Automobilista 2 Version 1.3.1 Now Live with Free Racin' USA DLC Weekend

Proto 3.0 said:

My boxing days are a long time ago.

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Haha, im rubbish at it and too old to get good now anyway!

No the reason i made the joke was because If you could take one of the cars with from previous builds and totally unlocked the diff, as far as you can, and then do the same, with the same car, but from the current build (Porsche or Mclaren GT3 for example), and spent some time driving each, basically if you did'nt notice a big difference, you would'nt notice a punch in the face from an angry Mike Tyson.... So maybe take up boxing..... (its just a joke please don't get upset). But seriously i'd urge you to try it, maybe you're not noticing much difference on default setups with certain cars, but take one of the cars i mentioned, open up the diff and take it for a spin, they are a universe away from how the reacted to driver inputs before V1.3.0.0.

Tarmac Terrorist said:

Haha, im rubbish at it and too old to get good now anyway!
But seriously i'd urge you to try it, maybe you're not noticing much difference on default setups with certain cars, but take one of the cars i mentioned, open up the diff and take it for a spin, they are a universe away from how the reacted to driver inputs before V1.3.0.0.

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I am a very cheerful person and when I get tired of all this scribbling I start having fun. ))
But seriously, the differential problem was just fixing a bug in the coding of the game's engine. There was no breakthrough here. Perhaps this somehow influenced your sensations from driving, but I spoke from the problems that I was faced with.

Proto 3.0 said:

I am a very cheerful person and when I get tired of all this scribbling I start having fun. ))
More seriously, the differential problem was just a mistake in the coding of the game engine. There was no breakthrough here. Perhaps this somehow influenced your sensations from driving, but I spoke from the problems that I was faced with.

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" the differential problem was just a mistake in the coding of the game engine"
Oh yeah i'd say you're right about that for sure, however I do think it was a breakthough as it had a massive effect on the handling of the cars and solved a fundamental problem with most of them, but it was'nt only that as coupled with the changes to tires and driveline all of the cars (even ones without LSD's) changed. Its not even an interpretation, the cars are now fundamentally different. I mean, its not RF2, but its a heck of a lot closer to it now.

Proto 3.0 said:

I am a very cheerful person and when I get tired of all this scribbling I start having fun. ))
But seriously, the differential problem was just fixing a bug in the coding of the game's engine. There was no breakthrough here. Perhaps this somehow influenced your sensations from driving, but I spoke from the problems that I was faced with.

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To be fair if it's a significant implementation error, then fixing it will be much more influential than anything you could do to the individual models.

The main issue with AMS2 is still inconsistency between cars.

Let's take as an example the stock cars and GT3s.

The first ones are in my opinion perfectly reasonable, oversteering under power, unsettled by inertia, understeering in steady state with high steering angles and recoverable within high side slip values.

The GT3s on the other end are unnaturally planted under power and if by chance you manage to make them slide it's almost impossible to recover (mainly below 100km/h). After one or two laps of driving at the limit rear tires simply give up causing frustrating spins at low speed while coasting no matter how fast you try to countersteer (try last two corners at Donington for test).

Something similar is happening on F1 cars.
F-Reiza for instance has reasonable grip levels and overall dynamics, while V10s seems to come from wipeout managing corners full throttle at unbeliveable speeds.

...not to mention Gt3 cup. Fun as much as you want, but more similar to vintage 911 on street tires than a modern car on slicks.

Anyway Reiza is gaining confidence with the SMS engine and on 1.3 we have already seen strong improvements, so let's wait for the new builds.

Avo77 said:

The GT3s on the other end are unnaturally planted under power and if by chance you manage to make them slide it's almost impossible to recover (mainly below 100km/h). After one or two laps of driving at the limit rear tires simply give up causing frustrating spins at low speed while coasting no matter how fast you try to countersteer (try last two corners at Donington for test).

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Give this person the gold medal of the RaceDepartment! This is a real driver!
Did someone really notice it!

The fun part about things like that is that it *can* be realistic and as intended. I wouldn't be complaining if a road car in a sim overheated the brakes and tires to **** after 2 laps; that's kind of how they work.

I'm not making any claims either way but just reminding that diagnosing issues with handling alone is quite difficult if you are not very educated about the specific cars.
I am not very knowledgeable about modern GT cars apart from having read some parts of restricted manuals, looked at some privateer telemetry and dynos, talked to people involved and so on. But I've never built an accurate model for a GT-whatever car so I think it's dangerous territory to make claims about those specifically. I've seen some pretty buggy looking behaviour in accurate models. It is not very uncommon for one axle to just have thermal issues for example, or the dampers to just be plain bad and unusable unless they are at full soft/full hard.

Although it does sound a lot like that thermal model volatility that I keep posting about.

Proto 3.0 said:

Maybe this will be news for a Reiza, but problem with strange rotation of cars in corners were in PC1, in PC2, this problem was somehow solved.

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In PC2 it was solved by having differentials that blocked any car rotation and that is factual evidence in telemetry. Definitely not a good example of improvement of car's behavior there. So maybe there is something in the way of personal expectations vs reasonable physics behavior...

Amazing cars.

I really love this update. I drove my first AI race at Cleveland and it brought back some fantastic memories. Lots of fun and i was smiling for the whole 10 laps. Great addition.

Have extremely limited time these weeks for simracing, but just HAD to drive a CART at Cleveland reading the news, spending tons of hours racing the rF1 CARTFactor mod @ Cleveland rF1 mod though more than a decade (on and off) with my former simgear G27 and before that my Guillemotte Ferrari FFB, also very satisfying.

So just returned after 4 laps driving the Reynard98i @ Cleveland GP circuit compared with ditto laps of the +10yo CARTFactor+Cleveland combo in my newest sim gear.

Two things a bit dissapointing here.

1: FFB is quite 'dull' with my T300RS-GT and G27 Pedals (my addon loadcell for my T3PA broke down) - in fact FFB felt more detailed in rF1 engine CARTFactor mod and rF1 Cleveland track mod.
ADMITTED! Haven't deleted folders suggested to be deleted regarding the new '+' std. FFB feature. So I'll return at later time being doing that.

2: Engine sound: Stange onboard low volume and artificial sound? Just as I've experienced in the Porche 911 GT3 R. Where rF1 CARTFactor delivers fabolous engine sound and the right immersion.
Anyone else experience this and maybe a fix?

Some users here at RD have written about a "hit-and-miss" experience speaking AMS2.
Might be right, and some times I have the experience that it goes with car+track combo and (some) FFB scrutineering (though onboard FFB edit feature helps a bit and auto rotation/angle as per unique car saves a bit of time).
Last time I raced AMS2 it was one of my best sim experiences ever in the Mercedes AMG GT3 @ Campo Grande and mixed classes GT-races where it all comes together, FFB sensation vs. my present gear, track AI and so on hitting bulls eye.

Edit: Haven't read the full thread, so pardon if it's already been mentioned, time is not on my side these weeks...

Is it just me or is the Watkins Glenn track of sub par quality ?

Especially the infield section has no trackside objects at all compared to other tracks.

Marg said:

I find it strange not to have CART and old F1 point systems among those offered in Championship Mode.

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True and this is a feature that could easily be implemented in the sim.

HoiHman said:

Is it just me or is the Watkins Glenn track of sub par quality ?

Especially the infield section has no trackside objects at all compared to other tracks.

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I am expecting further updates to that track.

stenovitz said:

1: FFB is quite 'dull' with my T300RS-GT and G27 Pedals (my addon loadcell for my T3PA broke down) - in fact FFB felt more detailed in rF1 engine CARTFactor mod and rF1 Cleveland track mod.
ADMITTED! Haven't deleted folders suggested to be deleted regarding the new '+' std. FFB feature. So I'll return at later time being doing that.

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Now, a follow-up on my FFB haywire experience.
And this turns out weird in a senseless manner.
Just returned from a phenomenal race in older Rreiza sim Copa Petrobras de Marcas - which feels like an entire modern sim speaking both FFB and all eye candy turned on. So exciting racing Mitsubishi Lancer 1 close AI race @ Autódromo Tarumã and so detailed FFB response for this rather old sim.

Then returned to AMS2 - just re-mapping to full 1080 degree rotation/angle in Thrustmaster Control Panel (from round 300 degree in the older Reiza sim) - but no difference in that setting compared to my first try earlier this evening.

Now FFB response is so intense and nuanced! Just driving out the very same Reynard98i Ford at Cleveland with stock Reiza settings as few hours earlier this evening. Bravo!

So have no explanation, but if you get lost in dull FFB, then grab your old Copa Petrobras de Marcas for a short while - and get back again - and voilá!

NB: By mistake I touched my T300RS paddles ...which responded, too!
As an old AC driver (authenthic gear hardware choice limitations, though easy changed via each car's drivetrain.ini), this surprised me. A bit underwhelming, my first thoughts was "blasphemy!". Of course I do use my paddles now and then - for paddle cars (though quite seldom as a kid keen of classic cars).

As AMS2 do quite a lot of 'fastest lap on the planet' just during loading screen for car/track combo as well as hotlap world records, Reiza should definitely devide in 2
1: "Authentic drivers"
2: "Arcade paddle drivers"

I think most of my postings on RD and elsewere mentioning AMS2 ends up sounding salty.
Really, I am not! I'm a big fan of Reiza's progress with AMS2!

Edit: Steam statistics states I have driven AMS2 for only 29 hours. Which I cannot fathom! Thats a heck of 29 quality hours!

BillyBobSenna said:

Some other aspects that made CART great:

• Several different chassis: Penske, March, Lola, Swift, Galmer, Reynard, etc.
• Different engineers: Ford, Chevy, Porsche, Buick, Mercedese, Alfa Romoe, etc.
• Types of Track: Perm Road, Temp Road, Short Oval, Super Speedway
• Countries: USA, Mexico, Canada, Brazil, Germany
• Big Name Drivers: Andretti, Unser, Fittipaldi, Foyt, Mears, ...........
• Many different winners each year
• Indy 500

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And Australia!

banenab said:

I agree with the statement that CART is good, what I meant was that I don't have the same connection to it as someone from USA who was watching it back in the day.

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No offense, it was some kind of irony. I agree, indeed I couldn't follow the CART's championship on TV (Ive just seen a few races when it was on). So it can't be culturally as cult as F1, but it was an amazing championship with its own qualities (qualities F1 really have been lacking from many years, losing itself in aerodynamics issues solved by the DRS, total nonsense for me). I would have liked to be able to follow these races more often.

R.Man said:

Because the reason is somewhat hard to figure out. People think that …… Kunos creates its own game engine, Reiza uses madness engine that's a big difference. If creates

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häää? Is unreal 4.X a Kunos engine?

Xela1 said:

häää? Is unreal 4.X a Kunos engine?

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Nope. UE4 is the engine that runs all of the graphics and the interface with the user and its inputs. Then there is a physics subroutine that is Kunos proprietary that simulates physics as UE4 frequency of calculation is insufficient for a car simulation.
So to give an insight, ME runs 600Hz physics simulation, while Kunos just upped theirs to 400Hz from I believe 300Hz earlier. UE cannot cope with those frequencies by itself and even making it work with higher frequency physics part isn't a straight shot by no means

MadDriver11 said:

Nope. UE4 is the engine that runs all of the graphics and the interface with the user and its inputs. Then there is a physics subroutine that is Kunos proprietary that simulates physics as UE4 frequency of calculation is insufficient for a car simulation.
So to give an insight, ME runs 600Hz physics simulation, while Kunos just upped theirs to 400Hz from I believe 300Hz earlier. UE cannot cope with those frequencies by itself and even making it work with higher frequency physics part isn't a straight shot by no means

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Before a physics tickrate argument begins, I'd just like to say that there is effectively no real massive gain going from 300 to 400 or even 600. Nor to 1000's either. The KS move from 300 to 400hz is very likely just so they can easier *downscale* some other aspects of the physics to run at lower hz to free up resources.

FWIW based on some 2ndhand accounts, you need upwards of 2000's to properly run top level racing rates without significant oscillation. Hence OEM sims run more in the mid thousands than high hundreds or low thousands like consumer sims do.

For something like a GT car and especially road and track cars, it makes really no difference if your engine runs 300hz double, triple, quadruple that. It just gets pretty bad allegedly if you go too low, like towards 100hz or lower.

Also, most consumer sim steering wheels cannot support high tickrates to begin with. I think most of the DD stuff peaks at 1000hz, so it's not like going from say 1000hz to 2000hz on that gear will give you that much more FFB tickrate, you'd need to invest in some more specialized sim gear to actually get more than just the filtering benefit.