Season 8 Race 5 MELBOURNE Incident Report

[Jim Hawley]

I think we had a sleeper further ahead.

That was me, I had to wait because of me not being in a grid slot (sitting between Eliezer & Nico), I've been getting great starts in the practice stints, only this time being so close to the back of Nico I didn't want a great start for fear of running into him, so i used less revs than normal and waited for a split second in an effort to move away slowly, except I screwed it up and got bogged down initialy then wheelspin as I tried to get it moving, went a bit sideways and scuffed the wall

All in all it looked like the work of a complete amature

Sorry dudes

 

[Anthony Ishak]

take 2 lags in all race and make 2 incident !!!

im so sry ishak:eek: is totally my fault too the 2 incindent the ather lag but there close the pedal accelleration for not make another crash and vale arrive so fast for try not push me him go crash sry guys

No problem Gaetano, better luck next race ..

 

[Valerio Vinassa]

take 2 lags in all race and make 2 incident !!!

im so sry ishak:eek: is totally my fault too the 2 incindent the ather lag but there close the pedal accelleration for not make another crash and vale arrive so fast for try not push me him go crash sry guys

I saw you at last moment blocked in track no problem mate all OK

 

[Eliezer Bartik]

All good guys, my fault Valter, I needed to slow down, maybe it was saving us both.
With those attitude, Its definitely best sim league to be at.
nice creation Nico
C U ALL next event

 

[Valter Ostman]

That was me, I had to wait because of me not being in a grid slot (sitting between Eliezer & Nico), I've been getting great starts in the practice stints, only this time being so close to the back of Nico I didn't want a great start for fear of running into him, so i used less revs than normal and waited for a split second in an effort to move away slowly, except I screwed it up and got bogged down initialy then wheelspin as I tried to get it moving, went a bit sideways and scuffed the wall

All in all it looked like the work of a complete amature

Sorry dudes

Sorry for the remark Jim, but here in the forum is the only place I can pretend I'm any good

 

[Nicolai Nicholson]

take 2 lags in all race and make 2 incident !!!

im so sry ishak:eek: is totally my fault too the 2 incindent the ather lag but there close the pedal accelleration for not make another crash and vale arrive so fast for try not push me him go crash sry guys

The race prior to this, namely montreal, we had one incident that stole the head-lines. The issue there was track re-entry and the lesson learned was not to turn the car around without knowing what is comming, one should rather get the car off the track asap and wait for a safe time or drive off track to you find a safe spot.

The whole point with the incident report is that we are collectively to learn from them so we continue to improve our racing together. Now, here is Gaetano's incident:

My question is:
Did Gaetano read the incident thread at all last race? Why didn't he learn from what happened there?
I do not understand Gaetano's analysis of his incident, is he saying it was due to lag? And why do I have to spend my time making this video and posting this post when it is Gaetano who is supposed to do this?

We want to have you in our league Gaetano, but my nerves cannot take it much more, at least as long as you do not do what is expected by every driver.

 

[Nicolai Nicholson]

To make what I mean clearer, this is what I think a "perfect" report from Gaetano should look like:

I went wide and crashed at the exit of t1. The car was under control on the left side of the track on the grass and I knew I had enough time to spin the car around before the next car came around the corner (I remembered the Kimmo incident, but I knew I had enough time). However, I did not manage to turn the car around on 1st try, and then it was too late.

Looking at the situation now I should not have chanced on turning the car there but rather driven in reverse along the grass until I found a safer spot.

 

[Reik Major]

I agree 100 %, because I exactly thought the same, when having a look at this incident. It automatically remembered me about Kimos incident.

It is very, very sportsman like by Anthony just to accept Gaetanos apology but things will repeat again and again I'm afraid. I don't think that Gaetanos intentions are wrong but I think he never realized that our standards in safety are much higher than he thinks. And I think the cause is his bad english so he doesn't really understand what we want from him.

Maybe he thinks that an honest apology is expected (and therefore all he needs to do) whilest we want him (and everyone) to review his own and otehr drivers incidents so we improve all together... So I'm afraid the situation will never change!

 

[David Turnbull]

your right about anthonys sportsmanship reik

i must say i wouldnt have been so forgiving (but you all know me), the incident between anthony and gaetano annoys me alot because not only does gaetano wreck anthony, he proceeds to drive into him and smack him again while anthonys stationary and gaetano trys to get going again, why would you drive into someone when you can clearly see them :eek:

also nobody ever noticed that gaetano manages to understand us perfectly well when we joke on the server when he is typing in "lol" or "^^" or whatever else he types, and due to lag? cmon that was due to a mistake, then a bad choice, nothing more, its starting to get a bit tedious with his excuses when clearly we all have the replay and can see his antics.

 

[Nicolas Rouge]

no incidents to report

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

Just a thought, isn't the drivingline on the left at that place? Just wondering why that incident then happened at very far right edge, would be nice to see the view from Anthonys point of view... I might look at the replay myself to see what happened.

EDIT: Not so straightforward case... Gaetano is moving which is of course is the main cause of this accident. Anthony made the wrong guess of where to pass the blocking car and moving car made it harder.. But once again, there was no lift on the throttle when the accident is clearly visible.and that makes it in my book in the 50/50 range again... When will you start to realize that when there is a car sideways in the middle of the road, you don't blast in full throttle past that point I never do since i've received my share of "i'll just trust my luck and blast past, OH ****! there is third car" -> BANG moments... So , once again i find my self defending the guilty party.... Maybe i should start a career here.. I know i'm not picking up popularity points, again..

I really do suggest of reviewing the overall policy, if this would happen in real life race, the approaching driver would get a warning for unsafe driving during yellow flag zone. We don't get the luxury of real good yellow flags waving but the principle is still there, use common sense. I don't understand of all this talking of safety when you can do this repeatedly. Nico should get a warning too, no lift when there are TWO cars colliding in front, what where you thinking, other than "easy points"?

If i spin i have to rely on the approaching drivers of making the right decision and i'm strongly against the quick Esc key, if i would make up the rules i would even prohibit escing in practice, more like to see people limbing to pits with three wheels and waiting 20 minutes for the repairs or even having to skip that session but that offtopic..

Still the fact that Gaetano moving is the more punishable act. I understand Anthonys decision to move to the right, usually the stopped car is situated left but in racing you can't rely on guesses...With a lift of throttle there would've been more time to react instead of blind judgement. Warning for both Anthony and Nico and serious warning for Gaetano is my honest opinion.

Just keep acting like this and i might some day win.. i was the slowest guy on the grid and finished 8th...

 

[Peter Marshall]

When will you start to realize that when there is a car sideways in the middle of the road, you don't blast in full throttle past that point I never do since i've received my share of "i'll just trust my luck and blast past, OH ****! there is third car" -> BANG moments...

I agree.

A useful post Kennett.

My own poor assement of the incident is that Gaetano essentially messed up with his "spin recovery".

Edit: But also I do agree with Nico [and others] that perhaps a little more analysis of the incident in the incident report thread would be good too.... that's where we all come in.

 

[Reik Major]

Kennett, it's absolutely fine to have a different opinion because it's not a black or white situation but one of those grey ones.

For me there's one final question: Did Gaetano everything he could do to rejoin in a safe way?

I'm honestly in doubt, because he starts turning and crossing the track immediately after coming to still stand.

Especially after a (very popular) similar situation the event before I can't hide the feeling that many other drivers would have done this turning move safer. How? Making this turning move when following cars are much more far away (blue dots on the map) so even when doing a correction move they still won't arrive at the scene.

Now the important addition to the last sentences: Everyone (including me!) could misjudge the required gap and cause such an accident. But then it's good to post it later so everyone's conclusion will be like this: "Ok, he wanted to turn safe but misjudged something. But I don't worry, because he'll most likely do better in the future."

The fact that this doesn't happen makes me worry...

 

[Nicolai Nicholson]

My opinion:
I cannot talk for Anthony, but for myself I can say that what I did in that situation (full throttle) happened on instinct/ not concious. I don't know the exact time frame, but I got presented with a situation where I had to decide what to do in a matter of tenths, there is no time to think, you drive on "instinct".

I have been in a real accident many years ago. I was going quite fast, and suddenly a car turned into the road ahead of me. My automatic reflex was to try to stear away from the sudden obsticle, not slow down. That was not because I didn't want to lose time getting home, it was a natural reaction to avoid hitting the obstical.

Gaetano made a controlled decitions, Anthony and I had to react to a sudden situation. And when I looked at Jonas' video I got the same feeling there, it happened so fast so he reacted on reflexes.

I am not saying one cannot question the way a drivers react to situations, and perhaps suggest working on changing it, but I do not think this is at the core of this issue. It was one driver who was in control of the situation, and one who had to react.

At best you could blame Gaetano for causing the incident but raise a "general reaction to sudden obstical" worry alert, we have seen 2 incidents with 3 reactions (Jonas, Anthony and I) and all reactions have been the same, not lift but steer. Could there be more that would react the same way?

Watch this video, pretend you are driving and "feel what Jonas' feel" Does he have time to consider or just react. And is his lack of braking (although he do lift) due to time-greed?:

 

[Gaetano Zizzo]

Ihavealreadyapologized toIshakI hopeyou acceptmy apology!
I seethat so manyare focusingonce again thefinger at meas if totry tomake meretirefromthis contest!veryfrustrating!to makeaclarificationon my partonaccidentexposethe facts asthey went,Ihadvery closemarkomarkoshotafter the turnandmanaged toslow down andpull offIlooked at themap andIshakandnicoeranonocurvet1sothat I had notseendamageItried turningthe car andcontinue myrace butI was stuckin thewall,although I thinkI was stuckon one sideof the track whereapparently littlepath,on arrivalof IshakI thoughtthat he takethe usualtrajectoryrather than inside Iwas fooled bythe shortbackandI'vedone to be ableto turnmy carbut stillclearly visiblethat there'wasenough room topull outas it didnico! I honestly do notknowif therewas timeto slow downfor Ishakat the sight ofa caralso stoppedbecausehe was strugglingwith nico

 

[Gaetano Zizzo]

I know that in the context of a community can not all get along, but at least you try, as always I see david turnbull just waiting to be able to point your finger at me at every opportunity, dear davidknow that I'm a guy 1 meter and 80 cm behind a family and a child of 7 years and 2 balls as a house, surely (antics) that writeabout me, do not affect me at all!!!! !

 

[Jonas Lex]

whats wrong with your space bar gaetano?
Im sorry but we shouldnt spend our free time argueing with guys like kimmo or gaetano who are just rude and clearly dont want to cooperate at all, theres no point in doing that.
Maybe its not the presto way but if a person simply doesnt see the result of his actions then In my opinion theres no way he should drive in this league.
Of course discussions in general are a good thing to learn something in the end but this doesnt lead anywhere

 

[Gaetano Zizzo]

dear jonas maybe you have not seen the post where I wrote thatthe facts and entirely my fault apologizing ::
and how well we feel someone else who likes to offend goodgraces of the jonas rude you associate yourself to the club by david?

 

[Kennett Ylitalo]

Guys STOP!

 

[Peter Marshall]

Please.....
Keep the discussion on the racing or someone will click on that REPORT link again. Then Nico will be in the frying pan once again; no no no....