a big hurdle anymore for the studio, especially in terms of netcode investment.

Whilst it cannot be stressed enough just how amazing the quality of the content (cars and tracks) has been, we here at RaceDepartment feel very strongly that you, Kunos Simulazioni, must shift your attention from implementing new cars and tracks to improving the functionality of the game. If it is not addressed soon, then you'll run a real risk of seeing a significant and rapid decline in the population of the Assetto Corsa user-base.

As the largest SimRacing community in the world, we sincerely hope that the issues highlighted above will be focused on more heavily in future, as we believe that Assetto Corsa has the potential to be one of the top class racing simulators on the market.

In closing, we would like to leave you with one final thought, and that's that; whilst it's a surreal and genuinely spine-tingling experience to be able to drive highly accurate replications of legendary race tracks and cars, what is the point of all of this incredible content, if the limitations of the game's functionality and usability are preventing us from realising its full potential?

Hopefully in the not too distant future, Assetto Corsa will prove to be the amazing racing simulator that we, and everyone else, know it has the potential to be.

Kind Regards,
RaceDepartment.

Cari Kunos Simulazioni,
Non c'è dubbio che quello che siete riusciti a realizzare con Assetto Corsa, dalla sua fase early access alla sua versione corrente (1.1), sia stato incredibilmente notevole, specialmente considerando le dimensioni del team di sviluppo (circa 15 persone, crediamo).
Dai suoi umili inizi con un singolo tracciato e qualche auto sportiva, Assetto Corsa è diventato uno dei racing game più venduti su Steam, meritatamente, per via degli investimenti intelligenti, contenuti di qualità altissima (e popolari), fisica di guida impareggiabile ed un vasto supporto al modding.

Assetto Corsa ha indubbiamente il maggior potenziale per diventare qualcosa di davvero grandioso tra tutti i simulatori al momento sul mercato.

Ma, nonostante tutte queste fantastiche qualità, c'è ancora un aspetto di Assetto Corsa (a cui noi di RaceDepartment siamo particolarmente appassionati) che detrae dal resto del gioco in maniera significativa: la funzionalità, usabilità e stabilità del netcode in Multiplayer.
Crediamo che la qualità dell'esperienza multiplayer, nel suo stato attuale, sia ancora in gran parte inadeguata se confrontata non solo con i suoi rivali, ma anche con simulatori dei primi anni 2000.

Dal punto di vista dell'utente, il modo in cui Assetto Corsa gestisce le differenze di latenza e specialmente le collisioni non è esattamente ideale, e questo deve essere migliorato se il titolo vuole essere preso sul serio dalle comunità di racing online come la nostra.
Avere un sistema multiplayer ben oliato, per così dire, è essenziale alla sostenibilità a lungo termine di un simulatore - non solo per rimanere rilevante per il consumatore, ma anche per fare in modo che questo ritorni (iRacing, rFactor 2 e Game Stock Car Extreme sono tutti ottimi esempi, e che tra l'altro sono tutti vostri diretti competitori nel mercato dei simulatori).

Sfortunatamente al momento non ci sembra che il multiplayer di Assetto Corsa offra la stabilità e le funzionalità richieste per fare in modo che i clienti ritornino.

Come diretto risultato, abbiamo notato una marcata tendenza nelle corse del nostro RaceDepartment club in cui abbiamo un grande influsso di giocatori immediatamente dopo un aggiornamento importante, per poi vedere una significativa diminuzione nel giro di una settimana circa, man mano che i piloti si rendono conto che gli altri competitori nel mercato dei racing sim offrono più funzionalità per le corse in multiplayer.

Corse in multiplayer propriamente funzionanti con caratteristiche come split per i settori, cronometraggio in tempo reale, modalità spettatore\di trasmissione, netcode stabile per gli utenti con un ping alto, modalità a griglia invertita, corse multiple, un numero molto maggiore di posti sulla griglia (quale corsa GT ha solo 24 auto?), miglioramenti ai pitstop ed altre ancora sono necessarie per un simulatore completo e sostenibile che non solo sarà redditizio per voi, ma massimizzerà anche il divertimento degli utenti e aumenterà sostanzialmente l'arco di vita del vostro titolo.

Guardandolo dalla prospettiva di “uomo e macchina contro il tracciato”, pochi altri simulatori sul mercato possono competere con quello che offre Assetto Corsa in termini di fisica, sonoro ed immersione su pista, creando quella che è probabilmente il miglior simulatore di hot-lapping e pratica mai creato e venduto al consumatore.
Tuttavia, guardandolo come un “simulatore di corse in multiplayer”, ci si rende conto che Assetto Corsa è piuttosto indietro rispetto ai suoi rivali.

Noi capiamo completamente che cose del genere richiedono tempo per essere sviluppate, e siamo più che volenterosi di essere pazienti ed aspettare dei miglioramenti al multiplayer, ma Assetto Corsa è ormai in fase di sviluppo da abbastanza tempo per garantire uno standard accettabile di funzionalità e stabilità nelle modalità online.
Visto l'enorme successo che Assetto Corsa ha avuto, crediamo che i limiti di budget forse non siano più un grande ostacolo per lo studio, particolarmente in termini di investimento sul netcode.

Sebbene la qualità dei contenuti (sia auto che tracciati) sia davvero incredibile, noi di RaceDepartment crediamo fortemente che voi, Kunos Simulazioni, dobbiate spostare la vostra attenzione dall'implementare nuovi contenuti al migliorare la funzionalità del gioco. Se questi problemi non saranno risolti a breve, allora correrete il rischio di vedere un declino rapido e significativo del bacino d'utenza di Assetto Corsa.
Come la più grande community di SimRacing nel mondo, noi crediamo sinceramente che i problemi di cui abbiamo scritto sopra riceveranno più attenzione in futuro, perché crediamo che Assetto Corsa abbia il potenziale per diventare IL simulatore di corse sul mercato.

In chiusura, vorremmo lasciarvi con un ultimo pensiero: mentre essere in grado di guidare repliche incredibilmente accurate di auto e tracciati leggendari è un'esperienza surreale e davvero eccitante, a cosa servono tutti questi contenuti eccezionali se le limitazioni della funzionalità ed usabilità del gioco ci impediscono di realizzare tutto il loro potenziale?

Speriamo che in un futuro non troppo lontano Assetto Corsa dimostrerà di essere l'incredibile simulatore di corse che noi, così come chiunque altro, sappiamo che può diventare.

Cordiali saluti,
RaceDepartment.
 
I see where you are coming from. The joke was about the term "Feature Request", a common developer nuance, hence the joke. Sorry :)

From looking at how they have mention of this feature, it maybe in the works. (This is judging from the "entry_list.ini")

Also since they have added the "Broadcast" feature in Steam, is this really needed? Seems to me this will open slots instead of occupy them with spectators. But there could be something else that could be used for this I'm not seeing at the moment. I do see that there would need to be judges and having to follow at least 16 streams could be arduous.

But for stability and everything else that's requested in the letter, that's reworking the multiplayer aspect greatly from what it is.

Currently all the "server" side acts like is a connector between clients. It's more or less a "star network" topology where as the server is the hub/switch and doesn't take any offloading from the client to make for better stability between the clients. This works great if the clients are local and can transmit effectively. They are putting too much stock in people having "equal" connections it seems. Having a server that actually runs the game and collects data points from it's clients, processes them and then distributes evenly will take more off the clients, inversely giving a better experience with physics.

I'm not an expert but I've had much experience with client/server models, game server hosting and professional server work, not to mention friends that work in the gaming industry here in town. From the many discussions we've had, it's not as easy of a task to make a multiplayer backend and in this case "overhaul".

A few features aren't bad to add and shouldn't take long. But if stability and a equal weighing network model that will handle physics and data points are in order; it will take quite a bit more.

I think a few can agree.
 
is strange how many people she attacked those who ask some essential changes, I remind you that what you were asking specific already present and fully functional on sim than 10 years ago and more, perhaps too young to know or new sim fans, remember to you also that all the criticism / requests made to date in order to boys Kunos were realized in part, pit stop in MP and finally revised the horrible system of 5/2, this is to say that the things you do not ask then, are so stupid as some would believe, I still remember stupid fan boy who compared the request of the blue flag to want the girls on the pit lane at the start, these people sim understands how I understand quantum physics. Need to improve the multiplayer on lin this is a fact, clear as the sun, and those who say that MPs do not like can have fun with the career that is completed and running at 100% true?
 
I see where you are coming from. The joke was about the term "Feature Request", a common developer nuance, hence the joke. Sorry :)

From looking at how they have mention of this feature, it maybe in the works. (This is judging from the "entry_list.ini")

Also since they have added the "Broadcast" feature in Steam, is this really needed? Seems to me this will open slots instead of occupy them with spectators. But there could be something else that could be used for this I'm not seeing at the moment. I do see that there would need to be judges and having to follow at least 16 streams could be arduous.

But for stability and everything else that's requested in the letter, that's reworking the multiplayer aspect greatly from what it is.

Currently all the "server" side acts like is a connector between clients. It's more or less a "star network" topology where as the server is the hub/switch and doesn't take any offloading from the client to make for better stability between the clients. This works great if the clients are local and can transmit effectively. They are putting too much stock in people having "equal" connections it seems. Having a server that actually runs the game and collects data points from it's clients, processes them and then distributes evenly will take more off the clients, inversely giving a better experience with physics.

I'm not an expert but I've had much experience with client/server models, game server hosting and professional server work, not to mention friends that work in the gaming industry here in town. From the many discussions we've had, it's not as easy of a task to make a multiplayer backend and in this case "overhaul".

A few features aren't bad to add and shouldn't take long. But if stability and a equal weighing network model that will handle physics and data points are in order; it will take quite a bit more.

I think a few can agree.
1. kunos mentioned when they were working on flags and new penalty system (which is still being perfected)
1a. did not mention any broadcast working on, or spectating for that matter
1b. some wrong conclusions can be drawn out if they are secretly working on it.. whilst everyone thinks they give a bird about it

2. if ac works on star model of mp topology, what does lfs work on and how hard is it to reccreate? also which topology do you need for changing cars on server?
2a. is star topology cause of teleports if instability occurs in players connection? yes
2b. ive seen teleports happen in rfactor too, did they use same topology and ppl bemoaned 100x time less? yes
2c. are players obligated to eliminate every possiblity of laggin in an event? certainly so!
 
If they have any brains they would completely ignore this "open letter" just like all the other gripe lists posted daily on their own forums and continue developing and improving AC their way.

This is the part I don't understand with your post. How is the open letter a gripe list. I am honestly asking myself if we have read the same letter as I fail to see which parts you see as nagging? Actually I think the letter our AC staff wrote is constructive and pretty positive only addressing a few concerns with regards to us (and others) not being able to setup an online racing series with a large field of drivers that meets our quality standards.

The Virtual GT Series have been on hold since the introduction of multiplayer in AC and it is becoming increasingly frustrating to tell "no" to good willing members that like to race for points in an organized way.

Are online racers the majority of the customer-base? Absolutely not, and I don't think anybody is questioning that here. The aforementioned numbers 20/80 (online/offline) seem very accurate. Does that mean that the minority 20% should shut up and take the current unfinished multiplayer for what it is? Absolutely not. 20% is still a significant size of the customer base and they are entitled to voice their constructive criticism.

Those that have played netKar Pro over the years probably all agree that the physics of that game were spot on and every offline meter driven has been a joy, even with the total absence of AI. However driving the same distance online wasn't good (with exception of one build) and one of the reasons the game never became a big success in sales in the sim racing community.

Luckily AC is not heading that way, so personally I am confident that the concerns of the 20% minority will be taken into account and hopefully addressed as well. With the game being a sales hit on Steam the revenue made should be more than sufficient to hire a netcode specialist that can assist in improving the experience for the nagging minority.
 
- the days of 1.0 meaning a title is done and dusted are long over, you know that full well. That's just how the market is now, adjust.
Kunos knows what is missing and what is needed - FOR ALL THEIR CUSTOMERS - and are delivering what they can when they can.
Stomping our little feet over feature X or Y will achieve nothing, if you think you can do better, as I said: go ahead - I'll look forward to your perfect sim with perfect netcode (and good luck getting all the licenses Kunos managed too). :)

Right, so if 1.0 doesn't mean a done title, pray tell, why do they charge full price on steam, and the game is not listed as early access anymore? And why did they release a DLC before the game is finished? To charge FULL PRICE, fifty bucks no less, for a game that is still WIP, and remove the "early access" listing?
So how should I feel about them releasing DLCs for a game that isn't even finished? To me, it feels like a huge middle finger. And I wouldn't have been so furious if the game wasn't listed as "done", and removed from early accesss. Even if the price remained at fifty bucks, as long as it says "early access", it means the game is not fully complete yet and you should know what youre getting into. As it is now, it's kind of like lying, and promising things that aren't there yet (or, EARLY FREAKING ACCESS). They say there is multiplayer. The multiplayer is broken and a joke. The game isn't in early access anymore? Then I have full rights to go and complain about a feature that was promised and not delivered.
Have a look at the latest nVIDIA conundrum: The new gtx 970 (I think) has the wrong specs listed. So people got refunds.



Also, the "statistics" in this thread are hilarious. Studies show that XXX% of blah blah are blah blah. If you can't provide a reliable, relevant source, please avoid from saying things that you think are true. Maybe rephrase it to: "I think that there are more offline players than online, but I can't really prove it".
 
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Luckily AC is not heading that way, so personally I am confident that the concerns of the 20% minority will be taken into account and hopefully addressed as well.


Of course they should, absolutely. I repeat again: Show me where I said they shouldn't?

Kunos should support 100% of their customer base.
We agree on that. :)

So what makes the OP so special, or more special than any 1 single other customer who has posted their list of desires or requests on Kunos own forum?
(other than the fact that they have access to write headlines on a major sim news site?).

???

The beef seems to be that Kunos took time to add new content, as requested by their customers, picked by the customers themselves, rather than focus on features to please that 20% group.
Both would be nice of course! But with limited resources you're always going to deliver what the majority want first. No number of "open letters" is going to change that.
 
So what makes the OP so special, or more special than any 1 single other customer who has posted their list of desires or requests on Kunos own forum?
Where do we state that this letter is more special? All customer opinions are valid and valuable where ever they are written.

All news we post about AC and other games are headlines the moment they are published to the frontpage, there is nothing wrong with that and certainly not less or more important than companies communicating over twitter or facebook with a huge following reading their messages.

It's a constructive letter with recommendations how to make the game even better. Not a letter to bash a company or telling the world via a cheesy way that this game sucks, as it doesn't suck, we all agree on that.
 
Of course they should, absolutely. I repeat again: Show me where I said they shouldn't?

Kunos should support 100% of their customer base.
We agree on that. :)

So what makes the OP so special, or more special than any 1 single other customer who has posted their list of desires or requests on Kunos own forum?
(other than the fact that they have access to write headlines on a major sim news site?).

???

The beef seems to be that Kunos took time to add new content, as requested by their customers, picked by the customers themselves, rather than focus on features to please that 20% group.
Both would be nice of course! But with limited resources you're always going to deliver what the majority want first. No number of "open letters" is going to change that.

I'm pretty sure much more than 20% of the game's users are unhappy that one of the game's core functionality is broken.

If the AI was decent, it would've made up for it a little bit - but essentially, I don't want to hotlap alone by myself all day. If only 20% of AC players feel the same way, it'd be very surprising.
 
Something being overlooked by some here...look at that Assetto Corsa logo, whats it say?
"Your Racing Simulator"
Now ask yourself, what is racing?
Now ask yourself...does Assetto give you that?
My answer is no...its a driving game not a racing simulator. They might wish to be a simulator but at present they are not a racing simulator.
Racing the AI i dont care for, all my racing sims i only use online. You learn and improve from racing real humans making far more calculated reactions than you ever will with AI.
Its seems a lot of guys dont understand what racing actually is these days! This is also why there are leagues to avoid the public lobby events. Leagues try create real racing simulations and require a sim that has features that support that.
And yes, i have raced in reality...and yes i have won in reality, but Kunos need to make fundamental changes if they expect to keep going long term.

What stopped me using Assetto or having faith they would get there in the end was when i thin kit was Stefano said in a post on RD that the collision issues were no issue!
Thats the moment i realized Assetto would never fill my needs as a racing simulator.
 
You would still need to have the DLC cars downloaded to race against them, otherwise you would race against some texture placeholder boxes. So they would need to let everyone download DLC content, which in turn needs some encryption so cars can't be unlocked, and encryptions tend to get hacked. Ultimately this is problematic of the whole DLC concept, no easy solution exists.

Well i currently have a SSD half full with content i will never buy (or more precisely pay to unlock) in RRRE. I don't see that being pirated or hacked.
It can be done with a bit of time and effort.
 
What all die hard simracers want: AC with online system of iR, but at cost of AC
What AC devs want: catering for all stakeholders, not only die-hard simracers, who are DE FACTO a very very big minority.

We can all think we are the core of AC here on RD or on AC official forum, but fact is that 80-90% of their customers wouldn't care too much about all the online improvements.

Kunos is a business, and it's market is not the same as many seem to think.

Solution? Let's start a crowdfunding action here on RD to fund Kunos to hire skilled MP programmers....? :)
 
Maybe making these leagues/organized racing more public and ease the access to casual public would turn up the appeal for online multiplayer (organized) racing. And even one or two divisions in that league.

I still think and see leagues in sim racing as elitism.. as a quite restricted club that only friends of friends know about.

Then what's the casual sim racers have left to do? Play some offline by himself or against the A.I.. or join the boring Spa with GT cars. In AC forums we suggested track rotation to the devs, so that we get a server to do races in different locations, because is very boring to repeat the same quali-race on the same place.. so people usually go away after one race and don't return much to Online mode. I think the devs noted our request already and sometime in the future we expect to get a more diversified online racing.

Also, the casual sim racer in AC doesn't seem to have an easy life creating a quick online server for his buddy or buddies to race together for a while, I read this in steam discussions. Some other race games give an easy access to play online with everybody or just your friends. This also puts away people.
 
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I still think and see leagues in sim racing as elitism.. as a quite restricted club that only friends of friends know about.

It's either you have that, or you have F1 201x style public races (crashing, bad sportsmanship, etc). I wouldn't say it's elitism. I'm not the best racer, neither are the guys I race with. Also, we aren't restricted. Vice versa! We encourage more people to join us all the time, it's in our interest. I didn't have any friends in this community when I came to try it out, but I quickly made some. So it isn't really that secluded.
So I was pretty much in the same situation you described, sick of offline play, but with nowhere to go to race onine. So I searched for a good simracing community, and I got here.

And I know, It's kind of a crappy situation if you're a guy who's not into all that hassle (even though it really isn't a hassle), who just wants to sit down, race, and leave. But that's the thing with this specific genre: It doesn't work. Unless we're talking about iRacing, where they have a whole system implemented to prevent the kind of public races you'd see on F1 201x.
 
Completely agree. AC gives me the best feeling of any sim through my wheel, has great variety of official cars and tracks and also looks great yet I have never had the urge to sign up to a racing league like I have on numerous other racing sims/games. That just comes down to basic features that are missing and I dont believe AC in its current state can produce a functional season of online racing.
 
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