AC Oreca FLM09 @ Donington 2018 - Wednesday 27 Nov 2019

[Craig Dunkley]

I'll give it a go please @Craig Dunkley

Welcome aboard Ernie

 

[elloLeo Kinnunen]

I'd like to join in. It'll be very early hours for me so hopefully the alarm works!

 

[Craig Dunkley]

I'd like to join in. It'll be very early hours for me so hopefully the alarm works!

Welcome aboard m8

 

[elloLeo Kinnunen]

I'm very non-expert at setup and as much as I love it I have to admit it's been a while since I've driven this car. Anyway I had the chance to do some practice laps tonight so I thought I'd report back. Front tyres are hard to keep warm (even when air temp is 28C!) so I've lowered their pressure and stiffened both front and rear ARBs by one click. I managed to get into the 1m25s on low fuel but hopefully some more time to come. I was considering removing some rear wing to reduce understeer on exit. Any thoughts or tips from anyone?

I usually forget about fuel so mental note to self: 4.25litres per lap.

 

[James Pendry]

sign me up please

 

[Craig Dunkley]

sign me up please

Welcome aboard m8

 

[Kek700]

I'm very non-expert at setup and as much as I love it I have to admit it's been a while since I've driven this car. Any thoughts or tips from anyone?

I usually forget about fuel so mental note to self: 4.25litres per lap.

this car has the worst tyres I have encountered on
AC, they have virtually no grip, ( considering they are meant to be slicks ) tempted to raise the track temps to 40 deg C to see if they can grip when hot.
I am sure some will find this to be no problem, and go much faster than I.
But personally this car gives me much grief, all due to the tyres. Maybe just maybe track temp too.
Setting the car is virtually pointless, keep it as supplied, tyres predominantly over ride any setup.
Just my point of view.

 

[Craig Dunkley]

this car has the worst tyres I have encountered on
AC, they have virtually no grip, ( considering they are meant to be slicks ) tempted to raise the track temps to 40 deg C to see if they can grip when hot.
I am sure some will find this to be no problem, and go much faster than I.
But personally this car gives me much grief, all due to the tyres. Maybe just maybe track temp too.
Setting the car is virtually pointless, keep it as supplied, tyres predominantly over ride any setup.
Just my point of view.

Yes m8 after more testing I can confirm your findings ...I could split the race in two?so like 2 x 17 laps, this would make the tire issue less of a concern.

 

[Medilloni]

this car has the worst tyres I have encountered on
AC, they have virtually no grip, ( considering they are meant to be slicks ) tempted to raise the track temps to 40 deg C to see if they can grip when hot.
I am sure some will find this to be no problem, and go much faster than I.
But personally this car gives me much grief, all due to the tyres. Maybe just maybe track temp too.
Setting the car is virtually pointless, keep it as supplied, tyres predominantly over ride any setup.
Just my point of view.

Glad it's not just me then Ernie... really struggling with losing the back end on turn in - I know it's 'snap oversteer' 'cos I didn't see it coming Have played around with the diff which seems to help, I think, ish

Like the idea of 2 x 17 lap races though @Craig Dunkley

 

[Craig Dunkley]

Glad it's not just me then Ernie... really struggling with losing the back end on turn in - I know it's 'snap oversteer' 'cos I didn't see it coming Have played around with the diff which seems to help, I think, ish

Like the idea of 2 x 17 lap races though @Craig Dunkley

Yes I think we should ...I love the mod, but there is something very wrong with the tires.

 

[Kek700]

That a very good idea, I’ll go with that.

One lap you think you are coping, you think that’s okay, I’ve got it now, next lap you get the turn in or exit slightly different, whoooo, you get snap oversteer or no front end grip. It’s like the tyres are on a knife edge with virtually no tolerance.
I can usually make suspension changes and feel the difference, think, no too much coast , making turn in too sluggish, or add a bit more camber and feel the front end grip change.

This cars adjustment make virtually no difference until you start to get silly aggressive with a setup.
You then defiantly get a snappy end.

Is the traction control on, I only have driven it online, that maybe a fix?

I really, really, like this car, love driving it, but those tyres.

I tried that GT500 mod afterwards, just to see I was suffering old git syndrome, no , that was in another
world, you felt where and how much you could
push. I could feel the grip.

FLM09 has a totally numb feeling.

Someone get this fantastic car a decent set of tyres.

sorry again about the monologue.

 

[Craig Dunkley]

OK guys, because on some issues with the tires, we are making this event a two race event.

 

[elloLeo Kinnunen]

OK guys, because on some issues with the tires, we are making this event a two race event.

That doesn't appeal to me sorry.

I think the tyres are modelled to be how they are because IRL the car runs on tyres not designed specifically for it:

Cars - IER Car Pack #1 - USCC Mod

Just curious as to what the optimum tyre temperature range for the Oreca is? I seem to be really struggling to get any kind of decent temperature in them. I think the max I've hit is like 75C through Pouhon. The LMPC and Prototype classes use the same tires (both IRL and in the sim), but the...

www.racedepartment.com

More generally IER has a different approach to lots of the stock AC cars - check out the interview about the new p13c. Different grip behaviour from AC content is the goal not the problem.

So it's part of the experience and this car is built and modelled for endurance. If you want it to be more sure footed you need to allow for understeer. Maybe @mclarenf1papa has some further advice for you.

 

[Kek700]

It is not about how to put more understeer in the
car to stabilise it, that only achieves an under steering car which is understeery from the outset
and can be unpredictably understeering thrown into
the mix.
Which then leaves a car that is unpredictable in rear end grip, you can tame it with setup, but the unpredictable front with a still unpredictable rear is not a happy combination.



I’d much rather drive a escort RS1600, which is all of the above and a lot more, but is very predictable
and you sort of know we’re the limits are and can
be near but you know when you are over stepping the mark.

 

[RobertR1]

Not a car I've driven before but finally got around to putting a few laps in. Had a brain lapse and kept lowering the front tire pressures and then realized I was going the wrong way.....corrected that little issue towards the end.

Stock with tire pressures adjusted, I felt the car was fine actually. Ran a 24 flat which was not clean by any means and kept most laps within .4 of that. A high 22 or a low 23 stock setup with just tires pressures adjusted should be doable for sure. Over the 7 or 8 lap stint, tires held up fine but were dropping so a 17 lap race would probably be good if the handling is tricky.

Regarding the handling comments. I have an OSW direct drive wheel. This car has a decent amount of push which needs to be controlled or the back end starts coming around when the front end bites. If you watch the speeds, you'll see that you're dropping speed or time delta fast when the front washes which inturn reduces the time you have to react before the back snaps. When that happens it's becomes a bit of a guessing game or where you'll end up. I did a some free mowing when I let the understeer build up for too long. Overall, I do think for people who have wheels which are already a bit limited on granular feedback, it could be difficult to handle this car in stock form.

I still felt the car should have a bit more downforce for what it is. The TC at level 1 is also quite strange. Like it was developed in the 80's.

 

[mclarenf1papa]

Really, my only advice would be to drive better...this is a real vs simulated lateral-g trace at (most of) Sebring.

Edit: Drove a mid 23 on bone stock setup (which is not good for this track, for what it's worth) in 5 laps after having not driven the car or track in months.

 

[Kek700]

Thank you for the info Robert, that is some information I can work with, I definitely was pushing hard on the front, so what you say makes sense.

 

[mclarenf1papa]

With a little bit of setup work (but still stock tire pressures since I couldn't be bothered) and 6 more laps. You have to have quick hands, but it's a prototype; not sure what one would otherwise expect.

 

[Kek700]

I’ll lower the steering ratio to help me to be quicker on the wheel, and think more about controlling the under steer. You never know.

 

[elloLeo Kinnunen]

View attachment 335966

With a little bit of setup work (but still stock tire pressures since I couldn't be bothered) and 6 more laps. You have to have quick hands, but it's a prototype; not sure what one would otherwise expect.

Thanks for the input. if you don't mind sharing, what changes did you make on the setup ?

Also, was the Sebring telemetry trace you posted for this version of the track? https://www.racedepartment.com/downloads/sebring-international-raceway-rtb.13374/