rF2 Touring Masters @ Vitus Club - Monday May 24th 2010

[Brian Clancy]

I've been a good boy Ryo :tongue: no cutting LOL! Mind you its not hard to over do it and end up cutting, hard to balance speed with total accuracy and consistency!

Could I have a DEFINATIVE answer to how much is too much on cutting? I've read two wheels inside the white line, but that would give you a fair bit more lee-way than I've been using? OR is it just to keep inside wheels on the kerb? or............

Sorry, newbie question, but I'm still a Noob! and dont want to get into trouble, but dont want to use less than is acceptable either?

 

[Jeffrey Watkins]

i have been getting on two wheels going over the curbs on the track... maybe im using to much as well

 

[Ivo Simons]

You need always 2 wheels inside the white line.

 

[Brian Clancy]

Thanks Ivo

That might just exsplain my slower times at some places, been using LESS than that!

 

[Toby Davis]

Toby One Lap Davis :L
Is this a reference to my ability to randomly do a brilliant lap, only to follow it with one 3 secs slower
I'm too used to being able to jab the brakes on mid turn to cure understeer in my Superkart, so I've been running stupidly low front ARB settings and stupidly high rear tyre pressures just to get the thing pointy, along with some soft suspension settings to get it to move around a bit. Basically, I set myself up for inconsistency!
Thing is though, as soon as I try a conventional setup I'm miles off the pace with horrible horrible turn in understeer - it's like having the diff coast on 100% in an F1 mod, just no hope of turning the damn thing in. So I get it rolling and pointing, using ridiculously uneven downshifts, clutch and brakes... basically my car never takes a set until almost after the apex of corners - something which might be fast over one lap but just isn't repeatable.
ARGH!
The other problem with rearwards brake bias is I'm always losing time in braking zones trying to overrev the engine on heel toe downshifts to prevent the rear stepping out.

It would be so much easier if I knew how to drive an understeering car quickly. It's great for protecting the tyres, too, as the "limit" is easier to find, you can be more progressive on the brakes, throttle, everything.

One last thing, heel toeing these cars is AWSEOME. You can really balance the car with the clutch thanks to the relatively few number of gears and long brake distances. I love it, the feeling of "oh no the car is understeering, let's skip a gear and underrev that downshift so the back can briefly lock up." Awseome physics. Maybe I should have chosen a more nimble car like the Supra, it would suit me better.

Anyway. I blab.

 

[Brian Clancy]

Toby, what have you got your brake map set to? IF you havent already, try setting it to '0' that will deffo help you turn in 'off throttle' but you probably know all this, if you do just ignore the stupid new boy

 

[Chris Butcher]

Is entry for this full? If not please add me

 

[Toby Davis]

Toby, what have you got your brake map set to? IF you havent already, try setting it to '0' that will deffo help you turn in 'off throttle' but you probably know all this, if you do just ignore the stupid new boy

Yes don't worry
I have that and coast settings maxed out for less understeer... seen as both don't increase oversteer, they merely reduce understeer. In terms of braking, actually, engine braking is quite critical in this mod - the brakes are fairly poor - so if you don't have engine braking on max you will be losing a fair bit... Compared to F1 mods where you should have the value quite high - the brakes do 90% of the work in F1 mods, whereas in this mod I should think it's probably more like 60%. Ryo will be able to say the true value.

 

[Brian Clancy]

I thought you would know that lol! The Bimmer is funny tho, you kinda have to learn the car again at each track (When you really push it) At the moment I'm struggling to get into the 16's again, so think I've over practiced today, but I cant find a great balance for this track. Fast in the chicanes means slow on the longer faster turns, I keep playing with camber but cant say its made much diffrence. The Volvo on the other hand really benifited from some camber tweeks! The physics on this mod are awsome tho

 

[Toby Davis]

I thought you would know that lol! The Bimmer is funny tho, you kinda have to learn the car again at each track (When you really push it) At the moment I'm struggling to get into the 16's again, so think I've over practiced today, but I cant find a great balance for this track. Fast in the chicanes means slow on the longer faster turns, I keep playing with camber but cant say its made much diffrence. The Volvo on the other hand really benifited from some camber tweeks! The physics on this mod are awsome tho

Don't play with camber for difference in balance. That can be solved with ARB settings and suspension stiffness... I wish we had a weight distribution option as well to be honest.
Camber though really only is set when you compare tyre temps.

 

[Ryan Callan]

Setup tweaks need to be within reason . Remember these cars are from the late 80s .

Not all cars had adjustable ARBs or cambers (as they were in real life, especially the early cars like the Volvo and Rover) but for the sake of the league equality, these settings were enabled and equalised.

And you are correct - timing your downshifts is crucial to gaining good braking. Drop them too quickly, you will slow down quickly but you run the risk of spinning or you will lose all momentum/smoothness for a corner.

Shift too slowly and errr, you don't slow down

Brian - on the subject of the M3 and driving it, it really needs driving aggressively to get the best out of it - focus on attacking corners and maintaining maximum momentum with late, late apexes.

 

[Ryan Callan]

Is entry for this full? If not please add me

Entry is full sorry.

 

[Mikael Hellen]

I hate to say it but you can sign up someone else instead of me....parents meeting for the kids hockey team in the damn summer and the on race night....sorry but i'll be ready when Virginia comes along

 

[Ryan Callan]

Ok there is one spot open:

*stands back*

 

[Chris Butcher]

Hi, I see there is a drop-out, could I have the place please?

 

[Ryan Callan]

Chris gets it

 

[Chris Butcher]

Thanks very much Ryan

 

[Brian Clancy]

Don't play with camber for difference in balance. That can be solved with ARB settings and suspension stiffness... I wish we had a weight distribution option as well to be honest.
Camber though really only is set when you compare tyre temps.

Thanks Toby I've got lots to learn here, could use a guide really (I have read a few) but I think these cars and the handling of each one is quite diffrent as what works for one seems less effective for another. I've done quite alot of modding on real cars over the years, the usual RS escorts, Minis and so on, but if you take the BDA engined RS1600 Mk1 escort I owned, suspension mods were limited to spring/damper mods, front camber with adj bottom arms, five link back end and the usual bush and body stiffening (all nice simple stuff! lol). On this mod theres sooo much to play with I seem to make things worse usually hahaha! Still I need to learn as I think to a degree, its keeping me at the back of the grid when I might be able to move up a tad (he says in hope lol)

EDIT: Thanks alot Toby, reset everything and concentrated on RB settings, springs and tyre press. I'm now dipping into the high 15's (not every lap lol) in race trim and the balance is much improved

 

[Brian Clancy]

Brian - on the subject of the M3 and driving it, it really needs driving aggressively to get the best out of it - focus on attacking corners and maintaining maximum momentum with late, late apexes.

Thanks Ryan

Well, I've been trying to be Mr Smooth, keep the tail in check, slow in, fast out of corners....... Back to the drawing board LOL

 

[Toby Davis]

Thanks Toby I've got lots to learn here, could use a guide really (I have read a few) but I think these cars and the handling of each one is quite diffrent as what works for one seems less effective for another. I've done quite alot of modding on real cars over the years, the usual RS escorts, Minis and so on, but if you take the BDA engined RS1600 Mk1 escort I owned, suspension mods were limited to spring/damper mods, front camber with adj bottom arms, five link back end and the usual bush and body stiffening (all nice simple stuff! lol). On this mod theres sooo much to play with I seem to make things worse usually hahaha! Still I need to learn as I think to a degree, its keeping me at the back of the grid when I might be able to move up a tad (he says in hope lol)

EDIT: Thanks alot Toby, reset everything and concentrated on RB settings, springs and tyre press. I'm now dipping into the high 15's (not every lap lol) in race trim and the balance is much improved

Good boy.
Those things on all of these cars in this mod are the most important to balance, grip and traction. The rest are really just modifiers (although there is one setting I haven't mentioned which you HAVE to get right or you will be SLOWWWWW. It's the toe settings. I think I will hold back telling you how to know where to go with this setting since I have given away a lot already...)