PC2 Have Your Say: Project CARS 2 Three Months On

[Paul Jeffrey]

Project CARS 2 released across PC and console platforms back on the 22nd September to mixed reviews, now three months and a couple of patches we want you to 'Have Your Say'...

The latest racing title from Slightly Mad Studios continues to divide opinion throughout the sim racing community, often mixing the sublime with the ridiculous in equal measure as it constantly strives to achieve the lofty ideals set forth by an aggressive pre release marketing campaign.

Shipping in a sub optimal state and having since been in receipt of a sizable updates, the question for today is:

How do you feel Project CARS 2 has progressed since release day, and what are your impressions of the game now?

Have fun, stay respectful and enjoy the weekend!

 

[Damage Inc]

Out of curiosity...

Is there any reason those sorts of 'behind the scenes' pictures arent shared more often?

As a fan of sim racing, this is the sort of stuff the more involved fans love to see. The end product that appears in-game is one thing for players to look at and judge... but seeing all the work that goes on to create that product is very interesting.

Not to single Pcars out, as I find this fascinating with every game.

behind the scenes stuff is really good and interesting.

When I was part of WMD for PC1 it was brilliant to see things being built up, granted the more techie stuff was over my head, but just watching the tracks and cars being created was awesome. Reading the comments of Ben and the other drivers was very interesting, they defintely said when things weren't good and were not "promotional yes men" for the ad campaigns. I didn't sign up for WMD2 because after PC1 was released I just didn't play it for ages as I'd spent 2 years or so testing the game, didn't want to get jaded like that for PC2.

 

[protonv5]

I have no beef in that story and only have seen yesterday the original video (casual drive around Nordschleife VLN with comments of personal opinions of the driver) and have only seen above posted snippet of Ian Bell's forum comment regarding the story.

I am a native German and could fully understand what anyone who is NOT a native German or fluent in German language could take away from the original video, maybe also influenced by one of the heated (and typically exaggerated) forum discussions that go along.

Here is a quick summary what the German driver REALLY commented about in the original video for non German speakers:
- PC2 penalty system kicked in when he went off track (and loosing time, NOT gaining any advantage from the offtrack moment) - this penalty invalidated the lap time irregardless of the actual disadvantage.
- this frustrated Jan obviously (he went on during the video about this incident) and was his major issue he saw with PC2 (penalty system, that 1st was switched off and 2nd still penalized (despite being switched off) an incident that in real life would not have caused any penalty

- on several occasions Jan commented that the track width and space between track and tire walls are not as he remembers them

That is it.

SMS / Ian Bell had actually an absolute marvel, a jewel of an incredible marketing victory just laid out in front of them (and completely free of cost) to enhance the image of Project Cars 2 right in that moment.

The proper response of a SMS representative should have been:

"Hey Jan, we have seen that you had an issue with our product and would love to talk to you about how we can improve it."

But as I gather it the response instead was more in the realm of criticizing the video and Jan instead and then proceed to look into legal action options to shut the video down and/or cause Jan trouble due to his connection with Mercedes Benz.

Right there is an absolute gleaming example of THE WRONG WAY to go about conducting a business with customer relations and promoting your products.

THAT is the reason why Project Cars and SMS discussions usually end up messy.
Guys, relax, listen to customers and critics alike, you probably learn a thing or two for your next product or even improving the current one.

Jan Seyffahrt clearly was not "attacking" or "harming" SMS or Project Cars with that video. As a German I must say that his video was absolute down to earth and non-hostile. Simply a good bloke turning a few laps in a racing game and commenting what he thinks while doing so.
Some people really have to stop seeing any form of criticism as a potential threat.

Criticism isn't a threat - it is input for product improvement cycles and usually very often at the same time pure gold for marketing a product, if, IF the response is chosen properly.

In any way I must thank this incident, as it has brought another interesting youtube channel to my attention - I am sure to watch him in the future.

Thanks for your sensible reply my friend. Reading it is like relaxing by the beach with a beer in hand. Very refreshing.

 

[protonv5]

Saying our Nordschleife isn't accurate is objectively wrong yes. It's to within 2 mm of the laser scanned point cloud.

We iterated on a polygon to point cloud differential analysis until it was nailed. Here is an early WIP.

I read an interesting story years ago about how plastic model cars are made. Part of the process involves taking all of the measurements and pictures of the actual car to be modelled and then scaled dawn to 1:24 scale. After this done, the end result is a car that simply looks out of proportion. The proportions then need to actually be changed so that the model actually looks correct and just like the full size car. I've said it before: Sometimes in these sims, (especially PCars1) the speeds just feel far off. You do a race and watch the replay and looks like you're watching the race sped up, like an old comedy. It's possible, that something to this effect is taking place here. Maybe the track is inch-perfect, but perhaps the car is too wide, or too zoomed in or something else is not right, making the track look to small. I would look into this.

 

[bigbawmcgraw]

Disclosure - I don't own pcars2 (and never will)

When pcars2 was released I was genuinely hoping for rave reviews from all sim racers, telling us how SMS have finally nailed the FFB and physics. I was hoping to hear phrases such as 'feels as good as rf2 and AC' and 'now it truly IS a sim' but alas it seems they've missed the boat again.
Pcars1 was a true disappointment for me. Yes it looked pretty, but a polished turd is still just a turd, and from what I've seen in YouTube reviews (even ones that have been deleted) and read on this and various other uncensored threads, it looks like pcars2 is just a copy & paste with some new content thrown in.
So I'd like to thank RD and everyone who contributed to this thread for saving me a few quid. I was going to post a picture of myself posing with a smug grin holding the cash I've saved but I fear Mr Bell might call the internet police or have his lawyers threaten me as he's done to many others.
Instead I'll use the money to buy a nicely aged bottle of malt to enjoy over the Christmas period.

Seasons greetings to all.
Peace.

 

[apex11]

I read an interesting story years ago about how plastic model cars are made. Part of the process involves taking all of the measurements and pictures of the actual car to be modelled and then scaled dawn to 1:24 scale. After this done, the end result is a car that simply looks out of proportion. The proportions then need to actually be changed so that the model actually looks correct and just like the full size car. I've said it before: Sometimes in these sims, (especially PCars1) the speeds just feel far off. You do a race and watch the replay and looks like you're watching the race sped up, like an old comedy. It's possible, that something to this effect is taking place here. Maybe the track is inch-perfect, but perhaps the car is too wide, or too zoomed in or something else is not right, making the track look to small. I would look into this.

Yes I think the same happens with physics, it may be accurate to the cars physics in however they work the math out, but then that doesn't work translated to a game, because you, we are playing with pixels.... i think RF2 falls into that trap with few cars..

 

[mr_belowski]

I'm as disappointed as the next guy when it comes to the amount of stuff in there that doesn't quite work properly. But despite some serious issues it's definitely *not* a turd, polished or otherwise. With sufficient remedial work it could actually be really very good

 

[apex11]

I'm as disappointed as the next guy when it comes to the amount of stuff in there that doesn't quite work properly. But despite some serious issue's it's definitely *not* a turd, polished or otherwise. With sufficient remedial work it could actually be really very good

Oh yes I agree, I put 600+ hours into PCars 1.
They need to balance the people who simply say whatever they do is perfect and the ones who simply didn't like it (its their right) with the genuine people like yourself who are simply trying to get the game to be as good as it could be...
I think they have far too many yes men in WMD.

 

[Green-Promise]

Oh yes I agree, I put 600+ hours into PCars 1.
They need to balance the people who simply say whatever they do is perfect and the ones who simply didn't like it (its their right) with the genuine people like yourself who are simply trying to get the game to be as good as it could be...
I think they have far too many yes men in WMD.

I have never visited the WMD forum so I cant say how it is but if most of the members in that forum act as most of the WMD members in their official forum then yes, theres too many "yes-men"

 

[Amir Vodokotlic]

I found Ian Bell's second account on race department.

Don't you dare say anything remotely critical about pcars2.

Bell's army is coming.

 

[Mickdrs]

I might get it some day, why I haven't got it yet is alot of negative reviews over positives

 

[mister dog]

and from what I've seen in YouTube reviews (even ones that have been deleted) and read on this and various other uncensored threads, it looks like pcars2 is just a copy & paste with some new content thrown in.

This couldn't be further from the truth, but hey if you can't form your own opinion by actually playing the game, and instead prefer to rely on negative reviews so you can confirm your own bias then you'll be the one missing out in the end .

 

[bigbawmcgraw]

This couldn't be further from the truth, but hey if you can't form your own opinion by actually playing the game, and instead prefer to rely on negative reviews so you can confirm your own bias then you'll be the one missing out in the end .

I wasted £40 on pcars1, I'm not going to waste another £40 on pcars2.
The reason I can rely on these reviews is because they describe it in a similar way as I would describe pcars1, so it sounds like not much as improved in the FFB and physics department.
What's important to me (FFB & Physics) may not be important to you, therefore you can enjoy it and I can't. I'm not going to drop a single penny on a game that I know I won't enjoy or play.

 

[mister dog]

I wasted £40 on pcars1, I'm not going to waste another £40 on pcars2.
The reason I can rely on these reviews is because they describe it in a similar way as I would describe pcars1, so it sounds like not much as improved in the FFB and physics department.
What's important to me (FFB & Physics) may not be important to you, therefore you can enjoy it and I can't. I'm not going to drop a single penny on a game that I know I won't enjoy or play.

Both the physics and FFB improved a lot since 1, but don't take my word for it just dial in your wheel and see for yourself. Game is going for 30 bucks on CDkeys already.

 

[Sky]

Or you could take my word for it and not bother wasting your money

 

[tlsmikey]

On the bright side, I think a couple of the reasons why people are so animated about this title is the feature/car list that was provided. It's the first sim to truly have everything that people wanted....weather, day/night, multiple cars per class. It holds so much promise, but the lack of polish is killing it right now. Combine this with the promotional efforts that Ian has led the last year or so and there's a pretty strong backlash when you don't deliver 100%.

I do think this is a game changing sim though. I'm holding out hope they can fix this and polish it. I doubt it will ever get to AMS levels of polish, but if they could it would be an amazing sim.

 

[bigbawmcgraw]

Both the physics and FFB improved a lot since 1, but don't take my word for it just dial in your wheel and see for yourself. Game is going for 30 bucks on CDkeys already.

Do you get paid a bonus if you convince someone to buy it?
Don't waste your time buddy

 

[protonv5]

I wasted £40 on pcars1, I'm not going to waste another £40 on pcars2.
The reason I can rely on these reviews is because they describe it in a similar way as I would describe pcars1, so it sounds like not much as improved in the FFB and physics department.
What's important to me (FFB & Physics) may not be important to you, therefore you can enjoy it and I can't. I'm not going to drop a single penny on a game that I know I won't enjoy or play.

Game is very good, even excellent in many ways. If you believe what you hear (all the negative) then you truly will miss out. But we all have choices.

 

[Michael Hornbuckle]

By 'dial in your wheel' he actually means:

Program three buttons on your wheel, one for each ffb slider.

Every time you change cars, and sometimes when changing tracks while in the same car, spend anywhere from a couple minutes to somewhere this side of eternity experimenting with the sliders until you have something that kinda conveys what the car is doing most of the time.

Get fed up with all possible combinations of the original 'flavors' and install the Jack Spade files.

Rinse and repeat the above process for each of the handful of Jack Spade files.

Give up.

 

[bigbawmcgraw]

By 'dial in your wheel' he actually means:

Program three buttons on your wheel, one for each ffb slider.

Every time you change cars, and sometimes when changing tracks while in the same car, spend anywhere from a couple minutes to somewhere this side of eternity experimenting with the sliders until you have something that kinda conveys what the car is doing most of the time.

Get fed up with all possible combinations of the original 'flavors' and install the Jack Spade files.

Rinse and repeat the above process for each of the handful of Jack Spade files.

Give up.

So, plug n play by pcars1 standards?
This must be a design feature so you'll miss the 2 hour refund limit on Steam.

 

[protonv5]

Game is very good, even excellent in many ways. If you believe what you hear (all the negative) then you truly will miss out. But we all have choices.

2 people disagree that we all have choices. Interesting