PC Upgrading Discussion

[Mehmet Arikan]

upgrade:
Athlon 64x2 4800+ is max when i am right dont know if its availably on market right now
ati 4850 or 9600,9800 nvidia, + 1GB Ram

new one:
p45 + intel Duo 8400,8500,8600 + 2*2GB + 4870 or nvidia 260 vga looks good
if you want more than only gaming go for quad (video rendering, compiling, etc.)
the display resolution should be the key for your vga decision. More then 1280*1024 you need to go for 4870 or 260 nvidia

have fun

 

[James Yates]

Andrew do you have a link to any of the pc sites that you would be buying the stuff from?

Good build would be something like:
Intel Q6600 G0
DFI P45 DK
OCZ 2x2GB PC8500 Reapers
ATI 4870
Corsair TX 750W
Tuniq Tower 120 or Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme or OCZ Vendetta 2 or Xigmatek HDT-S1283 (with Crossbow mounting kit)
Samsung F1 500GB
New case of your choice - if you need one. I can recommend the Antec P182, Antec 1200 and Gigabyte Aurora 570

 

[Andrew Dawes]

Yes.

My normal store (if you can say that for every 3 yrs) is digitalstar.com.au. It doesn't look that cheap now after looking on the web but i think their kits are more realistic to what i'd end up buying. Their site is easy to use - although building a PC on the web is a bit hit and miss as to what you can choose. I can also drive down there on a Saturday without much effort so i know who i'm dealing with.

After spending all day on this (part of the process is taking my wife to a french cafe and negotiating the budget) i'm making some progress....might report on preliminary findings soon.

Haven't found a decent alternative website yet but have been looking at
ticomputers.com.au and megaware.com.au ...where i found a 2x4750 2GB Saphire card for AUD658 hmm how can i get the budget extended....

Oh an mehmet i haven't forgotten about you - your info was excellent - i'm just digesting it stsill but it really has me on the right path.

 

[James Yates]

Have a look at the attachment - all from Megaware Computers, Australia :: Online Store

Things you can change - Get 2 4870's or a 4870X2 and a Corsair TX750W instead of the TX650. If you are only really playing racing games, you may aswell stick with what i posted and then in a year or 2 get another 4870 if you find you don't quite have enough performance. I made the list a lot cheaper than you said you max budget was so you will be able to buy a new monitor if you wanted to

 

[Andrew Dawes]

Thanks James great work. I agree with a few of your choices although i have a couple of concerns on the key ones.

Motherboard
DFI Lanparty - have to agree it sounds like the best bang for buck but i'm concerned its too complex for me - a separate cooling system - i think i'd like a simpler option even if i have to forgoe some functionality. What do you think the key criteria for a motherboard is?

Processor: Have to say i'm leaning towards E8400 or E8500 as Mehmet indicated. Looks like perforamance today is simialr to 6700 but at less cost. I realise there is some risk on going 2core rather than 4 but the basis is upgrading and i sunk a lot of money in the past on future proofing only to find that i took to long to take advantage. Haven't completely made up my mind but i'm close.

Everything else i'd say is spot on for me. All in all, a great suggestion...i don't think i'd go wrong with it.

Further questions i now have
Whats the difference between the Q6's and Q9's?
What's GO?

My musings based on todays research:
Graphics Card: 4870 512MB - AUD330ish - is there any justification for 1GB at AUD100 more?

Motherboard: 2x PCI-e 16s (for future GPU expansion), DDR2 is fine - gotta say the motherboard variances are confusing at this stage - so any additional key criteria anyone can add i'd apprecaite.

Processor: E8500 and Q9450 seem to be equivilent performers today with the 8500 cheaper.

A useful chart on chipset performance as done by APC magazine i found useful.
AMD Vs Intel: 51-CPU megatest > Group Tests > PC Authority

I guess all thats left is evaluate the upgrade options and further clarify some of my confusion regarding the technical detail.

 

[Andrew Dawes]

upgrade:
Athlon 64x2 4800+ is max when i am right dont know if its availably on market right now
ati 4850 or 9600,9800 nvidia, + 1GB Ram

have fun

Excellent feedback Mehmet, why the 4800+ limit did it go to different technology at 5200+?
- i also haven't seen a 4800 one listed around.....that pretty much rules out the upgrade.

 

[James Yates]

I recommend the DFI because even if you don't use all its features its VERY stable and should give slightly better performance. Also, there is a big gap between the slots which means if you have 2 or 3 cars they will all get enough air. The separate cooling system is very easy - it just requires pressing down two plastic pins to attach it

Go for a quad core over a dual as its more futureproof - and considering you said you don't want to upgrade for a few years, you are better off buying something that future games will use. A Q6600 is very cheap for the huge performance it offers and if you ever decide to overclock it will overclock very well. A G0 just refers to the new ones - basically any Q6600 you buy now will be a G0 - they run cooler and overclock better.

A 1GB 4870 will offer a very very small performance increase - think around 1-2FPS which isn't really worth it.

 

[Kagemush]

PC Hardware Question from Mac User

PC Hardware Question from a Mac Person

I have been an Apple Mac person for many years and have hardly paid attention to the happenings in the PC world. Although I use a computer all-day, everyday, my interest in the details of hardware/software is minimal. I am a project manager by trade and merely want the software to work with minimal problems. In my MacBook and OS X, I have found an ideal combination.

However, when iRacing came along, I knew that I HAD to get involved. I have loved GT4 on my PS2 for years.

I signed up for iRacing last week, foolishly thinking that I could run iRacing on my two-year old MacBook, with under Parallels or Boot Camp. Wrong.

It appears that I need to buy a Windows-based machine in order to run iRacing. Buying a new system is understandable, but I'm confused with all of my hardware choices. I do not want to get fancy, build my own machine, overclock, and what-all. I just want a cost-effective computer that allows me to run the program nicely without having to upgrade again immediately.

My computer thoughts turned to shopping at Costco. I spend a lot of time shopping at Costco and have never been disappointed. The Costco website list a gaming computer that potentially would be a good price/performance value. To play a single game, I didn't want to spend any more than the $699 listed for the Costco PC. (Remember, this computer would be used for only iRacing and a couple of other small programs)

I would appreciate any feedback on the following specs. Thanks!

Kagemush

IBUYPOWER GAMER 901-CL3

Processor & Memory:
Intel® Core™ 2 Duo Processor E8400 (3.0GHz)
6MB L2 Cache
1333MHz Front Side Bus
4GB DDR2-800 memory (2GB x 2); max capacity 4GB

Motherboard:
ASUS P5KPL-VM Mainboard

Drives:
320GB (7,200 RPM) SATA 3Gb/s Hard Drive
20x max DVD±RW drive with Double Layer

Graphics:
1GB NVIDIA® GeForce® 8500 GT graphics card

Communications:
Gigabit Ethernet LAN

Audio:
Realtek ALC662 6-channel CODEC

 

[Ben Tusting]

I have finely find somebody who has an Apple mac
We have 3 in our household.
I would say look in the tech support froum.
here are a couple of links
http://forum.racedepartment.com/tech-support/7091-new-pc-advice-non-technical.html

I have just recently upgraded my pc my link is here
http://forum.racedepartment.com/tech-support/6209-upgrading-my-pc.html

I would say go for a quad core as this is the future.
But if you post this in the tech support menu you are more likely to get a response


Edit:You don't need a pc you could buy a new mac which you can run windows on but with a pc you can always upgrade and Windows are normally cheaper and faster.

 

[James Yates]

That prebuilt you have listed will not run any games very well with the 8500GT graphics card. Look for one with an 8800GT or better - the rest is ok though.

Don't bother with buying a mac if you want to play games as all you will end up doing is having to spend more money that you need to.

 

[Christopher Aponte]

hi Kagemush
welcome to Race Department


well the system looks great, but there are 2 components that I personally say no
- the motherboard being a mini ATX....I'm not really jumping for one of those
- and the graphics card.....it is to slow...like others said above me the 8800GT will be much better alone the line.

hope that helps

 

[Karl Westman]

Hi,

In general the components look alright, but I'd reconsider the graphics card. Get a nVidia 260/280 or for most "bang for the buck" get one of the new ATI cards ( 4850 or 4870). Some one mentioned Quad core CPU, I'm against it as hardly any game supports it ( and for sure not a single sim-racing game). There's been a lot of "hype" surrounding the quad cores since their release, but all tests I've read has come to the conclusion that Quads time isn't now nor in the foreseeable future.

iRacing demands a lot of the PC so get the best you can for the budget you have. I'm using:

Asus P5Q3 Deluxe
Intel Duo Core 2 E8400
Corsair 4 GB DDR3 1333mhz RAM
nVidia 8800GTX (just ordered a ATI 4870 X2, will be in the PC within three days)
On board sound module ( just ordered a Asus DX PCI-E sound card, forget Creative if you plan to use Vista - it doesn't work)
300 GB Velociraptor HDD
1 TB Samsung HDD
Zalman 850 PSU (the best PSU I've ever had, dead silent and rock solid)

My configuration would set you back approximately €1500, but it would "last" for at least three to four years.

Kind regards,
Karl

 

[Cam Wedgwood]

Have you had a look at Scorptech.com.au Andrew? I am about to go through them for a new custom build (straight out of PC Powerplay so I don't have to do much thinking) and they seem good on price. Compared to the digitalstar systems, I think you'll find scorptechs a little better.

 

[Andrew Dawes]

Interestingly I looked at scorptech last night. And why, because the two magazines i was using yesterday were APC and PC Powerplay.....and at midnight it i flipped to the review.

I built a test system using their site based on James specs - very impressive site! It provided most of those specs and i think would be an opportunity to get the DFI. Having said that, the costs seemed a bit high for the package so i will do some comparisons tonight and work out why....might be just me overspecing.

One question for you james - with the motherboard there were two to choose from and the only difference i could find was the one you spec'd have 1394 adn the other didin't (and $40 difference) ... from what i could work out that is firewire - would the cheaper option be okay?

 

[James Yates]

What was the name of the other one you were looking at? Do you mean the X48 and P45 that i suggested? If so, the X48 performs better with Crossfire, and also overclocks very well. That said, the P45 is a very good motherboard - but it is missing many of the bios features of the X48. I believe the X48 also has more Sata ports and expansion slots which are further apart.

 

[Cam Wedgwood]

Well I bit the bullet and ordered my new system through them today Andrew. I get the feeling that if you give them a bell (I called twice and they were keen to help and offer suggestions and assistance) you could probably ask for a better price than the one that comes up automatically.

 

[Ben Tusting]

So do you reckon if you phone companies up you can get a better deal
Or would it be just smaller companies who you could barter with

 

[Andrew Dawes]

What was the name of the other one you were looking at? Do you mean the X48 and P45 that i suggested? If so, the X48 performs better with Crossfire, and also overclocks very well. That said, the P45 is a very good motherboard - but it is missing many of the bios features of the X48. I believe the X48 also has more Sata ports and expansion slots which are further apart.

They were both X48s. On is DK, one is LT
LPDK-X48-T2RSDFI LP DK X48-T2RS LGA775 MBoard, X48/ICH9R Exp Chipset, 1600MHz FSB, DDR2, SATA II, RAID, PCI-E, LAN, USB 2.0, 8-Ch Audio, ATX2 year1-4 Units$295.00LPLT-X48-T2RDFI LP LT X48-T2R LGA775 MBoard, X48/ICH9R Exp Chipset, 1600MHz FSB, DDR2, SATA II, RAID, PCI-E, LAN, 1394, USB 2.0, 8-Ch Audio, ATX2 year1-3 Days *$330.00

Actually i looked at the specs - slightly different things - the LT has a few more tricks.

 

[Andrew Dawes]

Well I bit the bullet and ordered my new system through them today Andrew. I get the feeling that if you give them a bell (I called twice and they were keen to help and offer suggestions and assistance) you could probably ask for a better price than the one that comes up automatically.

So what is your system? Went with the package or did you get weak at the options list?

 

[James Yates]

Andrew, the LT has a better chipset cooler and that allows you to put more voltage through the northbridge allowing higher overclocks. It will also run cooler which means its more stable. The LT also comes with a much better bios, 2 more sata ports and an extra pci express slot.

Here are the 2 mobo's

DFI X48 LT T2R

DFI X48 DK T2R