Are pneumatic pedals as reliable as those based on elastomers? (NT)

[F1Aussie]

Pedals turned up yesterday, very impressed with the rigidity and build quality of them, is AAA. unfortunately the brake pedal pad had some scoring on it from transport, David has quickly jumped onto it and is going to send me a replacement one.
Will post some pics once setup.

 

[F1Aussie]

Spent the last two days on and of setting up the new pedals. Only had an hour to test it out tonight but I must say that the brake feels very different to the Sprint one, but in a good way. A lot easier to accurately modulate.

It feels much firmer and easier to control and it does not have the squish feeling that you get with elastomers. Brake pedal travel is quite short but I like that.

I have a few adjustments to make yet with the heel rest and height of throttle pedal and to tidy up some cabling.

David sent me an email with a link to a video about stopping the port scanning and I guess it has worked. My shakers and DDU worked flawlessly.

 

[Elaphe]

Last week I changed my Assetto Corsa from SteamVR to OpenXR. Now the VR monitor from the pedals app doesn't work. It seems it requires SteamVR to work. According to my tests, any game that is launched in OpenXR mode closes SteamVR when it loads. If you try to open SteamVR while it's working it crashes. That's what happenned to me when I ued my hotkey for the brake pressure (the adjustment is made but loading the VR monitor crashes the game). I have tried to set the VR monitor to work with Open Composite, but it reports and error (I suppose it's not compatible). Same happens when I ovewrite openvr_api.dll in its folder. If this monitor overlay doesn't work in OpenXR mode that will be a problem because most users are abandoning SteamVR and all new games will work with OpenXR. I have already reported this issue to David. Alternative solution: an app for Assetto Corsa which displays the current brake pressure value, but for that it has to be able to read that value (no idea where).

EDIT:

David has already answered: his VR Monitor will support OpenXR in the future. That's great.

However, I have found a good alternative: my app for Assetto Corsa is already working. The information about the current brake pressure is side by side with the force feedback and the shakers volume. The script for my button box sends the hotkeys and the app changes the text on screen. The script also updates the value on a ini file on every change. The app reads the ini file when AC loads. The initial value of the ini is extracted by my script from a log file generated by the pedals program when it is closed.

 

[F1Aussie]

Forgot I had not uploaded any photos of setup pedals, here they are below.

 

[Elaphe]

F1Aussie, have you tried with and without the throttle rest accessory and can tell if it's worth or not?

 

[MuddyFox]

Nice pics of the new babies!

Two questions, if I may.
First, how much space is there from the baseplate to the top plate? What's your shoe size and how's the fit in there, with the heel up against the heel rest?

Second, how far apart are the pedals in your configuration? Any dimension will do, center piston to center piston, or middle of the pedalface to middle of the pedalface.

Looking really hard at these, but I worry about the sizing for the people with larger feet...

Thanks!

 

[gdjenks13]

View attachment 705379

The cylinder used on the throttle is pneumatic, you can see the bolts with the vents at top and bottom of the cylinder.
The cylinder on the brake has a vented bolt at the top of the cylinder and a sealed bolt at the bottom so I would assume the cylinder is now holding a fluid of some type.

Hi Bob, I purchased SimworX Pro GT 3.1 pedals used off of the iRacing forums back in December 2023. Original owner took great care of them and was very friendly. I did my due diligence too and watched all of SRG's review, researched "pneumatics", and came to the conclusion that there must be no liquid in them. Which was the biggest reason I bought them.

Well. I can confirm there is green liquid within the brake cylinder, and it is leaking from the top bolt right below the spring. Green liquid has splattered all over the pneumatic cylinder, and leaked into a puddle on top of the control box. I am not sure when the leak started, but I noticed it Thursday May 16. The last time I used the pedals was Tuesday May 14. Even today, when I pushed the brake, it felt the same as it always does to me.

I am very confused... and your comments are the only place on the internet that give me hope of a solution. Do you have any idea what I can do to replace the liquid / fix my pedals / whatever I need to do?

I have emailed SimworX, they were helpful with a software issue I had in February, but they have not yet responded to my questions.

 

[Bob73]

Sorry to read about the unfortunate situation with your set of SimworX pedals.
You are right about the use of a fluid in the brake cylinder being something that is not readily mentioned in any reviews or the instructions that come with the pedals. I watched three quite detailed reviews (two with English subtitles) and no mention was made.
I also choose the pedals for the same reasons that you did, but after receiving them I came across a unofficial Facebook group for SimworX products and a couple of guys on there had commented on the brake cylinder seals failing and releasing a green fluid. Unfortunately the Facebook group is now closed.

From the comments posted SimworX came to the rescue sent out replacement cylinders and that was all that was said.

Hopefully you will get some assistance from them and directions on how to dismantle replace the seals and fluid instead of having a new cylinder shipped over from Australia.

What was the software issue that you had? I noticed with the new v3.2 pedals they have released a proprietary piece of control/setup software and have been meaning to see if it’s compatible with the v3.1s and what functionality it offers. With the v3.1s I was advised to use DiView to help calibrate the pedals.

 

[gdjenks13]

Sorry to read about the unfortunate situation with your set of SimworX pedals.
You are right about the use of a fluid in the brake cylinder being something that is not readily mentioned in any reviews or the instructions that come with the pedals. I watched three quite detailed reviews (two with English subtitles) and no mention was made.
I also choose the pedals for the same reasons that you did, but after receiving them I came across a unofficial Facebook group for SimworX products and a couple of guys on there had commented on the brake cylinder seals failing and releasing a green fluid. Unfortunately the Facebook group is now closed.

From the comments posted SimworX came to the rescue sent out replacement cylinders and that was all that was said.

Hopefully you will get some assistance from them and directions on how to dismantle replace the seals and fluid instead of having a new cylinder shipped over from Australia.

What was the software issue that you had? I noticed with the new v3.2 pedals they have released a proprietary piece of control/setup software and have been meaning to see if it’s compatible with the v3.1s and what functionality it offers. With the v3.1s I was advised to use DiView to help calibrate the pedals.

You have keen eyes. The throttle would get stuck for a fraction of a second time-to-time, and the cause was Windows 11. They sent a firmware upgrade and that fixed it for me. They were helpful with that issue, not so much with this one.

I received an email back from them. No apology for their pedals breaking, just a “we’ll send you a replacement for $160AUD + shipping, do you have the tools to fix it yourself?” Based on this email, I don’t think the seals are replaceable

I want to support companies making cool sim racing stuff, but the lack of transparency from them is disheartening. There’s no way Barry @ SRG’s review should fail to mention hydraulics. I don’t know how that was allowed by SimworX or Barry… a shame.

Pedals this expensive should not break after 2.5 years of light-moderate use. I should have bought a new pair of non-hydraulic pedals instead.

 

[gdjenks13]

Additionally, here are photos of the leak. For anyone considering hydraulics… be warned. I had to spend my free time on Saturday reading a book, the horror!

 

[Neilski]

I had to spend my free time on Saturday reading a book, the horror!

Definitely in the "cruel and unusual punishment" category

For anyone considering hydraulics… be warned.

This is particularly galling for people like yourself who didn't actually want hydraulics and did the homework to satisfy themselves that they weren't buying them...

(It's also the main reason I wouldn't touch hydraulics. As I have mentioned above, I don't even understand the concept of pneumatic pedals.)

 

[gdjenks13]

(It's also the main reason I wouldn't touch hydraulics. As I have mentioned above, I don't even understand the concept of pneumatic pedals.)

I was talking with my grandfather, who spent most of his life as a mechanic, about how I thought pneumatic's would be great. The pro's of hydraulics without the con's! no leaks!

Then he reminded me that air can leak just like fluid, the only pro there would be there is no mess. I think all methods (elastomer, spring, pneumatics, hydraulics) have their fallbacks. Elastomers change with time, leaks happen, etc.

I hope I am the only person in the world who accidentally bought hydraulic pedals, and then had them leak. I really should have questioned it more, but decision-fatigue had set in and I was believing what I wanted to about them being pneumatic.

I was able to drain all the fluid I could out of my brake cylinder and plan to re-attach it, and continue using it. The load cell is still there. The spring is still there. so... it may feel different, but it will work. And be a lot cheaper than shipping a new one from Australia to USA.

 

[Neilski]

Then he reminded me that air can leak just like fluid, the only pro there would be there is no mess. I think all methods (elastomer, spring, pneumatics, hydraulics) have their fallbacks. Elastomers change with time, leaks happen, etc.

Air leaks is one reason why I don't understand pneumatic pedals. The main other one (discussed a wee bit more above) is that air is compressible and heats up as you compress it, meaning it's not the perfect spring you might hope it would be (even when not leaking).

I was able to drain all the fluid I could out of my brake cylinder and plan to re-attach it, and continue using it. The load cell is still there. The spring is still there. so... it may feel different, but it will work. And be a lot cheaper than shipping a new one from Australia to USA.

I'm really curious to hear how you get on. I can't figure out what the stealth hydraulics are actually meant to accomplish on your pedal...

 

[gdjenks13]

I'm really curious to hear how you get on. I can't figure out what the stealth hydraulics are actually meant to accomplish on your pedal...

Well hopefully I remember to let you know! Got it fully set up again this evening and gave the brake a few compressions, now it feels just like a spring, and then a hard stop… which isn’t much different than before. I do remember hearing the sound of hydraulic pressure happening, like you hear compressing a real car’s brake pedal. I do not hear that anymore.

Like I said, I’ll give a few days of actual driving and let you know my verdict.

Also, they sent a follow up email that is encouraging. It’s a known issue for them that they fixed (or at least improved) back in 2022. SimworX also released a 3.2 version of the pedals this year, while I have 3.1’s.

 

[stigs2cousin]

From the pictures our service department "cristall balls" that the "green stuff" is a lubricant of sorts.
If you manage to stop the pollution the piston and seals will have run dry, so pedal will start to stick at it´s starting point and (in the long run) to grind.

So I guesstimate the only way to retain functionality is to swap the cylinder. The 160 D AUS quote seems reasonable to me for a failure after warranty.

Also I have to thank you for setting my head straight again.
About once a year I start dreaming about building a hydraulic brake, this cancels the urge again (for now)