AC GT3 @ Monza - Sunday 12th September 2021

[Goblin616]

There is a secret path on the left I could take

I suppose you could put your camber out as far as possible - that would make it a /little/ wider!

 

[Goblin616]

I was wondering if anybody would be interested in trying 1-shot qualifying in a future GT3 race?

How it would work: Every racer has 1 chance to put in their best lap: out lap, hot lap, in lap. We can line up in the pits, or wait until you're ready to go out, but only leave the pit lane to begin your attempt when the car ahead is on his in lap. This can be communicated by the driver, (ex. 'I'm coming in' - preferred) - or by paying attention to the track map / watching the driver in view mode.

Why? For fun! Everyone has a clean open track to make their attempt. We all get equal track time, an open track, and 1 chance to do our best. If you mess up, that's that. It could lead to more action during the race, at least in the beginning. One chance means some of us that usually end up at the rear may get a chance to move up the grid. This could be to a very good lap, or because of mistakes at the front. Of course it's entirely possible we end up with a normal grid because the top drivers put in good laps, and the bottom drivers put in bad laps

I'm not trying to be controversial. I just think it could be fun to try. We'll see how the grid ends up, and what the race is like afterward. We're here for fun, and to enjoy ourselves - the results don't really matter

 

[gearwhine]

No body wants to drive the Audi so i will volunteer. Do i get a half a lap start?

 

[Goblin616]

No body wants to drive the Audi so i will volunteer. Do i get a half a lap start?

Only if it's the TT cup car

 

[HF2000]

No body wants to drive the Audi so i will volunteer. Do i get a half a lap start?

Well, the Audi R8 should be quite competitive here (same engine as the Lambo), if you can drive it wingless.

Lots of Nissans have signed up, including myself but they have to much drag and will lack the top speed to keep up with the Lambo, the Glickenhaus and the wingless 650s.
But I can't drive those cars so I can only hope to be the fastest GT-R.

 

[boomRoasted]

Lots of Nissans have signed up, including myself but they have to much drag and will lack the top speed to keep up with the Lambo, the Glickenhaus and the wingless 650s.

I changed my vehicle choice to the Nissan as I’m running two seconds faster in it consistently. What could this be due to? Braking, cornering technique, or is my “rookieness” still a factor? In the grand scheme of things it doesn’t matter, the games are made up and the points don’t matter…but I’d like to have a better understanding of what causes these differences in lap-times.

 

[HF2000]

I changed my vehicle choice to the Nissan as I’m running two seconds faster in it consistently. What could this be due to? Braking, cornering technique, or is my “rookieness” still a factor? In the grand scheme of things it doesn’t matter, the games are made up and the points don’t matter…but I’d like to have a better understanding of what causes these differences in lap-times.

My best GT3 lap time on almost every track isn't with the Nissan. I'm faster with the R8 or 488 in a single lap. But in the race I'm more consistent with the GT-R due to more forgiveness of the car. I have with the R8 and the 488 often snap oversteer forcing me to spin.
I would like to qualify with the 488 and race with the Nissan. But that's not possible of course.

 

[RasmusP]

I changed my vehicle choice to the Nissan as I’m running two seconds faster in it consistently. What could this be due to? Braking, cornering technique, or is my “rookieness” still a factor? In the grand scheme of things it doesn’t matter, the games are made up and the points don’t matter…but I’d like to have a better understanding of what causes these differences in lap-times.

- Nissan has massive acceleration and good top speed. You don't lose that much time when you don't nail a corner exit

- the Nissan brakes really well and you can nicely rotate it towards the apex while still slowing down. So you don't need to nail the braking point either

- the Nissan is easy to catch when sliding. So a little kerb here and there or even jumping over a sausage kerb won't throw you completely off

The Nissan has 2 issues though:
- mid corner understeer. To make the car turn nicely when rolling, you need to make the setup so oversteery that braking & accelerating becomes a ride on a bullet...

- mushy. It's just a bit wonky overall and doesn't have the same feel of stiffness the lambo, r8 and 650s have

But yeah, I'm currently quickest with the Nissan too. Only 3 tenths vs the lambo, but a lot safer...

 

[Interslice]

No body wants to drive the Audi so i will volunteer. Do i get a half a lap start?

Welcome along Steve

 

[beginer]

I changed my vehicle choice to the Nissan as I’m running two seconds faster in it consistently. What could this be due to? Braking, cornering technique, or is my “rookieness” still a factor? In the grand scheme of things it doesn’t matter, the games are made up and the points don’t matter…but I’d like to have a better understanding of what causes these differences in lap-times.

"Whos racing line is it, anyway"

 

[beginer]

I was wondering if anybody would be interested in trying 1-shot qualifying in a future GT3 race?

How it would work: Every racer has 1 chance to put in their best lap: out lap, hot lap, in lap. We can line up in the pits, or wait until you're ready to go out, but only leave the pit lane to begin your attempt when the car ahead is on his in lap. This can be communicated by the driver, (ex. 'I'm coming in' - preferred) - or by paying attention to the track map / watching the driver in view mode.

Why? For fun! Everyone has a clean open track to make their attempt. We all get equal track time, an open track, and 1 chance to do our best. If you mess up, that's that. It could lead to more action during the race, at least in the beginning. One chance means some of us that usually end up at the rear may get a chance to move up the grid. This could be to a very good lap, or because of mistakes at the front. Of course it's entirely possible we end up with a normal grid because the top drivers put in good laps, and the bottom drivers put in bad laps

I'm not trying to be controversial. I just think it could be fun to try. We'll see how the grid ends up, and what the race is like afterward. We're here for fun, and to enjoy ourselves - the results don't really matter

I wonder if the starting grid would look different. Its an interesting idea, the pressure would feel different (only having one shot to make a good lap).

 

[RasmusP]

I wonder if the starting grid would look different. Its an interesting idea, the pressure would feel different (only having one shot to make a good lap).

I like the idea but it won't really work.. It would probably just make the usual gaps bigger with a few consistent people moving up.
When looking at the results of our events, the finish order is almost the same as when you'd sort it for consistency.

Also a lot of us don't practice much. Like me, more often than I'd like

So the qualy session is often also my extended practice session with only 1-2 good laps.
Usually my fastest laps are during the race, not in qualy.

This would mean people who practice more before the event will probably start higher up the order.
From my experience the people who practice more are further up the order anyway right now though...

I also usually have a free track during qualy without single shot qualy. Just let people by until you see a big gap behind you in the realtime app and you should be free for your hotlap.

 

[random2k4]

I like the idea but it won't really work.. It would probably just make the usual gaps bigger with a few consistent people moving up.
When looking at the results of our events, the finish order is almost the same as when you'd sort it for consistency.

Also a lot of us don't practice much. Like me, more often than I'd like

So the qualy session is often also my extended practice session with only 1-2 good laps.
Usually my fastest laps are during the race, not in qualy.

This would mean people who practice more before the event will probably start higher up the order.
From my experience the people who practice more are further up the order anyway right now though...

I also usually have a free track during qualy without single shot qualy. Just let people by until you see a big gap behind you in the realtime app and you should be free for your hotlap.

Wait, are you telling me there is hope if I just start practicing more before a race.

 

[boomRoasted]

My best GT3 lap time on almost every track isn't with the Nissan. I'm faster with the R8 or 488 in a single lap. But in the race I'm more consistent with the GT-R due to more forgiveness of the car. I have with the R8 and the 488 often snap oversteer forcing me to spin.
I would like to qualify with the 488 and race with the Nissan. But that's not possible of course.

- Nissan has massive acceleration and good top speed. You don't lose that much time when you don't nail a corner exit

- the Nissan brakes really well and you can nicely rotate it towards the apex while still slowing down. So you don't need to nail the braking point either

- the Nissan is easy to catch when sliding. So a little kerb here and there or even jumping over a sausage kerb won't throw you completely off

The Nissan has 2 issues though:
- mid corner understeer. To make the car turn nicely when rolling, you need to make the setup so oversteery that braking & accelerating becomes a ride on a bullet...

- mushy. It's just a bit wonky overall and doesn't have the same feel of stiffness the lambo, r8 and 650s have

But yeah, I'm currently quickest with the Nissan too. Only 3 tenths vs the lambo, but a lot safer...

Thanks, gents. Looks like it’s back to practice to find the seconds in a different car. I guess the real question is, is it better to choose a car your faster in or enjoy driving more? Hmmmm…

 

[RasmusP]

Thanks, gents. Looks like it’s back to practice to find the seconds in a different car. I guess the real question is, is it better to choose a car your faster in or enjoy driving more? Hmmmm…

Enjoying the driving itself is the most important.
Second important thing is to be comfortable and consistent so you can battle with others at your pace with confidence.

Ofc if you don't have someone at your pace with the car you're slower with, taking the faster car might be a good compromise.
Then you can enjoy the race until you spin and are alone at the back (talking from experience )

 

[Kek700]

I always race for fun, my pit stop strategy is always enjoyment first.
I may extend a pit stop, but it will always be at a good, for me pace, then a pit stop to a faster strategy so I have the pleasure, hopefully of the chase.
Or a more normal 50:50 strategy.
Running a 1 litre fuel strategy may make sense.
But 60 minutes with a full tank of fuel , then knackered tyres does not fill me with joy.
Plus I always suffer the Barrichello effect, thinking and driving for a win is for me a certain death nell on any ambition I may have in that direction.

So for me it is always pleasure first, and be very grateful of any thing that comes my way.

 

[Shed 17]

I agree with Rasmus and Ernie, it has to be fun but I kind of know how Logan feels.
I'm still a relative newbie and have been trying different GT3 cars to find something I am happy with. The Z4 and GTR seem to be my go to favorites as they offer a reasonably stable platform and are good all rounders for us less experienced drivers here.
I tried the Lambo in the Le Mans 2 hours race and while it was quick, I always felt that is was going to bite me without any warning and this made the whole 2 hours something of a struggle and not really enjoyable at all. I couldn't really race and felt like I was just hanging on.

I much prefer to be able to have a good race with someone of similar ability in a car that I am on top of and can push to my limits and am in some sort of control of. But like Logan, I always think I could go faster if in a different car but in reality the limits are in my abilities and if I concentrate on my braking points and lines my lap times will improve.

This reminds me of an article in a motorcycle magazine many years ago when some high profile and quick journalists tested the then World Superbike Champion Carl Fogerty's Ducati. They were shocked to find how easy to ride it was, not blindingly over powerful like some of the 'Big Bang' motors of the time. Carl commented that that's the way he likes it, to be the master of his machine and to be consistently fast over the race distance and able to race it. Many years ago I used to compete in offroad motorcycling and while I was a reasonably competent rider, I know the top guys could have ridden a lawn mower and been quicker than me, yet if I tried their bikes I would still be me at my pace or at worse in the nearest hospital!

So I think Logan used the word 'consistently' in his use of the GTR and that's the key to this in my opinion. Look at Han's consistency records and the are always in the mid or higher 99+% brackets over a race distance.

Like Casper, I really like the 911 for it aesthetics and over a couple of laps it is quite quick in my inexperienced hands, but I understand it eats tyres and with the weight right out the back can spring a few surprises. Have any of the really quick guys ever given the 911 a serious go or is it just too unpredictable and the tyre thing makes it unviable in a 60 minute race? A challenge for Ernie maybe?

 

[RasmusP]

Like Casper, I really like the 911 for it aesthetics and over a couple of laps it is quite quick in my inexperienced hands, but I understand it eats tyres and with the weight right out the back can spring a few surprises. Have any of the really quick guys ever given the 911 a serious go or is it just too unpredictable and the tyre thing makes it unviable in a 60 minute race? A challenge for Ernie maybe?

I did one brand's hatch gp race last year with the 911.
I might have the replay but I'm pretty sure that I recorded the full race with motec.

If you want I could check if I changed my mediums or did the full race on one set.
I was pretty happy with the result but not sure where I finished.

I also have the setup if you want

 

[Kek700]

To add to paul's comments.

I try and pick a car that I think suits the circuit I am on, Monza is a good example, Lamborghini is a good choice for this circuit. It has a low CD, it has high power output.
But you have to sacrifice a lot of Downforce to gain those advantages + a lot of stability into the bargain.
I can match my times in all the cars compared to the Lamborgini, but they individually require some sacrifice.
For example, I can match the Nissan to the Lamborghini, but I have to rag the hell out of the Nissan all the time, making a 60-minute race a real ordeal, but I almost certainly will stay on the circuit.
The Lamborghini is much easier to drive, but a spin is almost inevitable.
The AMG is really very good here, very quick, very very easy to drive, very difficult to get the best from it, a car I just cannot enjoy.
Audi, very capable here, I just cannot for 60 minutes be so totally involved into not overheating the soft tyres, or trying to get 100% from mediums.
The 911 is just so different to the other GT3 cars, you really need to be 100% committed to driving it, not a car you can jump into and out of at random. The same problem as the Audi, but more so with its soft tyres.
Learning to drive it with a low rear wing is really what this car is all about, a long but rewarding learning curve, this is my favourite car. It has the ability to wipe out it's soft tyres make it difficult for a joe soap to use, I have on a couple of occasions used it to good effect by my standards, but I am always on a back foot with it.
Ferrari is a faster McLaren, but like the McLaren, quick here, both, especially the McLaren need a very low wing, both are then tricky.
The Glickenhaus is probably the actual fastest here, drinks and requires fuel that is virtually alcoholic and an engine sound that make a food mixer sound exciting, difficult like the Amg to get any pace out of it.
The Lamborghini is just about a match for anything here overall, but you will be running it 0,0 wing, so it's good luck with that, that is going to be a spin from me in this race.
The BMW Z4 is a dream to drive, well balanced, easy, small and compact, really good on its brakes. The only downside, well two, sounds terrible, that engine is so dull, you really have to totally rely on your ability to generate exit speed at the start of the three straights here to stop being a victim on the straight.

Just my point of view having driven them all here, an Alien will probably have a totally different perspective.

 

[Shed 17]

To add to paul's comments.

I try and pick a car that I think suits the circuit I am on, Monza is a good example, Lamborghini is a good choice for this circuit. It has a low CD, it has high power output.
But you have to sacrifice a lot of Downforce to gain those advantages + a lot of stability into the bargain.
I can match my times in all the cars compared to the Lamborgini, but they individually require some sacrifice.
For example, I can match the Nissan to the Lamborghini, but I have to rag the hell out of the Nissan all the time, making a 60-minute race a real ordeal, but I almost certainly will stay on the circuit.
The Lamborghini is much easier to drive, but a spin is almost inevitable.
The AMG is really very good here, very quick, very very easy to drive, very difficult to get the best from it, a car I just cannot enjoy.
Audi, very capable here, I just cannot for 60 minutes be so totally involved into not overheating the soft tyres, or trying to get 100% from mediums.
The 911 is just so different to the other GT3 cars, you really need to be 100% committed to driving it, not a car you can jump into and out of at random. The same problem as the Audi, but more so with its soft tyres.
Learning to drive it with a low rear wing is really what this car is all about, a long but rewarding learning curve, this is my favourite car. It has the ability to wipe out it's soft tyres make it difficult for a joe soap to use, I have on a couple of occasions used it to good effect by my standards, but I am always on a back foot with it.
Ferrari is a faster McLaren, but like the McLaren, quick here, both, especially the McLaren need a very low wing, both are then tricky.
The Glickenhaus is probably the actual fastest here, drinks and requires fuel that is virtually alcoholic and an engine sound that make a food mixer sound exciting, difficult like the Amg to get any pace out of it.
The Lamborghini is just about a match for anything here overall, but you will be running it 0,0 wing, so it's good luck with that, that is going to be a spin from me in this race.
The BMW Z4 is a dream to drive, well balanced, easy, small and compact, really good on its brakes. The only downside, well two, sounds terrible, that engine is so dull, you really have to totally rely on your ability to generate exit speed at the start of the three straights here to stop being a victim on the straight.

Just my point of view having driven them all here, an Alien will probably have a totally different perspective.

Superb summary Ernie, if you have the set up for the 911 I would be curious to give it a go sometime. I’ m sure many of us here appreciate your experience and comments. .