DiRT Rally 2.0 My T300 FFB settings

[Case_]

In case anybody is interested, here are my FFB settings for DR2 on the T300 which I'm pretty satisfied with (see more below):

(Updated the image for the current state of the FFB in the game.)

Please note that if you raise the FFB gain on a T300 beyond the default 75 %, you really should be using the forced fan mode that keeps the fan running at all times (then again you should probably be using that mode even when not raising the gain).

I am using soft lock with the wheel set to 1080 degrees, but I have the driver hands disabled and only the virtual wheel is shown, because if I enable driver hands, the virtual wheel rotation doesn't match the real wheel (a bug, I assume).

As for the FFB settings themselves, they don't transform the FFB significantly, so the road noise is still quite low in the mix, but it is definitely there. I'm not a fan of those supposed XML "fixes", because from what I've tried, they introduce more issues than they solve (and I can come up with several reasons of why I think that is the result), no matter how you tweak them. I also have no problem feeling the suspension, wheel grip and all that without them (even though it definitely varies between cars - as it should). I would like the wheel friction to be higher for the wheel to not be as loose, but it seems to also hide detail in the FFB if you raise it, so I keep it low.

I'd certainly like the road detail to come out a bit more in the FFB, but other than that, I am very satisfied with how the FFB is and I think it's up there with the best and certainly far from "broken", "unplayable" or "non-existent", to quote a few descriptions I've seen. It is very nuanced and detailed, it just doesn't hit you over the head with the information it provides.

 

[Tripokaridos]

true,but i just wanted to inform our buddies here,since there was a lot of broken t300,and thats why i dont use ffb fix,and thats why i use these settings here,even i have the tspc!

Θαναση και εγω , me to I have send 2 T300 bases to Thrustmaster, From Greece to France so they can fix it. All I was getting was low power on FFB , They told me not to use full FFB effects on hot days , now that my T300 alcantara is not on warranty I changed the internal fan with a Noctua that I keep always on , and never get the ffb levels to high. If this brakes to , I guess I will go with TS -PC base , from what I hear from most people TS-PC isn't more analytical faster smoother wheel, its just a more powerful T300 base , what do u think ?

 

[Case_]

(So I just happened upon a discussion where someone very vocal about how bad the FFB in DR2 was claimed that "most of the wheels even have the FFB completely disabled in the XML file", and it seems he came to this conclusion based on the fact that the wheel definitions often don't include all of the *optional* parameters, including the ffb_force parameter... The mind boggles.)

 

[Ntouskos Thanasis]

from what I hear from most people TS-PC isn't more analytical faster smoother wheel, its just a more powerful T300 base , what do u think ?

i used to have the t300 alcadara to ,i never had an issue ,but i was playing safe ,when i changed to ts-pc i have find more feedback ,for me is a mixed t500 feedback with the with 2 steps up analysis of the t300 ,and most of all never gets tired ,which is great cause now i enjoy the games without thinkin of what if may ,i got lucky to ,cause i found it on a used condition in a great price ,but the waht you expect from a wheel ,is on anyone needs and of cource the game ,as you can see here the all conversation is not wheels ffb fault or analysis ,its the game !!
im staying and telling you ,that what people needs from a wheel ειναι αντικειμενικο !!

 

[Nasos Charalampou]

No, it doesn't. You've been told that by a lot of seemingly knowledgeable people I bet, but it's not true. It's one of the most wide-spread myths of simracing.

In this specific case, if you turn down damper, you will lose the wheel friction and tyre friction part of the FFB. It's obviously your choice if you don't want them to be there, but I *do* want them because I want to feel the tyres better, and also because they're *supposed* to be there. And if you really don't want them, you can just turn them down in-game. If you set these two sliders to 0, then you FFB should feel exactly the same regardless of your spring and damper setting (so again, no reason to turn damper down).

You could probably turn down the spring without any negative impact on the FFB, but why bother, since - again - it doesn't do what you've been told it does. If you want a spring effect that is actually added on top of the FFB, you would check the "by the wheel" setting in the "Auto-center Settings" and set the strength of the spring. But if you keep it at "by the game", then no, spring isn't just added on top, even if you set it at 100 % (as is the default, after all).

So its a myth that on an inherently damped wheel due to belts you add extra damping at 95% to get friction? isnt there enough belt friction as is?

Also spring at 100% just makes you lose the SAT force the game provides and creates a spring, not ideal.

IF the game uses damping and spring then disregard my comment, if not then you have ffb not from the game but from your ffb sw.

I think Kunos did a post here in RD not long ago explaining the ffb topic.

But damping to an already damp centric wheel is wrong.

 

[Case_]

So its a myth that on an inherently damped wheel due to belts you add extra damping at 95% to get friction?

It is a myth that you add extra damping by leaving the damper slider in your wheel's control panel at values above 0, even if it is left at the default 100 %. Unless the game is actively using the damper force, the slider has no effect on the perceived FFB.

Also spring at 100% just makes you lose the SAT force the game provides and creates a spring, not ideal.

It doesn't. Unless the game is actively using the spring force, the slider has no effect on the perceived FFB. You might be thinking of the "Auto-Center Settings" slider if set to the "by the wheel" setting (not the default "by the game" setting).

IF the game uses damping and spring then disregard my comment, if not then you have ffb not from the game but from your ffb sw.

Not true. Unless the game is actively using the damper or spring forces, the sliders have no effect on the perceived FFB.

 

[Andreia Farrér]

Thank you very much for the settings! I've tried so many and yours are by far the best.
Nonetheless CM needs to fix the FFB asap or I'm losing interest in DR2.

 

[Case_]

(I'm just getting so sick of people always talking about CM needing to "fix the FFB" and of the overwhelmingly complaining and negative nature of the DR2 community always blowing things *way* out of proportion I can't even begin to describe it...)

But I'm glad the settings do something for you.

 

[AadHofman]

Well, they have acknowledged that the FFB is broken. Is it somehow community's fault?

 

[Case_]

No, they haven't "acknowledged that the FFB is broken". They have acknowledged that some people (emphasis on "some") don't like it and they intend to try and improve it for them while not making it worse for the rest. So yes, endlessly claiming that "the FFB is broken" is 100 % community's fault. As is making up arguments to support that statement, for that matter.

 

[AadHofman]

Perhaps "broken" is a too strong of a word, but people claiming that there's nothing wrong with the ffb are kidding themselves.

 

[Case_]

But of course.

 

[RasmusP]

Perhaps "broken" is a too strong of a word, but people claiming that there's nothing wrong with the ffb are kidding themselves.

Codies made mistake of creating FFB that reproduces more or less exactly the forces of a real steering wheel. They forgot though, that most people only have a steering wheel and not a full on 3D motion rig in their homes.
So yeah, we have a good reproduction of the steering wheel but we are lacking everything else that you would feel in the real car.
Whereas most other sims/games also let you feel the rest of the car through the steering wheel.

Also also Codies sadly made their "realistic reproduction" also too smooth so you're not only lacking chassis forces etc but also a little bit the forces that you would feel on top in a real steering wheel.

Overall their "fix" will be apparently something like this:
- roughen up the general steering forces
- put chassis and g-forces back into the steering wheel ffb although it's not really there in real life but simracers need them to be immersed

What I absolutely hate about Dirt Rally 2.0 though is that in my real car the steering wheel gets shaken left and right when I go slightly crossed about ruts/bumps etc. In Dirt 2.0 the steering wheel doesn't even give a slight bump when you drive diagonally across a fully wasted surface.
There, for me it's really lacking something that should be there!

 

[Case_]

What I absolutely hate about Dirt Rally 2.0 though is that in my real car the steering wheel gets shaken left and right when I go slightly crossed about ruts/bumps etc.

Thing is, if you watch some onboard videos, it can be somewhat unclear as to how much of the road surface is actually transferred through the wheel to driver. In some, it certainly does look like most of it is absorbed through the power steering, suspension and whatnot.
I'm not saying I think modelling the FFB exactly to how a real life steering wheel feels is ideal for a sim, but if that's what you're going for (and I do believe that's what CM went for here), then it might not be that far off.

 

[RasmusP]

Thing is, if you watch some onboard videos, it can be somewhat unclear as to how much of the road surface is actually transferred through the wheel to driver. In some, it certainly does look like most of it is absorbed through the power steering, suspension and whatnot.
I'm not saying I think modelling the FFB exactly to how a real life steering wheel feels is ideal for a sim, but if that's what you're going for (and I do believe that's what CM went for here), then it might not be that far off.

Yep
I'm not questioning the ffb of the modern wrc cars. But the older ones should definitely give some shaking over ruts!

 

[M D Gourley]

I'd certainly like the road detail to come out a bit more in the FFB, but other than that, I am very satisfied with how the FFB is and I think it's up there with the best and certainly far from "broken", "unplayable" or "non-existent", to quote a few descriptions I've seen. It is very nuanced and detailed, it just doesn't hit you over the head with the information it provides.

Hello Martin... reading through your post and researching other reviews etc I decided to purchase Dirt Rally 2.0 and would have to agree that the fine road detail is low and as you said ,certainly fair from broken' etc once I set up my wheel using your above wheel and in game settings as a starting point the FFB is better than the default settings for my wheel ...Thrustmaster TS XW.Racer..so far I am very satisfied with the Dirt Rally 2.0 experience.

 

[Patricio Quevedo]

In case anybody is interested, here are my FFB settings for DR2 on the T300 which I'm pretty satisfied with (see more below):

Please note that if you raise the FFB gain on a T300 beyond the default 75 %, you really should be using the forced fan mode that keeps the fan running at all times (then again you should probably be using that mode even when not raising the gain).

I am using soft lock with the wheel set to 1080 degrees, but I have the driver hands disabled and only the virtual wheel is shown, because if I enable driver hands, the virtual wheel rotation doesn't match the real wheel (a bug, I assume).

As for the FFB settings themselves, they don't transform the FFB significantly, so the road noise is still quite low in the mix, but it is definitely there. I'm not a fan of those supposed XML "fixes", because from what I've tried, they introduce more issues than they solve (and I can come up with several reasons of why I think that is the result), no matter how you tweak them. I also have no problem feeling the suspension, wheel grip and all that without them (even though it definitely varies between cars - as it should). I would like the wheel friction to be higher for the wheel to not be as loose, but it seems to also hide detail in the FFB if you raise it, so I keep it low.

I'd certainly like the road detail to come out a bit more in the FFB, but other than that, I am very satisfied with how the FFB is and I think it's up there with the best and certainly far from "broken", "unplayable" or "non-existent", to quote a few descriptions I've seen. It is very nuanced and detailed, it just doesn't hit you over the head with the information it provides.

 

[Patricio Quevedo]

This will work for G29 ? thank you

 

[Case_]

@Patricio Quevedo I honestly can't tell you how well it carries over to G29. I would think it more or less should, but I could be wrong. And I think I saw some mentions G29 drivers don't even have damper anymore, so some of the FFB might be completely missing there.

But there's little risk in trying.

 

[RasmusP]

@Patricio Quevedo I honestly can't tell you how well it carries over to G29. I would think it more or less should, but I could be wrong. And I think I saw some mentions G29 drivers don't even have damper anymore, so some of the FFB might be completely missing there.

But there's little risk in trying.

afaik the damper is just always at 100%.You know....Logitech might be a bit like you "Let me tell you about spring and damper..." => "Let's just hide it to be stuck at default"
And yep, works nicely with the dfgt

 

[Case_]

@RasmusP And so it seems so, upon further checking. I've heard several times before that they just basically disabled them, but it seems that they are in fact set to 100 % instead (and still people are looking for ways to change it...)