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Logitech Wheel Setup

Discussion in 'RaceRoom Racing Experience' started by RaceNut, Feb 1, 2013.

  1. This is a quick tutorial by MozzMann. I take no credit (or blame) for the results however; I find that these settings work for me with RRRE – unlike my commonly used Global Settings. In fact, RRRE feels like a whole new game to me compared to how it started out. There are a few minor things that I have changed from this tutorial but, overall – these settings work incredibly well when combined with a few in-game FFB tweaks.

    I am using a G25 and have to admit that I was skeptical when I first read this because it is very different from my Global setup that has worked very well for all other Sims that I have played to date. While my Global setup worked okay in RRRE, the FFB felt very basic and numb. The steering felt a little un-responsive and there was little to no FFB on bumps or drop-offs where the steering should feel “Light”. There was no feeling, what-so-ever, of grip-loss during braking or over-steering and I felt like I was always one step behind where I needed to be – in control. Those issues are no longer a problem. Also, these settings corrected the feeling of low brake power – especially in the GT3 cars and also improved steering response.



    RRRE / Logitech Wheel Setup by MozzMann
    The opinions expressed here are based on my PC, my Wheel and the way it interacts with the Simulation. Now before you even start thinking about comparing things to ISI, or other SimBin titles DON'T, because settings in RRE are very different to anything you might have encountered previously.

    IMHO if you run any of the Logitech Wheels then you MUST run the profiler and make not only a Global Profile but, also a Custom Profile for each Race Sim you use.

    1) You MUST run the Logitech Profiler Software
    2) You MUST tune the Axis settings to give you MAXIMUM steering Max Brake and Minimum Throttle sensitivity
    3) You MUST set a Global Profile and then a separate Profile for EVERY race Sim you run so that settings are never mixed.

    I have found that the reason that way too many Sim-players have issues with the Logitech Wheels and others too, is they simply do not understand how the Profiler Software works so they cannot benefit fully.

    Go to the Global Device Settings - Use these Settings
    Overall effects at 124%
    Spring Effect at 50 % (Spring effect is not needed due to the way modern Race Sims work BUT you should set this just the same)
    Enable Spring in FFB Games (ticked)
    Centering Effect at 50%
    Degrees of Rotation 900
    (IMHO It's a bit pointless having a 900 degree wheel if your not going to use the fine steering control offered by it)

    EXTREMELY IMPORTANT !!!!
    DO NOT!! ALLOW Game to adjust settings!!! The reason for this is below.
    Allowing the game to change settings is where people go wrong!!!
    Why? Well if a Race Sim you use is allowed to change something in the Profiler and then you go to GTR Evo or rFactor, once the Controller.ini file is opened by GTR Evo for instance, what it remembers doesn't tally with the last settings stored in the Profiler (HIDDEN) settings. You chase your tail and can't understand why the Wheel isn't behaving. So now you know, NEVER use the one Profile for your Sim Racing. You may blame the Game / Simulation where in fact it is your wheel doing what it was told because you allowed it to. The Global settings are just that, Global, and what every subsequent Profile uses as a base to work from.

    So now that the GLOBAL settings are made then you create a custom Game Profile for RRRE. The settings made in each custom profile are a Percentage of the Global settings made earlier. In this way, ONLY the Profile for (in this case) RRRE will be changed or altered due to its interaction with the Logitech Software. This allows you to change settings specific to RRRE and NOT affect other Sims you use. Settings are allowed to change based on your in-game settings, not the Global settings.

    Create a Custom Profile for RRRE.
    Use these settings in the RRRE Profile
    Overall Effects Strength @ 120% (this is a percentage of the 115% set in Global)
    Spring Effect Strength @ 0 %
    Damper Effect Strength @ 150% (adds drag to the wheel and helps prevent over correction and smooth’s out your input)
    Enable Centering Spring (ticked) but @ 0% (The reason for this is it allows the actual cars camber and camber settings to influence the way you FEEL the road - if this is un-ticked you will not feel this accurately)
    Use Special Steering Wheel Settings (ticked)
    Report Combined Pedals (user preference)
    Degrees of Rotation @ 900 (Recommended)
    Use Special Game Settings (Ticked)
    Allow Game to Adjust Settings (Ticked)
    (These two are very important as this allows the Sim to alter settings INTERNALLY in the Profiler that we cannot see in the GUI)
    Controller – Individual Input SettingsCustom settings for Sensitivity, Range and Dead Zone can be set in the Profiler.
    Left Click on the Steering Wheel line in the Lower left hand side of the Profiler and select Axis Properties
    Set Sensitivity @ 100%, 0% Dead Zone, and 100% Range
    (The reason that 100% is set here is to give you me a logarithmic steering as possible with quick responses around the center, still precise yet greatly accelerated deflection the greater the turn). Why? Because it allows a smaller degree of lock thus finer steering in the center with a greater amount at the extremes of steering input, very closely replicating the variable steering racks used in modern race cars.

    Throttle Settings
    Sensitivity @ 0%, 2% Dead Zone, and 100% Range
    (The reason that 0 % is set here is to give you the smoothest throttle transition from partial throttle response to full, varying the sensitivity WILL NOT change the amount at Full throttle just how fast you get there thus 0% is much smoother).

    Brake Settings
    100% Sensitivity, 2% Dead Zone, and 100% Range
    (The reason that 100 % is set here is to give you the maximum Brake response available and allow you to turn down the In-Game settings only).

    You can also set various macros for flashing headlights and other things but I will not cover that here.

    I did a lot of research and playing around with settings because I found I was getting so much interaction with various simulations.

    Now as for the settings in for RRRE these are very subjective and largely personal preference, but I'd like to offer a few pointer's here too.

    In the Options I'd urge careful tuning of the Sensitivities based on your Personal style AND whether you use things like a Load-Cell mod for the Logitech.

    I have found that turning the sensitivity way down for the Brake and Throttle helped dramatically in preventing loss of traction entering and exiting corner's while having the clutch at full sensitivity was great for Power shifting etc.

    By using the above settings in your Logitech Profiler for DF GT Pro, G25 or G27 I believe you will now be able to be smoother and more precise with your steering, and NOT need to change things like steering lock. (Incidentally the steering Lock is the degrees of steering per rotation of the Wheel). If you turn your steering lock up WITHOUT understanding it's interaction with Steering degrees of rotation AND Steering Percentage in-Game, I can almost guarantee you will get under-steer going into a corner and over-steer coming out. This is a direct result of the Game’s interaction with the wheel and Car physics and as I stated above, NEEDS to be fine-tuned based on your PC, driving style, and the actual Car within the Sim. IMHO, all that you should need to change is the Brake and Steering percentage IN-GAME to achieve the smoothness that we all seek.

    Feel free to reduce the Steering percentage if you like but it may then feel strange and possibly even vague.


    MozzMann

    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Again, this all down to opinion in the end but, I feel the FFB has improved in a big way. I haven't followed this guide 100% but, it will get you close to a great setup. Your results may vary but, give it a try and you may find this helpful for fine-tuning FFB in other Sims as well - especially for those having input lag and poor FFB.

    In addition to the Profiler setup above, my RRRE in-game FFB settings are:

    FFB Effects Level = Medium
    FFS = 75%
    FFSF = 1.7
    FFSGW = 1 (increasing this setting improved grip feel significantly)
    SWF = 0.85
    FFCE = 0.3
    FFCP = -0.6

    I have the in-game Wheel Animation on - rotation set to match my G25. Note: Having the drivers arms displayed does limit visual wheel rotation at this time. Use "wheel only" to have the visual match your actual wheel rotation.

    Hopefully, this will help those having issues with Logitech wheels in RRRE.

    RaceNut
     
    • Like Like x 7
  2. Thankyou to Racenut for posting and to Mozzmann for the original guide - I shall be trying this to see what effect I get. The post, however, isn't just a settings guide, its taught me a lot and answered questions about the Logitech software that will prove invaluable in future - so one again - THANKYOU.


    EDIT - 3 days later :

    I stand by my original thanks as the explanations of profiles and their relative relationships are well worth noting - However, the above settings appear to give somewhat hit and miss results, in RRRE I poersonally found the above settings (when followed to the letter) to be very vague and to make the car feel like I was driving on ice, I did give it time for me to get used to it, but if I was a console gamer and something came out of the box with the feeling I got from the above settings - It would be hastily taken back to the shop as not doing what it says on the 'tin'. Furthermore in GT Legends the application of the Global settings to my GTL profile proved to feel better INITIALLY - however after a reboot it became apparent that my wheel appeared to have stopped centering properly and that the settings didn't feel so good anymore... The only way to rectify this was to uninstall the Logitech Gaming Software - Calibrate the wheel using Windoze own inbuilt Game Controller Interface and reinstall the software (a fellow RD member also experienced this failure to centre 'bug' after applying the above settings, his was rectified by changing his figures back and restarting/rebooting).

    So where does that leave us all? Well I'm not going to knock either Racenut or Maurice - but I will say use these settings with caution - try them, but be sure you note your old settings - for some they may work for others maybe not - it may well be down to specific hardware and software configurations that govern the success or failure from these settings (either way the advice and relationships between the profiles is still invaluable).

    Final note for thought - it has been suggested that the above settings cause 'clipping' in the FFB - which could explain why initially it felt better as certain FFB effects became clipped or filtered out by forces been too high and the damper level actually counteracting FFB effects - a little insight into whats meant by clipping can be found here :

    http://www.racedepartment.com/forum/threads/ffb-and-steering-wheel-settings-for-gtl.45299/
     
  3. Marco Bijl

    Marco Bijl
    adMAXIhater (O.O.O.)

    Indeed, good post. Will look into it as well, and give it one last try.
     
  4. I'm gonna give this a shot and report back.

    If the game doesn't keep crashing that is!

    Very useful information regarding the profiler and allowing game to change settings issue.
    I do have a couple profiles for some games but I figured running globals mostly would be alright.
     
  5. Below are the screen shots of the Logitech software adjustments to assist with the settings if anyone needs. The settings above I use in most Sims I run and they are particularly good in rFactor when used in conjunction with the Real Feel plugin.

    A side note even if your wheel only has 270 to 360 Degrees of Rotation Set the profiler to 900 and RRE at 900, you might need to tune it a bit for a low DoR wheel but them's the brakes I guess.



    [​IMG]

    Global Settings Tab


    [​IMG]


    NOTE above Do NOT Allow ANY game to change setting for your Global Base Settings


    [​IMG]


    Create a profile for each specific Sim and Edit it

    [​IMG]

    Note the Damper setting is for gravel Mud and other areas that provide additional drag on the Wheel , it also assists you in NOT over reacting and thus over correcting in some situations. Settings outlined below.

    [​IMG]


    Individual Settings for the Pedal and Steering Axis Below

    Steering

    [​IMG]

    Throttle

    [​IMG]


    Brake

    [​IMG]



    Most importantly the RCS file for RRE if people want it

    #Mozz's Control RCS File for RRE#
     
  6. Marco Bijl

    Marco Bijl
    adMAXIhater (O.O.O.)

    Ok, tried it with above mentioned settings.

    Conclusion.
    This is not my game. I think it's terrible in terms of feelings, and driving pleasure. The concept itself is something I do not like either, so only 1 resolution.


    Uninstalled, not to be played again in the coming half year. Will check it again in a few months.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Thanks for adding those Maurie, I wasn't able to get those added into my post.;)
     
  8. Followed the above verbatim apart from setting 540 degs rotation both global and profile.
    Manually set my ingame settings as per Racenuts (although you don't say which level to choose) so I chose 'low'.
    Happy to report the FFB feels good.

    Bad thing is despite everything the rotation on track does not go over 360.
    When I am in the menu, turning the wheel it deflects to 100% left/right indicating the correct amount of 540 travel, but hit the track and its 360. I see oi can change the animation, which I did and also had no effect.
    Plus the game crashes each time I manually restart the sesh, so I am frustrated.

    In other news, the same global/profile settings are feeling really nice in rFactor2, with ingame FFB set to 0.75 and the filtering at 14. Using 360 rotation it feels very nice for me.

    Thanks.
     
  9. Yeah, sorry about the FX mode missed - I use medium but, High seems to work well also.
    If are you referring to the in-game steering animation wheel rotation - it is limited by the arms. If you set to 'Wheel only", it will display the proper rotation as indicated by choice. I updated my original post with these additions.
     
  10. No not the animation. What I mean is that I cannot get 540 rotation in the game.
    The only thing turning that far is my G27, the car is only doing 360.

    The fact the calibration menu in the game correctly hits 100% when I'm on full lock, but hit the track and its 360 makes it more weird. It's definitely not me being fooled by the animated wheel.

    Anyway, I'm off to give the corvette a spin - rF2 style :)
     
  11. Andi Goodwin

    Andi Goodwin
    Premium Member

    its because the settings make the wheel accelerate through the rotation , im not going to go into a big discussion why but lets just say the settings are non linear
     
    • Like Like x 3
  12. I haven't played with the Linearity itself - mine is still set at 50% (Linear) although, I do intend to experiment with that soon. I have driven cars with progressive steering so it might be interesting to try. My primary focus has been to get the FFB improved with my setup.
     
  13. Rupe Wilson

    Rupe Wilson
    Keep Yoga real Premium Member

    Got to agree with Andi on this one..:thumbsup:
     
  14. Hi, I couldn't retrieve that attached file for some reason as it took me to another website. Thanks for the settings, however the steering seems way off, I have to work the wheel so much just to get a simple turn. Is there some in game setting which I must change to alter this behavior?

    I'll upload some pics showing the calibration in game at

    90 degrees
    [​IMG]

    180 degrees
    [​IMG]

    360 degrees
    [​IMG]

    Additionally now the deadzone is also much worse, I can turn the wheel around 45 degrees in either direction before I feel some resistance from the FFB. I have a G27 wheel.

    Cheers
     
  15. Rupe Wilson

    Rupe Wilson
    Keep Yoga real Premium Member

    make a new profile.. would be the easy solution..:)
     
  16. I use the same settings for Race07 DiRT 1,2,3 , GTR Evo , rFactor , rFactor2 to provide consistency across the board , I do NOT set the car to any steering ration etc that is used in the real world but I do use Paddles , H Pattern and Sequential shift in the appropriate car.


    "Paul" :- Totally forget about 360 degrees in game from your 540 desired this is irrelevant this is where I believe that adjusting the steering lock will achieve what you want , there are likely limitations within various car models, something that I don't give a tinker's toss about. I want a setup for the wheel the DOES NOT vary from Sim to Sim Car to Car so that I can be more consistent.

    "Andi":- THAT is the whole point, you DON'T want linear steering in a Race car and NEVER will - you want fine control at speed and courser control at slower speeds when turning hard.

    The principles I am employing are to allow for very fine control around the central point of the wheel travel and this accelerates the further the wheel rotates thus allowing you to use a relatively low physical rotation probably around 180 - 200 degrees either side of centre, we know that FFB in many wheels works best at and around the centre but to do this many use low degrees of rotation so they have fast responsive steering , the BIG down side to this is very poor accuracy and precision often oversteering into corners ( a good sign the Steering lock is too high) as well as exiting. ( a good sign that there is too low a degree set in the Profiler)

    "Manju" :- have you edited the actual Profile within the Logitech Software so that you have full sensitivity available, and then set 900 deg in RRE then ALL you need to do is reduce the sensitivity in Game/Simulation to suit your tastes , which has the same effect as adjusting the degrees of Rotation AND the Steering lock at the same time.

    IF you have employed my Logitech Settings then you are missing some vital changes to RRE
    from your last images 360 Deg , top to bottom.
    H Pattern "set to paddles or Shifter of your choice.
    Steering lock 11-18 based on you feel
    Analogue Sectors ALL 10
    Steering Sensitivity 100% this is a MUST to get the feel ( works in conjunction with the Profiler.
    Throttle 0%
    Brake 100%
    Dead Zones all zero but if you like go to a maximum of 3-4 ( Remember you have set dead zone in the Profiler )
    In RRE you MUST also set 900 Degrees of rotation.

    "Rupe" :- that is also the whole point of my settings, you create a BASE profile something that should ALWAYS be done and then every Simulation you use you create a profile for, thus you can tweak the settings like sensitivity, deadzone etc, if you change one setting such as the sensitivity in the Profiler DO NOT change the Game as well and vice versa - otherwise you will be chasing your adjustments all over the place , This is most likely why so many racers end up making do with some botched up global without realizing that if they run 3 sims and they ALL can change the settings then eventually things will be well and truly FUBAR'd.

    In RRE go to the folder the *.RCS file is in and copy it then edit in notepad to change the name now you have a custom profile that will load or can be selected when you start RRE, I have 5 different profiles for different cars.
    Bottom line is don't always believe what your told but experiment, someone another forum said the default profile loads ! yes if you don't have other's yes so create other's and then load that.


    The settings above are what I arrived at after some very long nights testing to get things as close to respectable road feel, given the limitations of my PC at the time.
    The power of your PC WILL have an effect on how well the PC, Game Software, Profiler AND Wheel all talk to each other.

    A couple of tips from my perspective, Plug your wheel into a DEDICATED USB Port ONLY and NOT a USB HUB leave that for the keyboard and mouse. All of your controller's should always be plugged directly into the MoBo to minimize ANY possible input lag and Feedback lag as well.

    PLEASE note Every PC is different and with so many variables from custom Windows installations 32 Bit v 64 Graphics Lag and a whole host of other anomalies,
    So personal tuning will undoubtedly be required, but please try for a considerable time to evaluate, DONT just drive flat out but try 20 laps at Zanvort for instance and try to hit every apex and exit perfectly (not necessarily fast ) and I personally believe you will notice a difference in your smoothness and accuracy you will also likely need to turn the wheel slightly further than you have previously. The big pay of IMHO is the tire life and other little things like this that will reap benefits that are not readily seen.
    As a test go to a track that you know intimately in rFactor for instance (Well away from RRE and Beta testing ) and turn a full tank of fuel, try to be smooth and consistent and at the end of the run I feel you will have not only gone faster than you have previously but further and the tires have lasted better.


    Mozz's Custom RCS File
     
  17. Cheers Maurice. I'm going to try out some of your suggestions and report back. ;)
     
  18. No worries , whether my settings are useful to some, many or everyone will depend on how they LIKE to feel things and how their Sim and Wheel are actually set up. There are so many variables that I just cannot allow for all the little differences.
     
  19. Andi Goodwin

    Andi Goodwin
    Premium Member

    everything i read an all the research i see and all of the manufacturers of race racks i look at seem to give fixed ratios ... i obviously need to learn more about this subject as i seem to be missing the point ... can you please point me at the links of manufacturers that produce the racks that you are talking about with the 100° non linear action and the 900° of rotation that you have built into your setup as my googling skills seem to fail me .... thanks in advance

    Andi
     
  20. I'm creating a guide from the information in this thread to benefit myself and others. I hope that the OP, you or someone can assist.

    Where it says:

    Is this wrong? The Global settings previously stated:

    As you can see the Global is 124%, so what are the correct values?

    Is the Custom Profile meant to be a percentage of the Global?

    Thanks