Your views: In car or bonnet cam?

[eathis]

I realise that on certain sim forums this could get flamed, but as Assetto Corsa gives the option to race from different view points I'm quite interested to know others thoughts about this.

I spent quite a few hours over the weekend trying out AC, fiddled around with different FOVs and seat positions of the in car viewpoint, and set a few lap times, having great fun doing so... However, last night I was driving the Ferrari around the Vallelunga circuit and tried out the bonnet cam. After one lap I knocked a whole second off my previous best lap time.

So I loaded up the other tracks, same car, and again was about a second quicker in all of them. Tried out the KTM - a second quicker. And the Lotus Exige - again pretty much a second quicker. I wasn't any quicker with this view in the Tatuus or Lotus 49 though.

Has anyone else found they drive the tin tops faster from the bonnet cam? Anyone else tried the bonnet cam?! Perhaps most importantly when multiplayer comes online, are people going to have a problem with others using a view other than the in car one?

 

[Larry Thomas]

There is the option right now.
You can turn Virtual mirrors ON at any time...

Where / how can you do this? Thanks.

 

[Kristóf Kerekes]

Where / how can you do this? Thanks.

Press F11 ingame.

 

[Larry Thomas]

Press F11 ingame.

Thankyou sir.

 

[Dinca Andrei]

1280/1024 is 5:4 actually. I'm planning 21:9.

Your right but i never saw this in any game so far,instead there was this option between 16:9 and 4:3...

 

[Tomas Torasen]

+1 on hoping for possibility to force cockpit view, which assists are used and so on when setting up a server.
I'm also surprised that anyone in sim racing would use bumper cam.
In NFS Shift, which I played for a very short while, it actually helped forcing cockpit view, most of the crasher kids left before the race started.

 

[Dinca Andrei]

I see some of you dont understand "why" some of us still uses bonet cam....With a freaking small monitor,in cockpit view i cant see a damn thing ....now how will this be enjoyable!?
Does this makes us some kind of freaks because we dont have the condition to run it properly....not even in single screen mode because the monitor its not wide enough.?!
Jeez..

 

[Tomas Torasen]

I see some of you dont understand "why" some of us still uses bonet cam....With a freaking small monitor,in cockpit view i cant see a damn thing ....now how will this be enjoyable!?
Does this makes us some kind of freaks because we dont have the condition to run it properly....not even in single screen mode because the monitor its not wide enough.?!
Jeez..

With all due respect, I think what hardware people have is up to them.
Sitting on top of the hood is ok for casual online racing and arcade games I guess, but when competing in leagues and stuff I think it should be viewed as an assist almost. No matter what monitor you have, the view is more blocked inside the cockpit.

It's like saying "I dont have a fancy enough wheel as you do so I'll use traction control while you are not". At least thats how I see it.

 

[nijeat]

However it'll be possible for you to use the 16:9 with 5:4 monitor. When I had 18' 4:3 monitor I'd used 1280x720 only when play race game hehehe. Screen was small but wide!

 

[Kristóf Kerekes]

+1 on hoping for possibility to force cockpit view, which assists are used and so on when setting up a server.
I'm also surprised that anyone in sim racing would use bumper cam.
In NFS Shift, which I played for a very short while, it actually helped forcing cockpit view, most of the crasher kids left before the race started.

For instance, Live for Speed's community mostly uses Bonnet camera, at least the high-end players. It's just a way to get a few more tenths while hotlapping... I also used to drive cockpit for a really long time, but changed up for hood view, to become "professional". It was pretty much worth it for me. Depends on what you want to achieve in a game. Fun, perfect simulation, competitiveness? I am competitive and still have fun, that's well enough for me. If I wanted perfect simulation, I wouldn't be driving simulators, that's for sure. I totally have more fun being competitive, than I have fun driving my G25 on a rather small 22" display, with an unrealistic cockpit view... Those are my few cents on that.

 

[Dinca Andrei]

It's like saying "I dont have a fancy enough wheel as you do so I'll use traction control while you are not". At least thats how I see it.

That is not even a good example...And what does the wheel has to do with TC....
I`ve pointed out this matter because some people thinks they are above other just because....
I run the game on a 19" monitor....I dont have a strong vision and my right eye is working on 20% capacity,so yeah i have this problem.Adding the distance of 70-80 cm from the monitor with cockpit view on...tell me whats left to see?
The bonet cam gives a clear view of the road in front BUT it cuts alot of the side view.
In cockpit view i can see a bit of the side road on my left side but i dont have alot of information from the road ahead of me....If i had a triple screen setup,this discution didnt even started because for sure with a triple screen i would of run the game in cockpit mode because i know it too this is the right way,its just not possible for me in this conditions.
For example the Lotus 49 its a pleasure to drive in cockpit view,there is no other way i could do it,but there is plenty of information i recieve from the cockpit point of view of this car...
I`ve run races in forced cockpit view a few times and it didnt kill me but it forced my eyes because i had to stay closer to the monitor....

If you dont understand this then i have nothing else and i leave you to your ideas...I just felt like i had to explain it....Normaly its verry hard for someone to make me lose a bit of my temper,and i apologize for that,but this time was my time to lose some steam.
Rant over.

 

[Tomas Torasen]

Well, maybe not a good example. No need to blow off any steam, I'm not aggitated, just pointing out my personal opinion/preference.

But why is it a bad example? Off course TC is not a field of view, but the point is that an advantage by changing something in the game that others do not use is an advantage. I think it should be fair on that end rather on the hardware part, which we can not control.
Then if people want to open servers where everything is allowed, they should be allowed to do that also off course.

This argument leads also to for example car setups, which is a more difficult thing to discuss. I often felt races were more fun when everyone used a base setup or one that was shared among all. IRacing has leagues with base-setups I believe. iRacing also have the possibility to share setups on track, which I think is awesome.

Another problem with my view is that it leads to very many different groups of people, with different opinions. So the online racers gets divided into smaller groups.

It has nothing to do with elitism or thinking one is higher valued than the other though, just that the rules should be the same for everyone.

That is not even a good example...And what does the wheel has to do with TC....
I`ve pointed out this matter because some people thinks they are above other just because....

If you dont understand this then i have nothing else and i leave you to your ideas...I just felt like i had to explain it....Normaly its verry hard for someone to make me lose a bit of my temper,and i apologize for that,but this time was my time to lose some steam.
Rant over.

 

[Stereo]

Another problem with my view is that it leads to very many different groups of people, with different opinions. So the online racers gets divided into smaller groups.

It has nothing to do with elitism or thinking one is higher valued than the other though, just that the rules should be the same for everyone.

I like AC's philosophy towards this - assists are implemented, but will always be at least a few tenths slower than a competent unassisted driver. So if you're using paddle shifts, autoblip/cut, etc. in an H-shifting car, you can't shift quite as quick as someone using an H-shifter and clutch. It might make you personally faster to enable the assists, of course, if you're bad at fully manual controls. But by design, the fastest lap is achieved by setting the car exactly as it runs in reality and driving it well.

In my experience the TC is too aggressive for some situations - once the rear end is sliding the throttle just cuts off and you get even more lift oversteer. It's easier for me to drive near the limit without it, because if I do a little slide, I can countersteer out of it without touching the throttle. It's just way easier to do aggressive turn-ins with TC off, cause you don't have the machine fighting you on it.

 

[Nick Deeley]

Every game has this argument/discussion/exchange of views/accusations of cheating...whatever you want to call it, about driving views.

No-one has the exact same setup with hardware and software. Not one set up is going to be better than the other. We all set things up differently to make it as comfortable and as easy as possible for us to drive. We all have different aims of what we want out of a game too.

Why do we argue about this each time a new game comes out?

Someone is quicker than you using a different view - dont worry about it. Whatever view you use, stop wasting time moaning and use that as track time, trying to drive quicker, but most of all - enjoy the game in whatever shape and form you look at it from.

 

[Tomas Torasen]

Really? You sure? Then it's awesome. Although unrealistic in some aspects.

I like AC's philosophy towards this - assists are implemented, but will always be at least a few tenths slower than a competent unassisted driver..

 

[Dinca Andrei]

Well, maybe not a good example. No need to blow off any steam, I'm not aggitated, just pointing out my personal opinion/preference.

But why is it a bad example? Off course TC is not a field of view, but the point is that an advantage by changing something in the game that others do not use is an advantage. I think it should be fair on that end rather on the hardware part, which we can not control.
Then if people want to open servers where everything is allowed, they should be allowed to do that also off course.

This argument leads also to for example car setups, which is a more difficult thing to discuss. I often felt races were more fun when everyone used a base setup or one that was shared among all. IRacing has leagues with base-setups I believe. iRacing also have the possibility to share setups on track, which I think is awesome.

Another problem with my view is that it leads to very many different groups of people, with different opinions. So the online racers gets divided into smaller groups.

It has nothing to do with elitism or thinking one is higher valued than the other though, just that the rules should be the same for everyone.

But if there is someone with a verry good setup regarding HW and someone with not so good setup,play on the same server with same set of rules (forced cockpit view for example)...who ihas more to gain?The one with the good stuff or the one with the poor HW setup.(refering to monitors,)
Is`nt that still an advantage for tthe one who has the HW to play it in verry good conditions?
I agree with you that the cockpit view is more close to the real position,but i was trying to explain the motive...For me this si the compensation for the lack of HW....When i`ll join a league and it wil have forced cockpit view,be sure i will not bail out because of this,it only makes it harder for me with the curent HW (monitors)....

 

[Tomas Torasen]

@Dinca Andrei I will gladly race you online and not force you to anything.

If there is league racing where people can win prices and practice a couple of thousand laps before every race, there should be the same rules for everyone.

My guess is that there will be servers/competitions/races where all views including assists is allowed. Then to race using limiting factors and lose is one's personal choice and fault.

I only ask for the possibility to force a certain way in the sim on a server. There will surely be plenty of servers to choose from.

 

[Mr Whippy]

In cockpit is nice, but as Stereo said the real FOV if you were to place a screen X distance away from yourself in the real car would be about 25deg, probably less with smaller screens. You'd see very very little.

In the end cockpit views are just another simulation, another compromise on reality. AC doesn't seem to throw you around anywhere near as much as you might be in a real road car with just seatbelts on for example. The head always staying pretty static.

In a cockpit in real life you can move your head left/right a bit to see around pillars, you can turn it freely etc, and build up a view in your head that probably makes the a-pillars invisible and so on. Ie, your nose is in your view all the time, but your brain removes it. Should we render the nose in the cockpit view in AC to make it 'more' real?

So I think bonnet cam is fine. It just represents what your 'minds eye' might be thinking it's seeing more of the time than the cockpit view. What you see after your brain filters out all the irrelevant things (ie, the car interior)

In practice I don't 'see' my steering wheel, or pedals, or anything, my 'view' when driving on the road is an ellipse shape probably, filling out the blocked area near the A pillar, and ignoring everything except the bonnet which defines the extents of what is important to me not crashing into other road users or driving over kerbs etc
Only when I look down to do something inside the car does the cockpit 'appear' I suppose.


So I say use whatever you like best. The physics doesn't change from view to view so in the end maybe bonnet cam is articulating more what our minds eye is seeing which is why we are faster with it?


Dave

 

[Krzysztof Babij]

Lol you wrote "get real" in your previous post.

Can you explain me how with FOV=40 you can use your mirrors in 1 monitor? "Get real" means also FOV with the appropriate value. With mine is impossible to use mirror? Cockpit view can and should be used always. Oculus will change it I hope and I will not use virtual mirror then.

 

[John Cunningham]

mirrors/single screen: I fired up my trackIR, works ok (still need to tweak it)and I can see my wing mirrors etc.

 

[Alessandro Gamberini]

I hope in the upcoming server will be an option to force the cockpit view, because to me is the only allowable way to drive a good sim