Sim Racing on a Budget!

justwannadl said:

As someone who is strictly in the "no VR, no play" camp (although I have never tried triples, so my opinion may change one day), what are your guys' thoughts on selecting a low-budget VR headset?

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As @Dzul has said the Quest 2 is probably the best value option when buying new, and in some ways can be better than the current standard of the Reverb G2

But don't discount the second hand market - the Rift S is still a good HMD, as is the Reverb G1 (I have both the G1 and G2, and I prefer the G1 to be honest). Both can probably be found for reasonable money.

Please do not rule out in advance a wheel-based office chair, without knowing the full circumstances and possibilities

There's still plenty.

For near a decade I did absolutely fine with this combo:

• G27 Wheel + H-Stick + pedals - purchased as new hardware for ~€220.
• Solid 200cmx140cm heavy hight adjustable table with lifting capacity of near half a ton. Price as new was +€2500, but acquired through my work for ~@€35 when they were about to throw it out, but still very functional for combined home office use, sim racing and plenty other use. Lowest possible position about 35cm and highest position 145cm.
• Ergonomic IKEA wheel-based hight adjustable office chair, but real quality - purchased for ~€100. Though been used now for 15 years it's still going fresh as new and far better for office work use than my works ergonomic office chairs.
• 2 x wide solid nylon belt loops with hook device and traction of 500kg each - purchased for ~€15.
• Use of 2-5 DIY stop blocks made of wood to prevent lateral movement of chair.

All in all ~€370

This for a hight adjustable solution with from the gun new sim hardware, leaving a very suitable solution for large variety of different seat positions, from gokart to truck position. And within 30 secs to switch between office work use and sim racing use - and back again.

Ofcourse not totally stable when on the limits, but a bit improvement on the nylon belt loops and stop blocks made me actually decent for ACC competition a couple of weeks before switching to more "official" simrig with replacement to

• Thrustmaster T300RS-GT + GT Pedals + T8HA
• Next Level Racing F-GT Lite flexible seat (+official NLR mat teased me)

In all this investment costed me ~€890.

Needed a flexible seat solution for my small work office + family home office + simracing room, and I must say NLR's solution is very satisfying for me, far more stable than I've hoped for, tried a DD solution (~10Nm max torque) a week.

Near €900 is maybe a bit over the limit for trying teasing label "entry level" for a non-simmer just found a tad interest for our work, but definitely not for a more enthusiastic simmer as me.
And boy it feels good when you in addition do have a very solid hight adjustable table and numerous DOF's from NLR's solution when you as me simrace a huge variety of different cars. Ofcourse there's no need for this if you're just a formula or GT-racer and nothing else.

And hight adjustable table is becoming more irrellevant for me after my latest VR investment:
META Quest 2 - 128Gb version for €399, but anybody will do fine with the 64Gb version of which was available in my country for just above €300.

And then you could complain VR requires expensive newer GFX.
My answer, if just looking for budget solution: Absolutely NO.
Myself doing fine with my 5 yo RX 580, just lower resolution and some graphics marmelade tuned down, but still heck of an immersion experience.

And my flexible seat solution is still fabulous, for time being using 4-5 different seat positions, including for my now 7yo daughter

I recently got a Rift S used for £120 and it feels like a steal for what it will give back.

I guess 'budget' wise its all relative.
I've not drank booze for 9 years and no longer have 'toys' like motorbikes and cars and i don't race karts anymore, so to me PC's and sims being my main hobby now it all feels like a bargain.

I like to be savvy though and i think there is a lot off guff that people get which to me isn't necessary.
But its all personal choice.
I will say though that its pointless using the internet to compare anything.
If someone may have a killer sim rig but still lives at home with Mum and Dad and drives a shopping car.
Of course everyone life is different shades.
If you own your own home/ have kids, household budgets come first.
So your choices should be based on that not on competing with someone with no responsibilities.

Same as youtubers get given stuff and or make money from you watching, so of course their set ups will be nuts.
Boosted media spent what 100k on his set up which you can beat with VR.....

For me roughly this:

RTX 2070 Ryzen 5 3600 16 ram PC £800 (500 was the RTX)

Rift S £120
Monitor 27inch free from friend
TX wheel plus TPA pedals and 2 extra wheels £400 all in
race seat £150 based on kart chassis.

Gives hours and hours of entertainment with every sim plus some other games.

Slapped said:

True, but you know how it goes. People will inevitably set the TM control panel FFB to 100%, and ramp the FFB up in game. This is where the forced cooling mode saves the wheelbase.

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so true. I like the ffb subtile no brutal, so never had a problem with heat or loudness with my t300
I always set the ffb that it`s never clip on whatever part of the given track. Just "under the clipping line"

Badwheels said:

What has always cracked me up is the term "budget". No one wants to say "cheap" or "poor" so the term budget is used. If I decided I am not spending more than $7,000.00 on my sim setup, isn't that a " budget"?
But the representation of "budget" is something that costs 1 dollar.

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PC culture strikes again. People are not poor. People have budgets.

BrunoDSL said:

PC culture strikes again. People are not poor. People have budgets.

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Someone's idea of poor in the UK is very different to being poor in Africa.

It goes back to what I said about comparing, using your '7k' sim set up, if someone spent 7k on a sim set up but still lived at home with Mum and Dad and they were over 22, then a) that explains it and b) they should be trying to get their own home or at least rent.

Biggest issue that people in the UK and most of the west is, they spend far too long comparing their lives with people on the internet.

Budget means budget, not sure why someone said it means 'poor'.....

Also over on the MSFS forums people were flexing about buying 3090s etc at the over inflated prices few months ago. Now all GPU's have dropped, I'd rather buy now, if that makes me 'poor' then so be it frankly....
I call it savvy, or not stupid.

Guys I used to play with a standard chair and I had a couple of tricks to prevent the chair from moving:

1. Try to connect the chair to the pedals so they don't move away. I had the T500RS with their metal pedal base and I used a metal clothes hanger to tie together chair and pedals.
2. I found this "soft corner protector for kids" kind of foam and it's really good when applied under pedals and chair to prevent them from moving around. Hey i even put it under my washing machine
   
   

Badwheels said:

What has always cracked me up is the term "budget". No one wants to say "cheap" or "poor" so the term budget is used. If I decided I am not spending more than $7,000.00 on my sim setup, isn't that a " budget"?
But the representation of "budget" is something that costs 1 dollar.

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You misunderstand the term totally.
If you have a budget of £1 or £1 million pounds, you can be either in or out of budget...
At no point is the term 'poor' crossed with it.

Hence why F1 has a budget cap. Councils have a budget cap, the NHS in UK has a budget cap.
Those example surely you don't think "is something that costs 1 dollar".....

The only thing I look for over anything else in PC gaming is value for money.
If i purchased a game for £20 but never played it, I'd consider my choice an error....
Not because £20 is a lot, or that I'm poor or whatever.... simply value for money.

bringmethenews said:

Someone's idea of poor in the UK is very different to being poor in Africa.

It goes back to what I said about comparing, using your '7k' sim set up, if someone spent 7k on a sim set up but still lived at home with Mum and Dad and they were over 22, then a) that explains it and b) they should be trying to get their own home or at least rent.

Biggest issue that people in the UK and most of the west is, they spend far too long comparing their lives with people on the internet.

Budget means budget, not sure why someone said it means 'poor'.....

Also over on the MSFS forums people were flexing about buying 3090s etc at the over inflated prices few months ago. Now all GPU's have dropped, I'd rather buy now, if that makes me 'poor' then so be it frankly....
I call it savvy, or not stupid.

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Issue here is that...Most of those articles are not going for "budget." As much as some people will say that to not be the case, Logitech and Thrustmaster are not really selling "budget" wheels. They sit more at the mid-end of the scale. Things like what PXN, Hori and other brands make would be more in the "budget" category. Wheels without FFB and more a controller than trying to aim for some sort of realism. Even reviews of those are hard to find.

I do use an office chair, but I replaced wheels with this: https://www.salon-stolica.hr/images/thumbs/0010106_plasticne-noge-ct-06_550.jpeg

Oh that looks handy @mojnick!!!

BrunoDSL said:

Issue here is that...Most of those articles are not going for "budget." As much as some people will say that to not be the case, Logitech and Thrustmaster are not really selling "budget" wheels. They sit more at the mid-end of the scale. Things like what PXN, Hori and other brands make would be more in the "budget" category. Wheels without FFB and more a controller than trying to aim for some sort of realism. Even reviews of those are hard to find.

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Considering the poor reliabilitiy and the limits of these.low costs products, I assume that they are not suited for simracing and that they will cost more after a few weeks because they will have to be replaced. And considering how limited they are (no ffb short a.gle of rotation...), simracing could be a bad experience. It is not simracing on a budget, it is just a simracing killing.
The same.for the g29 which, although is an amazing product to discover simracing, is too unreliable to expect it not to be replaced soon, just before or just after the warranty period. At the end, it will cost a lot.

Indeed the options left are not that cheap in theirselves, second hand wheels, t150, but, as simracing is a long term hobby, you need to invest to start enjoying it. As many hobbies, it is quiet expensive, but with some reliable piece of equipment you're ready for many years (i still can use my old df pro with AMS2).

I printed 5 of this for my chair so i can keep it in place when driving and move around when using the pc for something else, works as a charm and its dirty cheap https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:845601 there are some others for diferent chair wheel sizes.

Regards.

roadyroad said:

Considering the poor reliabilitiy and the limits of these.low costs products, I assume that they are not suited for simracing and that they will cost more after a few weeks because they will have to be replaced. And considering how limited they are (no ffb short a.gle of rotation...), simracing could be a bad experience. It is not simracing on a budget, it is just a simracing killing.
The same.for the g29 which, although is an amazing product to discover simracing, is too unreliable to expect it not to be replaced soon, just before or just after the warranty period. At the end, it will cost a lot.

Indeed the options left are not that cheap in theirselves, second hand wheels, t150, but, as simracing is a long term hobby, you need to invest to start enjoying it. As many hobbies, it is quiet expensive, but with some reliable piece of equipment you're ready for many years (i still can use my old df pro with AMS2).

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While that can be true, Fanatec also has a track history of poor reliability and customer support. And they don't sell cheap products.

As per the "bad experience" argument, that's extremely debatable. The vast majority of people doing sim racing on a budget have no frame of reference nor any racing experience. How can they tell the difference when they don't know the difference? The whole "bad experience" argument always seems to come from people that own or upgraded to expensive rigs. People have won tournaments and competitions with controllers and inexpensive wheels but we tend to forget that for some reason.

BrunoDSL said:

While that can be true, Fanatec also has a track history of poor reliability and customer support. And they don't sell cheap products.

As per the "bad experience" argument, that's extremely debatable. The vast majority of people doing sim racing on a budget have no frame of reference nor any racing experience. How can they tell the difference when they don't know the difference? The whole "bad experience" argument always seems to come from people that own or upgraded to expensive rigs. People have won tournaments and competitions with controllers and inexpensive wheels but we tend to forget that for some reason.

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That's not my point.
Fanatec is known for reliability issues, indeed, so 9n a budget you don't but fanatec.
The experience has been shared all over the internet for years, and that what this topic is made for, sharing simracers experiences trying to give advice to those who would like to enter simracing without spending too much, and not more than they expect after their first buy.
That's why I take in account the costs of cheap bad quality products which will, at the end, cost more than others or 2nd hand ones. When you're on a budget, this is something important.

Yes, people with basic g25, g27, g29, win races, and I have mentionned the g29 as a bad product because unfixable. G25 and g27 are fixable if you are able with your hands.
But people who win competitions are not on a budget, so what's the point?

Sorry if I sound to harsh, but let's stay in the topic of good advice for those who need to enter and enjoy simracing at the lowest cost possible. If badly adviced, they just will remember how badly elitist the simrzcing community is. If well adviced, they'll enjoy simr1cing as much as we do and the genre will grow faster.

roadyroad said:

That's not my point.
Fanatec is known for reliability issues, indeed, so 9n a budget you don't but fanatec.
The experience has been shared all over the internet for years, and that what this topic is made for, sharing simracers experiences trying to give advice to those who would like to enter simracing without spending too much, and not more than they expect after their first buy.
That's why I take in account the costs of cheap bad quality products which will, at the end, cost more than others or 2nd hand ones. When you're on a budget, this is something important.

Yes, people with basic g25, g27, g29, win races, and I have mentionned the g29 as a bad product because unfixable. G25 and g27 are fixable if you are able with your hands.
But people who win competitions are not on a budget, so what's the point?

Sorry if I sound to harsh, but let's stay in the topic of good advice for those who need to enter and enjoy simracing at the lowest cost possible. If badly adviced, they just will remember how badly elitist the simrzcing community is. If well adviced, they'll enjoy simr1cing as much as we do and the genre will grow faster.

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The problem with sim racing at its current state is that it's a niche of a niche and what people often see as a reference in the wild is people running expensive setups and bashing everything else. That's their point of reference and with some of the comparison and review videos some of those people put out, you create the impression that if you don't have a direct drive wheel and some sort of high end rig, you're automatically excluded from the hobby. Then people wonder why those high end products are still expensive.