Mobile Driving/Flying Cockpit with Motion and Tactile ( Build )

[RCHeliguy]

If it's OK with all of you, I'd really like to not have any more arguments over how to apply filtering. I've made my choice and I'll share how that works. Use if you wish or don't. This is my rig and how I'd like to do things.

I'm looking forward to getting my BK-CT installed and having "Stage 1" complete

 

[anton_Chez]

I think it's a good thing that someone has used an alternative method for using a DSP feature. There might come a time where people find it hard to get the DSP models. Also, people might have an amp lying around that does not have it on board and want to see what it feels like when their units are tuned to get the most out of the target range. So having another source of information to follow along with, especially someone that seems to have it working quite well, is great.

DSP method is there for those that have the amp/s, like me, and for those that for whatever reason do not possess that ability, there is this method. Ultimately, it achieves the same thing and if you're unaffected by it using VR and all of your other things, I think it's safe to assume it has very minimal side effects.

 

[RCHeliguy]

I took a few spare minutes today to fabricate a horizontal bracket. I've been up since 3AM and it's now 3PM.

I'll swap the TST429 with the TST329 when I pull the pedal deck up to install the BK-CT later. My aluminum arrives Friday, Sorbothane donuts, Saturday, the BK-CT is Monday-Wednesday and the rubber washers won't be here until Thursday. So it will be next weekend before I can get that complete.

But I would like to see if changing the orientation changes anything before I modify anything else. Specifically I want to make sure I don't hear anymore out of it since it's now broadcasting up vs. sideways.

 

[HoiHman]

But I would like to see if changing the orientation changes anything before I modify anything else. Specifically I want to make sure I don't hear anymore out of it since it's now broadcasting up vs. sideways.

On my rig the orientation made a big difference.

I use fairly large and flexible rubbers on my heel plate and changing the orientation from up/down to backwards/forwards give a very big improvement in performance.

The piston should move in the direction the rubbers flex the most.

Short demo (google foto's)
https://photos.app.goo.gl/nDcByEpJiNvCTB6a8

The increase was so significant that 2 mini LFE's in the configuration outperform the BK Advance easily.

 

[RCHeliguy]

The piston should move in the direction the rubbers flex the most.

Since there are no rubbers and my seat is on a universal joint this orientation increases the lever arm of the TST unit a bit. Basically it has space within the slop of the joint to vibrate my seat.

Edit: I completely missed your comments about the footplate because I was still focused on my seat. My foot plate is designed to move up/down on 4 x M8 bolts with silicone tubing around them. They have a 1/8 rubber washers on each side of the plate and then 1/2" of Sorbothane held in a 3D printed cup. This dampens out vibration more than encouraging it.

 

[RCHeliguy]

Just got my 5K rowing time under 21min, been safely under 180lbs for almost a week and I'm back into my 32in (non- relaxed fit) shorts. I've also been upping my weights and really pushing those last few reps out.

Of course this is all just to reduce the weight load on my NLRv3 so I can pile more stuff on it

But in all seriousness I've noticed that sim racing feels more exerting! I may not need neck muscles capable of handling massive G's of side to side acceleration and deceleration, but I've been feeling a lot more fatigued after driving a while on my sim.

Maybe I've been enjoying my SC2 Pro a bit too much and I've already mentioned that being seatbelted in snuggly means I'm feeling the motion more and along with the improved tactile, it "feels" like I'm going faster which takes more concentration and that leaves me more fatigued.

I'm probably going to drop my motion back even further as well.

I'm building up my strength and stamina for other reasons, but I'm hoping there will be benefits on my rig as well.

 

[HoiHman]

Just got my 5K rowing time under 21min, been safely under 180lbs for almost a week and I'm back into my 32in (non- relaxed fit) shorts. I've also been upping my weights and really pushing those last few reps out.

Of course this is all just to reduce the weight load on my NLRv3 so I can pile more stuff on it

But in all seriousness I've noticed that sim racing feels more exerting! I may not need neck muscles capable of handling massive G's of side to side acceleration and deceleration, but I've been feeling a lot more fatigued after driving a while on my sim.

Maybe I've been enjoying my SC2 Pro a bit too much and I've already mentioned that being seatbelted in snuggly means I'm feeling the motion more and along with the improved tactile, it "feels" like I'm going faster which takes more concentration and that leaves me more fatigued.

I'm probably going to drop my motion back even further as well.

I'm building up my strength and stamina for other reasons, but I'm hoping there will be benefits on my rig as well.

I seriously did this in the quite a few years ago: Trying to loose weight so the GS-4 with me in it were well under the safe weight limit of the NLMv3

In the last 12 months i lost over 35 pounds, which is something you really notice with a belt tensioner .

Now sometimes when friends come over to try out the simulator i have to loosen the belts for them instead of tighten them. Which is a good feeling.

Generally over the years i have also turned down the motion (of the SFX) to make it a less physical experience.
Less = More

 

[RCHeliguy]

Congratulations! That is quite an accomplishment! Definitely not the direction many have gone since Covid.

I heard someone say last year that Covid either made you a hunk, a drunk, or a chunk.

 

[RCHeliguy]

After a bit of testing, I can't tell a huge difference in how my seat TST329 feels horizontally vs. Vertically, but critically it didn't suddenly become loud, so I'm all go to put the TST429 back there.

After turning off all SimHub precalibration, I am getting some better feedback from my TST429 down to about 35Hz, but It's just not meant to go that low, so I'm looking forward to getting another BK-CT at my feet.

I am absolutely loving the effects I'm getting out of my seat. I look forward to having my foot plate in sync with the seat.

Since I'm going to swap the TST's, I know that adding the BK in front will allow me to make both front and back feel "right" and I'm excited to get there

Once I get that in next weekend, I'll start planning for the exciters, probably order a Behringer 304 and another pair of Neutrik 8-pole connectors. I already received another pair of stereo 1/8 to XLR connectors to drive the exciters.

Doing my best to get as close to the Phase 1 system as I can get.

 

[RCHeliguy]

As promised Equalizer APO video tutorial
Hopefully this takes care of explaining how these work.

FYI, Camtasia has definitely improved over the years. The direct YouTube integration worked very well and I believe the video shown is pretty sharp using all default settings. A number of years back, I would render a video and it would end up looking muddy after being uploaded to YouTube.

 

[anton_Chez]

I definitely agree that sub 40hz is not the TST strong point. Up around 50hz is where it really starts to get strong and with the right EQ all the way up to 100hz+ is good. The BK CT actually has a decent range above its awesome 25hz strength. If you didn’t have anything like a TST to take over, you could easily have 80hz signals coming out of it. Which is good, actually, because as someone with only 2 units (which are more or less EQ’d to work as a single unit across the entire 1-200hz spectrum), it gives some flexibility to still separate some effects across the two units with the same target hz.

 

[RCHeliguy]

The aluminum and new BK-CT arrived. This weekend is full up with family stuff, so I won't be able to do anything for a little while, but doubt I'll be able to wait until the next full weekend to get started and will likely chip away at it during the early AM hours next week.

Also it won't be as large the pieces there. I got everything oversized so I could cut it down. This company gets me aluminum in 2 days from one state away and they are very reasonable, but sometimes the aluminum is greasy and mucked up a bit so I get a bit extra in case the ends are messed up. However this shipment looks pretty good.

I like the satin finish I get with my orbital sander, so I'll probably at least do the tubing that way and maybe the whole thing.

 

[HoiHman]

Looking forward to the result Can"t wait to see your solution.
I'm still wondering though if a BK-CT isn't overkill for a single isolated heel plate

I get most of my project stuff done to in the early AM hours.

 

[anton_Chez]

I actually feel a lot of the feedback through my pedal plate also, however my units are only under the seat. The power of the CT does an amazing job of engrossing your whole rig with tactile even though it’s semi isolated under the seat. Personally I doubt I’d ever bother investing in another unit and amp for the front of the chassis simply because of how it already feels with the units I have.

 

[metalnwood]

I also think its harder than maybe I am hearing to isolate all of this completely. I can tell that my pedal plate is isolated, using the acellerometer I can measure how much the drop off is - and then I get in it and it obviously travels through my body and can feel the pedal vibrations quite energetic in my seat at times as well. Harder when you have to take the person out of the equation!

 

[RCHeliguy]

I actually feel a lot of the feedback through my pedal plate also, however my units are only under the seat. The power of the CT does an amazing job of engrossing your whole rig with tactile even though it’s semi isolated under the seat. Personally I doubt I’d ever bother investing in another unit and amp for the front of the chassis simply because of how it already feels with the units I have.

My foot plate has sorbothane isolators and I can not feel my CT from my seat in my foot plate with my feet resting on it. If I don't have the weight of my feet on my foot plate and put a glass with water on it it will vibrate a bit.

My seat is also on a pivot and the CT is outboard on my seat bracket, so much is dampened out by the weight of my body.

Even with the TST429 on my foot plate, I can't get everything I want out of one transducer there.

I won't need to use a lot of volume on my CT, but it will definitely help with creating a feeling that matches the seat in feeling so there will be continuity.

I'm actually thinking that this will look pretty cool too

I look forward to having time to work on it.

 

[metalnwood]

I knew your pedal configuration but wasnt thinking the obvious impact which was that you had tactile directly on to that.

Quite good really, you can run lower power and get better isolation given lower power and less mass. On mine and most others we have the weight of the pedal tray and any heel tray on that, as well as the pedals. So the mass is getting up there, more power required, harder to isolate.

 

[blekenbleu]

using the acellerometer I can measure how much the drop off is

What accelerometer do you use?

 

[RCHeliguy]

I think the easiest thing to use is a phone app.

Accelerometer Meter - Apps on Google Play

Accelerometer sensor as Meter, Graph, Spectrum, Music, Light, Info

play.google.com

I've actually got FBL controllers for my RC Helicopters with vibration analysis that let you see the vibrations on 3 axis, but the phone apps are fine for this. Just use something sticky to hold the phone in place. I have a non-drying window caulk in rolls that I use for everything.

 

[metalnwood]

What accelerometer do you use?

Yes I was using a phone one on android called 'myFrequency'. It seemed quite good, is able to pickup the vibration frequencies and amplitude so I could see what it was on the pedals and then what it was on other parts of the rig.

There was a curious thing though... At one point I could measure what was coming from the pedals and its freq at 45hz, then on the back of the rig after vibrations had gone through isolation is was naturally less measured amplitude but also the freq was half.

Either interesting things are happening how the freq changes going through things like the rubber and spring isolators or - and likely I need to increase the sample rate.. it could be just as likely that on its default lower sample rate occasionally it would see a freq as only half what it was. It was interesting to play with though.