Car models for Assetto Corsa

[BanjoMaster]

Hi Aristolesis
I’m keen to teach myself how to build cars for sims. If I was to attempt to jump straight in at the deep end and aim for AC, can you give any initial pointers to go on at the minute? I’m assuming that the best program to work with would be 3DS Max? Can you give an idea of poly counts for each main part of one of your typical cars? How many for the body, how many for the interior, how many for wheels, etc.
Yes, I am an absolute bone-stock beginner, but I have ambition :-D
Many thanks,
Graham

 

[BanjoMaster]

Oops, somehow this didn't appear in the correct forum!? Presumably my mistake - thanks for moving!

 

[Aristotelis]

Hi there Graham.
I can give just some indication, as I don't know everything regarding this aspect... so don't blame me if I misinform you in the end

Ok so AC models use around 55 to 65 thousand polygons for the exterior (including a "low detail" cockpit and the wheels), and the same amount for a dedicated cockpit model. Obviously you can make as many as you want, but we think this is a good limit for performance.
The engine does not support 2 sided polygons so if you want something to be visible for two sides, you need to double it and turn it around.
Engine supports big textures of course, normal maps, real time shadows everywhere, self shadowing too, but we do not support for the moment ambient occlusion. We tried it, but it was never good enough for fine detail and also big fps hit. Maybe in the future, but for now you will need to bake an ambient occlusion texture.

You create all your 3D on whatever program you like and then you need to export an .FBX file (it's a standard format that all main 3D programs use). You then import that .FBX file into our editor and you assign materials and shaders. The editor uses the same identical graphical engine of the game, so whatever you see in the editor is what you'll get in the game. Once done, you just export a specific file that the game understands and you're ready to go.

Obviously when AC goes public, we will release the workflow and all the details regarding content creation.

 

[BanjoMaster]

Thanks Aristolesis, exactly the kind of info I'm after. I'll be honest, some of the stuff you mentioned doesn't mean a whole lot to me at present, but I'll get there I don't think I'm making it easy for myself with the project I have in mind, but no pain, no gain

Cheers again, much appreciated.

As an aside, I doubt I'm the only one who has noticed how much input you've put into the forum here, so thankyou. It's extremely refreshing and very useful. It really does make us feel involved in the project. big thumbs up

 

[Hampus Andersson]

When you work with 3DSMax you are going to need a lot of patience...
A couple of years of patience probably.
Learning curve is not your average Photoshop, i actually gave up trying to learn 3DSMax.

 

[BanjoMaster]

I've got an idea of how difficult it will be, and even then I'm fully aware I'm probably underestimating that by quite a bit, so I'm trying to go into it with my eyes open. I do have a strategy for building the mesh at least, involving building a spline cage and then meshing it using one of the polygon creation scripts you can get. It may appear to be a cheat or a shortcut, but using the splines seems a more natural path as I'm coming from an AutoCAD background. Mapping, materials, animation, etc. can follow on once I've got a handle on the basics...!

Who knows, I may have my first car ready for Assetto Corsa 3!!!!!!!!

 

[Hampus Andersson]

Then 3DS should be ok CAD is no joke.
I have Spaceclaim (unpacked) and i downloaded Autodesk123Beta (freeware) for fun.

Why not use CAD software? Is there some limitations to using a CAD software?

 

[BanjoMaster]

Why not use CAD software? Is there some limitations to using a CAD software?

What, draw the splines in AutoCAD and then import into 3ds? I'd looked at that, but it would appear to be simpler just to draw the cage in 3ds as i've read it gets a bit niggly trying to import. A spline's a spline's a spline after all.

I say all this from having watched a shedload of Youtube tutorials over the last few weeks in my lunchbreaks - I haven't yet had a chance to get beyond the 'setting up blueprints' stage in 3ds proper! But the wife's on a night out on Saturday night, so if I can get the kids to bed early enough I could potentially get a solid 3-4 hour run at it. I'm quite excited!!!

What a sad ******* I've become...

 

[Hampus Andersson]

What, draw the splines in AutoCAD and then import into 3ds? I'd looked at that, but it would appear to be simpler just to draw the cage in 3ds as i've read it gets a bit niggly trying to import. A spline's a spline's a spline after all.

I say all this from having watched a shedload of Youtube tutorials over the last few weeks in my lunchbreaks - I haven't yet had a chance to get beyond the 'setting up blueprints' stage in 3ds proper! But the wife's on a night out on Saturday night, so if I can get the kids to bed early enough I could potentially get a solid 3-4 hour run at it. I'm quite excited!!!

What a sad ******* I've become...

No draw the whole car in the CAD program.
It is possible to create the whole car model in Solidworks for example.
Then you can take the whole model and import it into 3DS Max.

But i don´t know enough to decide what the best idea is, just thought since you already understand CAD it could make things a whole lot easier for you.

Yea i checked a load of youtube tutorials as well when i decided to give 3DS a shot.
Started making rims and rendering those, looked like sh*t obviously but it wasn´t that hard.

It was when i started doing cars that you need patience, like setting up the pictures then starting to mold the car.

 

[Hampus Andersson]

You won´t learn a thing from this video but it shows you can model cars just like in 3DS Max.

 

[BanjoMaster]

Wow, that vid has just given me a migraine

I get what you mean though. I'm sure there're a million ways to skin the cat, probably all as tricky as each other. I'll have a go anyway, see how I get on. Hopefully I won't end up having a tantrum and throwing my comp under a bus!

 

[Hampus Andersson]

Post some of your progress when you are getting somewhere, always nice to see, whatever road you now choose to take

 

[XN-Sigma]

Oh cool! Didn't know there was a forum with an actual dev from AC talking with the users, this will be better than asking cramped questions through twitter.

Since this thread is about how the cars are made in AC, I'd like to know more about the limitations, for example:

Is it possible to have vehicles with more than 4 wheels?
Is it possible for vehicles to have tuning options? (ie. be able to change parts of the cars, like spoiler, wheels or tires)
In the case of tuning being possible, can different parts change the behavior of the car? Like, changing the engine from a V6 to a V8 makes the car go faster and have more torque, etc.
The radial blur on the wheels, is it baked or happens automatically?
Do the cars in AC (will?) have visual damage? (Or even mechanical damage?)
The car animations, like suspension, front wheels, etc, are they made in the modeling program and then exported to the AC's SDK or are they made inside the SDK?

I hope these questions can be answered so I can start planning something. (Though I already have some ideas that may be quite entertaining to see done )


Oh yeah, I'm very impressed by that Solidworks video, never knew it could do that so "easily". Gotta try it.

 

[BanjoMaster]

Oh yeah, I'm very impressed by that Solidworks video, never knew it could do that so "easily". Gotta try it.

Yeah, it's funny how all the tutorial vids on YouTube make it all look so easy!

 

[Bowen Walker]

I am so glad that .fbx is being used, it means that those of us who are Newtek Lightwave users dot have to import into Max to put our models into game..

 

[Aristotelis]

Oh cool! Didn't know there was a forum with an actual dev from AC talking with the users, this will be better than asking cramped questions through twitter.

Since this thread is about how the cars are made in AC, I'd like to know more about the limitations, for example:

Is it possible to have vehicles with more than 4 wheels?

Hopefully, possibly, not yet, dunno, will see. Made some amazing and you'll convince Stefano to program it sooner.

Is it possible for vehicles to have tuning options? (ie. be able to change parts of the cars, like spoiler, wheels or tires)
In the case of tuning being possible, can different parts change the behavior of the car? Like, changing the engine from a V6 to a V8 makes the car go faster and have more torque, etc.

Right now, while we talk, there is no such possibility. We create different folders with the same car copy&pasted and changed slightly if we want to reproduced something like this...
BUT
We haven't finished yet programming that part. There are thoughts about it, but also depends on the licensing contracts. So right now the reply I can give you is:
I don't know yet. I hope yes, but that's all I can say.

The radial blur on the wheels, is it baked or happens automatically?

Baked.

Do the cars in AC (will?) have visual damage? (Or even mechanical damage?)

Hopefully some visual damage for v1.0 release. Surely mechanical damage for v1.0

The car animations, like suspension, front wheels, etc, are they made in the modeling program and then exported to the AC's SDK or are they made inside the SDK?

Not an expert on this part, but as far as I know, AC now supports IK solutions from the modeling programs. So you can do whatever animation you like and then import them in AC. Can't tell you more on that though, as I'm ignorant in the matter.

Oh yeah, I'm very impressed by that Solidworks video, never knew it could do that so "easily". Gotta try it.

If I'm correct Solidworks models in nurbs surfaces and that doesn't give you very good control over the number or the form of the polygons created... but I might be wrong, haven't even watched the video.

Last but not less important. I confirm again the need to export in .fbx and then import to or gfx editor for shader assignments ecc. The gfx AC editor uses the same game engine, so what you see in there, is what you will see inside the game.
Unfortunately, I don't think we are going to release the mod gfx editor with the first "technology preview". This because we are still working on it and it would be bad for you and for us to release something and then make you work from scratch again for the final release, because we changed something in the editor.
I hope though we will be able to release a pdf with at least the most important instructions on how you need to work to create mods for AC.

 

[XN-Sigma]

Thanks for the answering, Aris.

 

[Nick Atsidakos]

Aris thanks for the useful informations about the 3d models,when i have more time i will continue the Escort MK1 and MK2 and i hope when be available the GFX Editor to make this cars.

BanjoMaster i also started making 3d models to 3DS Max but it was pain in a$$ to setup properly the blueprints etc so i was looking for tutorial's and i see a tutorial for Autodesk Maya so i start watching a tutorial that was in Italian and i learn from him through watching only.I will show you what ive done in 3 days with one tutorial, yeah need more work on exterior.

The rest here : http://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.4441823490431.183681.1434642905&type=3

 

[Vaggelis Theodoridis]

Αγαπαμε Νικολα!

Nice work Nick!

 

[Patryk Sokołowski]

If I'm correct Solidworks models in nurbs surfaces and that doesn't give you very good control over the number or the form of the polygons created... but I might be wrong, haven't even watched the video.

You are right, because in CAD software there is no such a thing like polygons, we are working on vectors, but if you want convert CAD3D model to polygon based graphics should be pretty easy. In other way, from 3DSMAX model to CAD that is very hard to have nice sufraces from polygon graphics on 99% cases we need to heal and optimize model in CAD.