PC1 Horrible optimization?

[Richard Eriksson]

Ok, so i've been a long time Team Member and today used my discount and got the release version...

To my horror the horrible optimization is still there.

My GPU sits at 55% usage at the start of the race some times, with CPU load around 80% max, but framerate takes a dive into low 40s...

Something is stalling in the rendering still.

And still, if you add rain, it kills performance without taxing the GPU, something is wrong in the code. Been like this for at least a year now. Still there in release.

Too bad.

Hardware:
GTX 980 SuperClock 1342MHz. 4Gb. VRAM
16Gb. RAM
CPU@4.2 GHz. 4 core


Problem is worse on some tracks, Spa being a notorious problem maker.

Changing settings does little, as you would expect, since both GPU and CPU is underutilized.

Don't go for screenshot quality for PR, if you can't code the damn thing to run properly in motion.

As for the feel of the sim itself, it's still only so-so, but the immersion is nice. Shame it has problems still.

Any ideas on settings?

Else i'll wait, like i've done since being one of the first sponsors on WMD... Because it still feels unfinished.

 

[Richard Eriksson]

All the tracks in AC & Pcars are as smooth as silk even though the fps can be quite different between some tracks.
I think Pcars has good optimization since i can race against 32 AI or humans with night conditions with rain and thunderstorms and it will still be smooth as silk.

Richard Eriksson : I find it strange that i'am only using a AMD Phenom 965 (overclock to 3.8 Ghz) with a MSI GTX-970 and i can run this game as i stated above and you have these issues! Don't forget the motherboard, memory and power supply play a big role to ensure everything works at it's best.

Perhaps Pcars will improve their optimization further to help those who have these issues.

Would depend on settings as well. And your personal definition of smooth i guess. With a Phenom i have a hard time seeing running 32 AI at 60 fps. But if you can please share your settings as it may show some setting that is hammering the CPUs for the rest of us.

 

[Richard Eriksson]

Ok. Managed to find a benchmark clearly showing that the engine is locked somehow CPU wise... More threads make it slightly faster... But the interesting result is that on a shiny new I7 and a GTX Titan, clocking from 3GHz. to 4.5 GHz. Yields no difference in rendering. And GPU is still underutilized.

Shows my points well... This engine is not coded right, at least not from a PC point of view... 1.5GHz. of added clock yielding no more rendering throughput at all? That is bad... Was the same on the Shift games as i recall... Not as bad as this though.

Link to CPU part of tests, scroll a bit for clocking comparison:
http://www.techspot.com/review/1000-project-cars-benchmarks/page5.html

 

[Piet Dekimpe]

stupid question here : i am running on an "old GPU GTX 480 " with i7 processor
I run 50-60 fps but with setting everything low, off or medium, no crowds, no grass etc...
I suppose if i just change the GPU to lets say 970/980 i will have a significant improvement in project cars... without changing much of the rest of my PC.... can i just change the GPU or do you guys thinks other things need to be changes aswell

Thanks in advance for your advice

 

[Ace King]

The bottleneck as you know would be your GPU so i would recommend the GTX-970 since it has a great price/performance and will give you a nice performance boost. I love my MSI GTX-970, and it does an awesome job paired with an AMD Phenom 965 (overclock 3.8 Ghz) though my CPU is bottlenecking it still allows me to increase the majority of settings to Ultra for Pcars and AC. Your i7 is more powerful than my Phenom which will benefit you quite nicely.

 

[martinsalat]

stupid question here : i am running on an "old GPU GTX 480 " with i7 processor
I run 50-60 fps but with setting everything low, off or medium, no crowds, no grass etc...
I suppose if i just change the GPU to lets say 970/980 i will have a significant improvement in project cars... without changing much of the rest of my PC.... can i just change the GPU or do you guys thinks other things need to be changes aswell

Thanks in advance for your advice

I run it on a i5 2500k gtx970 almost everything max except aa and grass with constantly 60fps

 

[Ace King]

The bottleneck as you know would be your GPU so i would recommend the GTX-970 since it has a great price/performance and will give you a nice performance boost. I love my MSI GTX-970, and it does an awesome job paired with an AMD Phenom 965 (overclock 3.8 Ghz) though my CPU is bottlenecking it still allows me to increase the majority of settings to Ultra for Pcars and AC. Your i7 is more powerful than my Phenom which will benefit you quite nicely.

NOTE: You might also need a new power supply if it's not up to the task though the GTX-970 is not near as demanding as your typical AMD GPU equivalent.

 

[Richard Eriksson]

Apart from maybe Azure Coast start i can maintain 60fps on full ultra even on reflections and enviro as well as shadows, using 23 AI. But still CPU usage is not taking advantage of clock speed. GPU still underutilized.

The big culprit is still rain weather. For instance, on my rig it cuts the framerate more than in half. In rain setting, not thunderstorm, just regular rain i go from 70 fps on full ultra down to 32... GPU usage increases only 6% but CPU becomes congested. So some stuff is CPU bound. And clockspeeds won't help you.

For now i don't run rain races. For me that is just a screenshot gimmick in this title anyhow.

But improvements are needed on the engine for sure. Let's hope they do that instead of DLC...

 

[gamer19]

Imho, more than a half performance lost ...is not normal thing. My loss in rainy weather is something about 20-25% I would say. I really think it's up to you, to your settings/PC components combinations. Maybe you use too big AA too much sparse grid supersampling, too strong combination of those two or ...something like that.

Anyway...
guys, could anyone tell me which GPU would be the best stricly for Projects Cars, I got i5, I'm at work but think it's 3470K or 3570K - the one you can overclock. Now...
I don't have too much money, so my friend (he's 1st class computer geek and he'll buy from someone who he can trust, so it wount be a problem that it's not new) would buy me some second hand GPU. I thought 770 would be just fine. Now I heard some great stuff about 970 but... that's a new card and I doubt there will be many for sale on second hand and on that test Richard Eriksson post in this page they said that 960 (!) posted better results than 770 !??

Mid-range contenders such as the GTX 770 delivered 50fps, while the GTX 760 only managed 45fps. The GTX 960 delivered a surprising 57fps, making it faster than the GTX 780 which seems unlikely.

And I dont see how's that possible here's the HWcompare numbers for those two:
http://www.hwcompare.com/18424/geforce-gtx-960-vs-geforce-gtx-770/
And this made 960 superior only in power consumption and AA department but waay back into other two important points: memory bandwidth and texel rate.
I know it's only numbers and the game performance is something other but still....
Anyway, what do you think, which one ? Bury in mind, my budget is somewhere around 250€. Only.
And, yes it's a second hand.
Also, I got enough RAM - 8G.
Thanks.

 

[Richard Eriksson]

Imho, more than a half performance lost ...is not normal thing. My loss in rainy weather is something about 20-25% I would say. I really think it's up to you, to your settings/PC components combinations. Maybe you use too big AA too much sparse grid supersampling, too strong combination of those two or ...something like that.

Anyway...
guys, could anyone tell me which GPU would be the best stricly for Projects Cars, I got i5, I'm at work but think it's 3470K or 3570K - the one you can overclock. Now...
I don't have too much money, so my friend (he's 1st class computer geek and he'll buy from someone who he can trust, so it wount be a problem that it's not new) would buy me some second hand GPU. I thought 770 would be just fine. Now I heard some great stuff about 970 but... that's a new card and I doubt there will be many for sale on second hand and on that test Richard Eriksson post in this page they said that 960 (!) posted better results than 770 !??


And I dont see how's that possible here's the HWcompare numbers for those two:
http://www.hwcompare.com/18424/geforce-gtx-960-vs-geforce-gtx-770/
And this made 960 superior only in power consumption and AA department but waay back into other two important points: memory bandwidth and texel rate.
I know it's only numbers and the game performance is something other but still....
Anyway, what do you think, which one ? Bury in mind, my budget is somewhere around 250€. Only.
And, yes it's a second hand.
Also, I got enough RAM - 8G.
Thanks.

Well, with GPU underused i see no problem on my settings. So still some CPU issues in the engine i guess...

For your GPU question, 900 series is new architecture while 700 is still Kepler. Kepler is a bit hit and miss in some cases.

The best you can get on a budget now is a used 970 if you can find one. Preferably a superclocked one.

 

[Damage Inc]

Has anybody seen the technical issues thread on the Pcars forum?

It's unbelievable that all those 80,000 investors didn't pick out the bugs and get the devs to fix them during the extended pre alpha/beta era. Amazing.

seriously?? out of the 80,000 how many contributed to the testing? Many issues WERE raised and many were fixed but not all. Was your post really necessary or just another pointless snipe.

Shall I look at the technical issues forums of all the other sims and then ask just what the hell were their testers doing and they were probably PAID to do it.

But I forget...you're the resident expert in software development arn't you?

Get a grip mate.

 

[Andy_J]

Get a grip mate.

Lol. Been looking for posts to have a go on eh Damage?
Why don't you leave it now and go somewhere else if you don't like it here. :rollseyes: There is no need for you to keep raking things up here. You are just stirring now. To be honest I don't know why you are so upset/uptight about all this.

(Jedi mind trick coming up ) "These are not the posts you are looking for, move along"

 

[Damage Inc]

Lol. Been looking for posts to have a go on eh Damage?
Why don't you leave it now and go somewhere else if you don't like it here. :rollseyes: There is no need for you to keep raking things up here. You are just stirring now. To be honest I don't know why you are so upset/uptight about all this.

(Jedi mind trick coming up ) "These are not the posts you are looking for, move along"

Jedi mind tricks only work on the week minded. Either that or I'm Jabba the Hutt

Nah, just looking through the forum. spotted something that stood out like a sore thumb and commented. And I'm stirring??? LOL what the hell was your post? Cmon Andy, Show some restraint and I'll disappear from your life. Carry on and I'll probably carry on when I see the nonsense. I'm sure I don't address EVERY comment you make do I? I'm not following you around, but as I say. If I'm looking at a thread and I see a comment like yours I'll address it.

You have the power to make me disappear!! Restraint......remember <whisper>r e s t r a i n t

<blows kiss>

 

[gamer19]

Get a room you two....

And leave us to discuss about some a little more important matters.
Please.

 

[Bram Hengeveld]

and they were probably PAID to do it

Which current simracing games have paid testers then? If you make such posts, make sure to back them up with some examples and facts. Let's see them.

 

[M Theory]

Apart from maybe Azure Coast start i can maintain 60fps on full ultra even on reflections and enviro as well as shadows, using 23 AI. But still CPU usage is not taking advantage of clock speed. GPU still underutilized.

The big culprit is still rain weather. For instance, on my rig it cuts the framerate more than in half. In rain setting, not thunderstorm, just regular rain i go from 70 fps on full ultra down to 32... GPU usage increases only 6% but CPU becomes congested. So some stuff is CPU bound. And clockspeeds won't help you.

For now i don't run rain races. For me that is just a screenshot gimmick in this title anyhow.

But improvements are needed on the engine for sure. Let's hope they do that instead of DLC...

It might be worth noting that the game does not seem at all properly optimised on the Xbox One. Sekitto and Silverstone (in the dry) are particularly bad. Frame rate drops in fast turns (I have been testing in the Lotus 98T), causing input lag. This problem seems to have got worse when the patch for the XBox version was applied today. Patch seems to have fixed twitchiness but magnified frame rate/input lag.

 

[Andy_J]

You have the power to make me disappear!! Restraint......remember <whisper>r e s t r a i n t
<blows kiss>

If only I truly did have that power Mr Damage. If only.....<whisper> if only.......

 

[SnappyDEe]

I'm so glad I decided to invest in pCars. The numbers are looking good.

Racing in the rain is a screenshot gimmick? It may not be perfect but it gets pretty immersive. I quite enjoy it.

 

[Damage Inc]

Which current simracing games have paid testers then? If you make such posts, make sure to back them up with some examples and facts. Let's see them.

um what? So you don't think Kunos, ISI, iRacing have q/a teams testing things? Ooooo kay! don't need to back it up, it's common sense and EVERY game ever released in it's credits has the Q/A team RIGHT there! LOL, and you think they don't get paid either?

 

[DayGlow]

I found that lowering environmental mapping and reflections has a huge boost to stormy weather fps with AI. If you think about it with 20+ cars all reflecting rain and lightning at full resolution it will show down the system. You have to pause the game to see the downgrade so there is no real loss in fidelity while racing

 

[Richard Eriksson]

I'm so glad I decided to invest in pCars. The numbers are looking good.

Racing in the rain is a screenshot gimmick? It may not be perfect but it gets pretty immersive. I quite enjoy it.

How many real races are run in monsoon condition thunderstorms? None. Thus, it is a gimmick to have it in a racing sim.

But it does look good and is needed on the console market to compete with DriveClub so why not.

But if you are going to add it, at least make sure the game engine can sustain it...