The "What Are You Working On?" Thread

[Huuhkaja]

Any news of the UCM Formula Student? Would really love to drive it!

 

[AccAkut]

What they want? A stickerbombed Alzen BiTurbo

According to the reviews that car is bad because of "the less polygons"

 

[garyjpaterson]

Any news of the UCM Formula Student? Would really love to drive it!

No news yet, still waiting on a few bits and pieces form the team before its properly finished.

Not much has changed visually, although the motec screen has been added, shame its not all visible from the AC driver head, I reckon the actual drivers must have been shorter.

Some other minor changes based on their feedback, mostly livery tweaks etc.

 

[mantasisg]

This tape effect is crazy, is it done with normal maps ? niiiice

 

[garyjpaterson]

This tape effect is crazy, is it done with normal maps ? niiiice

Yeah just noise in photoshop basically, took a while to get it looking okay, still could be a ton better.
Best way to do it would be to bake a high poly version of the grip tape to get some nice AO of the different layers, but thats beyond me. My way was quick and dirty and still looks reasonable

Just noticed the triangle warning sticker also has a normal map applied... thats not supposed to be like that

 

[AccAkut]

added louvres

 

[Ryno917]

Try to explain that to all the guys who wrote negative reviews on my 512...



Hard to break those convictions once you get to know your heroes I suppose, could be disappointing for some and can't take it (so they'd rather complain about it).
I've got the same feeling on the 512 the first time I drove it with Jason's physics, but instead of complaining, I've decided to educate myself on how the real car would handle on a track. Turns out, that's what it is, guess it's the same case here with the 550.
We've got used to glorify these cars for the way they look, but how many can take them to a race track in real life and get to really push them hard as we do in AC?.

I bet it also has a lot to do with modern cars having less roll, and just being used to that. It's easy to forget how much roll older (even 00's) performance cars had.

Not to mention the fact that a LOT of people still think that a suspension is performing at its best when it's as stiff as possible, which isn't necessarily true unless you're running a lot of downforce.

 

[stingray_SIX_TWO]

I bet it also has a lot to do with modern cars having less roll, and just being used to that. It's easy to forget how much roll older (even 00's) performance cars had.

Not to mention the fact that a LOT of people still think that a suspension is performing at its best when it's as stiff as possible, which isn't necessarily true unless you're running a lot of downforce.

Spot on, go to Hertz/Europcar/Sixt/Rentacar and take out any mid to upper mid class sedan from a VW Jetta through a Ford Focus/Taurus/Mondeo up to an E-Class or A6. All of these ride about 20 times stiffer, harder and generally just bumpier than say an E39 M5 which at the time was criticized for having a suspension that wasn't quite as comfortable as one would have liked. Mind you some reviewers actually noted that it was even stiffer than the Ferraris at the time (~1997/1998).

People just have forgotten how comfy cars used to be especially in Euroland where the ever growing demand for less consumption forces OEMs to do what's necessary to achieve the goals AKA stiffen up the f***ing thing, install start/stop and give the engine a schyzophrenic power curve. Sadly those measures don't stop at high performance/high luxury class cars. Of course the press never mentions that being the bullhorn for the OEMs and the youtube reviewers have never driven a late 90s Ferrari, Porsche or S Class for that matter to know how nice a ride used to be.

Anyway, the 512 is absolutely perfect as is and the 550 just keep that thing rolling exactly as it is at the moment. The comment about stiff doesn't help you unless you have a lot of downforce - not sure about that. There is an art called tuning suspensions on road cars. It's all about the balance of dampers and springs and roll bars and suspension bearing stiffness/softness. You don't need a lot of downforce to get a car to handle nice and be fast around a track BUT it will still roll and be demanding to get right.

 

[AccAkut]

Spot on, go to Hertz/Europcar/Sixt/Rentacar and take out any mid to upper mid class sedan from a VW Jetta through a Ford Focus/Taurus/Mondeo up to an E-Class or A6. All of these ride about 20 times stiffer, harder and generally just bumpier than say an E39 M5 which at the time was criticized for having a suspension that wasn't quite as comfortable as one would have liked. Mind you some reviewers actually noted that it was even stiffer than the Ferraris at the time (~1997/1998).

People just have forgotten how comfy cars used to be especially in Euroland where the ever growing demand for less consumption forces OEMs to do what's necessary to achieve the goals AKA stiffen up the f***ing thing, install start/stop and give the engine a schyzophrenic power curve. Sadly those measures don't stop at high performance/high luxury class cars. Of course the press never mentions that being the bullhorn for the OEMs and the youtube reviewers have never driven a late 90s Ferrari, Porsche or S Class for that matter to know how nice a ride used to be.

Anyway, the 512 is absolutely perfect as is and the 550 just keep that thing rolling exactly as it is at the moment. The comment about stiff doesn't help you unless you have a lot of downforce - not sure about that. There is an art called tuning suspensions on road cars. It's all about the balance of dampers and springs and roll bars and suspension bearing stiffness/softness. You don't need a lot of downforce to get a car to handle nice and be fast around a track BUT it will still roll and be demanding to get right.

Hmm I don't think its as easy as you think there. It is true that many "enthusiast" link hard suspension to sporty driving, which results in mostly those top sporty RS/M/AMG models being stiffer than needed, but overall suspension development has made big steps in those roughly twenty years. Every sort of movement adds momentum which you don't want. We have active everything now and in general cars do have better handling and more predictable handling for the general non racetrack-trained public, in cars that weight more. Often you can dial it in via a menu inside the car, while driving!

 

[stingray_SIX_TWO]

Hmm I don't think its as easy as you think there. It is true that many "enthusiast" link hard suspension to sporty driving, which results in mostly those top sporty RS/M/AMG models being stiffer than needed, but overall suspension development has made big steps in those roughly twenty years. Every sort of movement adds momentum which you don't want. We have active everything now and in general cars do have better handling and more predictable handling for the general non racetrack-trained public, in cars that weight more. Often you can dial it in via a menu inside the car, while driving!

If you read your text again you'll see what my point was . Keep in mind I was talking about what the suspension is used for (safety/fuel consumption) vs. what used to be the primary goals (handling/comfort). In that regard you're right it is now more suitable and better for the general public. I'm talking from an enthusiast's point of view. An E30 rear suspension is as simple as it gets and the ultimate easy drift machine. They changed that design because too many wannabe racedrivers and housewives wrapped themselves around a tree. Porsche waited a bit longer with taming their suspension characteristics.

Thing is today everyone 'can drive fast', such as the guy in the RS6 last winter who passed me during torrential rainfall going easily 130mph+ just to spin off and flip over into the forest right in front of me because the car gave him the feeling that 'he could handle it'. It's crazy. And these are the people talking about a 512TR not handling like a go kart because that's how they perceive it should handle.

Good driving as in accurately being able to judge momentum and forces at work and suspension wizardry went out the window with all the systems making the cars 'bullet proof'. It's more of a philosophical question to which there is no answer .

 

[Willy Wale]

in cars that weight more

This is the point most people miss when looking back. The cars on sale today weigh a lot more than they did. For example, the average passenger car sold in Europe in 2001 weighed 1193kg (2630lbs), for 2015 the average was 1310kg (2888lbs). That's 117kg (256lbs) in 14 years.

 

[garyjpaterson]

Don't worry guys, the 550 handles like a dream

The way it rolls, the nose pitch, its all lovely, just how I like it. My only concern really was the just strange way in which the rear rose under braking, more than any car of this type i'd seen - but gladly I can verify its correct behaviour.

I've managed to find spring rates for the FHP (Fiorano Handling Pack) upgrade, which is a good amount firmer (especially the front, from about 1.4hz to 1.6hz IIRC).

I'm planning on having the ability to choose which suspension setup you want just with 1 button, so I'll overlap the necessary options.

Also, nice onboard video at Laguna Seca here (very quiet, turn it up!), will be nice to verify speeds etc when we get the AC version, can't really compare full laptimes as they slow at one point to keep sound levels down... its a long video, slow starter, but it shows it off quite nicely from a few angles.

Edit* This Sonoma onboard video is actually a bit better, the guy talking is a lot less annoying Looks like an amazing track, never seen it before.

 

[Hotdogxx60]

Also known as Sears Point Raceway and Infineon Raceway.

 

[Ryno917]

You don't need a lot of downforce to get a car to handle nice and be fast around a track BUT it will still roll and be demanding to get right.

That was my point; if you're not making piles of downforce, having super rigid suspension is often detrimental to performance. A suspension has two primary jobs; absorb bumps, and keep all four wheels as planted as possible.

The stiffer your suspension, the less it is able to do either of those things (and being too soft obviously hinders as well). The trend of super stiff suspensions on a lot of modern cars come from the ubiquitousness of downforce, for which you want stiffer suspension so that you don't lose that force by simply compressing the suspension. If you don't have downforce, you generally don't want to run as stiff as you would if you were making ample downforce.

 

[LilSki]

That was my point; if you're not making piles of downforce, having super rigid suspension is often detrimental to performance. A suspension has two primary jobs; absorb bumps, and keep all four wheels as planted as possible.

The stiffer your suspension, the less it is able to do either of those things (and being too soft obviously hinders as well). The trend of super stiff suspensions on a lot of modern cars come from the ubiquitousness of downforce, for which you want stiffer suspension so that you don't lose that force by simply compressing the suspension. If you don't have downforce, you generally don't want to run as stiff as you would if you were making ample downforce.

That is why the Can Am cars had the rear wings directly attached to the control arms of the rear suspension. They could could keep a soft suspension and have the downforce applied directly to the wheels. Just was more dangerous as the wings often broke off due to excessive vibrations that the suspension would normally absorb.

 

[Ryno917]

That is why the Can Am cars had the rear wings directly attached to the control arms of the rear suspension. They could could keep a soft suspension and have the downforce applied directly to the wheels. Just was more dangerous as the wings often broke off due to excessive vibrations that the suspension would normally absorb.

Same for the high wings in F1 in '68; and why they were subsequently banned after both Lotus had massive crashes after they failed in Spain.

 

[garyjpaterson]

Is the road 575 going to be manual? I really hope so, because in AC you can turn any car to floppy pedals, but not the other way around. I hear a lot in reviews, that Ferrari's from early 2000's that have manuals are so much better experience than the ones with F1 box. Besides, that gated shifter looks million times better than the silly little "thrust levers" that autos have.

I guess it will also have Fiorano handling package by default?

I'm doing the 550 Maranello for certain, and that is of course the famous gate shifter manual. It will have the choice of standard or FHP.

Now for the 575, I've never actually said anything about doing it... But, seeing is its pretty minor changes, I probably will. But I will make it with the F1 gearbox, just to differentiate the 550 and 575 further, as they are pretty close otherwise. As for the HFP, not sure yet, will either be that or the GTC pack which takes things a little further.

 

[AccAkut]

either I have a sea urchin infection, or I'm doing cage welds

 

[aphidgod]

Probably urchins.

 

[Ryno917]

either I have a sea urchin infection, or I'm doing cage welds

.. Can't it be both?