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2 Big topics to Discuss , Austin and Vergne

Discussion in 'Formula 1' started by Scott Webber, Nov 21, 2011.

  1. Hi all,

    Alot of news has been surfacing and not long ago (last week) F1 done the Young driver's Test Line up in Abu Dhabi, one Driver stood out more then the others, it was Jean-Eric Vergne who was top of the timesheets for all 3 days, amazingly he was only 4tenths of Vettel's Pole position Time.

    He has the time's and the momentum to be in F1, but has he got the Knowledge and focus to compete in the sport on Racing Weekends? Finishing a Race is a tough challenge alone, lack of Experience also plays a big factor, he certainly has talent and it should be used next year.... Question is, will Red bull Put him in the Torro Rosso as a Driver or a test driver? or will they do what they done with Riccardo and lend him out to the lower field teams?

    Vergne has said very recently he couldn't do any worse then Webber, the young chap certainly has confidence and is not afraid to express it, but then again what you say such a thing if you was in his position? you can tell he's dieing to get a proper taste of F1.

    Next up is the much Debated Austin Texas, "Circuit of Americas" , alot of F1 fans welcomed a new Circuit especially in America after being absent for a good long 5 years! , not only would it boost the growth and wealth for Texas but it would be a challenging and new Track for the F1 Drivers not least more entertainment for the Audience.

    But the plans have all but been shattered once again by "Money" and ecclestone is right in there, a Contract which was drawn up last year and Sue Comb in a statement to Ecclestone last year said they would pay the $25m ahead of the race, but Mr E has not received a dime which has not only breached contract Tavo has been in alot of bother and has Breached he's contract too.

    it only gets worse as Sue Comb has said she will not allow Tax Payers money to be spent until after the Race has happened, Mr E won't have any of this, Hand over the money before or their won't be a show, oh wait it gets better.

    With the Announcement of the New Jersey circuit in 2013, rumors are that Bernie was more in favor for a Circuit in New York like he has always wanted one there, this puts the "Circuit of Americas" in more jeopardy as it would not be the only circuit in America which means alot less tickets sold and revenue.

    So the Question is: is this good or bad? would you prefer to see a circuit in New York or Texas?
  2. Good for Vergne for getting within 4 tenths of Vettel's time, but I think the Young Drivers should have been driving equal cars. There were rumours about one of the Toro Rosso drivers getting the boot at the end of this season, that would be a great opportunity for Vergne to get a race seat.

    I'd love to see another race in America, but I think 2 is too much. Hopefully they'll make New Jersey or New York interesting.
  3. I think Bottas did the best job in the young driver test, i think Vergne is getting a big head from hes results in the test, Ricciardo did better last year(he set the track record infact for abu dahbi), and you don't see him saying other drivers in the redbull camp should be replaced for him.
  4. Chris Jenkins

    Chris Jenkins
    Driving til the wheels fall off

    I agree, it doesn't prove that Vergne was the best of the drivers, it just solidifies the fact that the Red Bull is a very quick car.
    Ricciardo deserves his shot first, whether that's in a Toro Rosso in 2012 or in a Red Bull in 2013.

    I'd like to see Ricciardo and Alguesuari in Toro Rosso for 2013, maybe getting Vergne in an HRT seat.
    Then Ricciardo up to Red Bull in 2013 and Vergne getting a seat with HRT.

    To say that he "couldn't of done any worse than Webber" is a d***head thing to say. Won't do him any favours.
    • Like Like x 1
  5. Im hearing rumors of him joining Lotus next year, Red Bull can be a bit patient with its development program anyway as the next drivers after Vergne are only just entering F3 so they are atleast 2 years away from where he is.

    I see Beumi for Ricciardo happeneing and Vergne going to lotus of a back feild team mid season as he does friday sessions with STR.

    I think With Ricciardo he should make easy work of Alguesuari, Ricciardo has already shown to me imo that hes on another level compared to the current STR stable, hes debut with HRT qualifying wise atleast is even favourable compared to vettel in 2007 and he had the same team mate(liuzzi).
    • Like Like x 1
  6. Chris Jenkins

    Chris Jenkins
    Driving til the wheels fall off

    It's interesting you say that, as I personally think Alguesuari's been better on average than Buemi since Canada.
    People seem to be split on who's better out of the two.
    I think Alguesuari's got age on his side. He's still only 21.
  7. I think the most important question is: Who get's the cockpit beside Vettel in the Red Bull 2013?
    Alguersuari will hopefully stay at Toro Rosso and will get Daniel Ricciardo as his team mate.
    Vergne is currently a subject at Caterham and HRT, but HRT also tested Charouz and Clos / Trulli has a contract for 2012 at Caterham. Buemi will have to leave the RB program.
    So the driver that attains most points in the RB colours gets the second cockpit.
    I really hope you understand everything! ;D
  8. Yeah but hes a extremely slow learner and he still hasn't got qualifying down pat, which usually shows the raw speed of the driver.
  9. Chris Jenkins

    Chris Jenkins
    Driving til the wheels fall off

    I'd be interested to see the Qualifying comparison of Buemi and Alguesuari this year.
  10. The record this year is: Buemi 13 to Alguesuari 5

    If after 2.5 years in F1 thats all you have to show for raw pace then i think its a little shameful.

    Considering STR is there to test drivers for there top team red bull, one would think Buemi would be better, as up the front qualifying i much more crucial as the cars are much closer to each other.

    when Alguesuari first joined in 2009 he wasn't even cloe to qualifying near hes team mate, yet Vettel in the exact same situation managed to outqualify hes team mate a few times, when compared to Ricciardo who has out qualified liuzzi 5 times to 4 out of 9 races with no expereince at all with the car it shows the difference in driver adaptability(vettel got outqualified 3 to 5 by liuzzi in 8 races in the STR in 2007 for reference).

    Alguesuari wasn't up to Buemi's standard till around mid 2010 but then dropped off by the end of the season.
  11. Chris Jenkins

    Chris Jenkins
    Driving til the wheels fall off

    Wow I didn't realise it was that one-sided.
    Neither of them deserve a seat in Red Bull in my opinion.

    A snowball's chance in hell I know, but Raikkonen and Vettel in 2013 would be pretty cool.
    Seeing as Red Bull seem to use their junior drivers to do most of the PR/Show Car events.
  12. the problem is there is no benchmark as they have only been team mates, what if there both super talented?

    of course if you could combine them into one it would be good lol.
  13. Chris Jenkins

    Chris Jenkins
    Driving til the wheels fall off

    Back to the Toro Rosso drivers, BBC 5 Live were suggesting that Buemi and Alguesuari could both be sacked off.
  14. Its rumoured that Red Bull's going to sell Toro Rosso to CEPSA, who recently started sponsoring them at Monza. Chances are if they do buy the team, then there could be a whole new driver lineup.

    I don't think many people liked Vergne's comments to the press after the Young Driver Test, basically saying he could do no worse than Webber in the Red Bull.
  15. Chris Jenkins

    Chris Jenkins
    Driving til the wheels fall off

    Apparently that's not likely to happen until 2013/2014
  16. You can't really compare how they out-qualify their team mate considering Alguersuari and Buemi had different ones to what Vettel and Ricciardo had. Also, using qualifying performances to say how good some-one is, isn't a good method. Some drivers are better in the race, like Alguersuari, and that's where the points/championships are won. You also have some drivers who are quick over a lap but not as good over a race distance, like Trulli. I would rather have a driver who could do well during the race and make up for their qualifying position if they done poorly, than someone who would qualify near the front but fail to deliver in the races.
  17. TBH though Buemi is more or less been getting effected by bad luck, but one has to be sacked, there basically equal overall and there eventually needs to be a bench mark.
  18. unfortunately 2012 is an election year in the USA and I'm sure that elected officials are afraid to spend tax payer's money for what many would consider a foreign sport in Texas.

    I think it sucks, but as progressive as Austin is it's still Texas, which is a very conservative state. Can't say I'm surprised that they won't pay the bill ahead of time.

    With that said I think it's terrible. Looks bad on everyone IMO. Bernie wants to come to USA but it's like he's not willing to compromise because Texas was never his top priority in the USA. And the governing bodies around Austin are showing a huge lack of faith in F1 to make their money back.

    Probably the worst part is all of the land that had to be cleared for that damn Tilke track. If construction stops Austin is left with a huge patch of useless cleared land. The concept of using the terrain to make a track is clearly something Tilke can't do.
  19. Kyle Puttifer

    Kyle Puttifer
    @ Simberia @Simberia

    The concept of making good tracks in general is something Tilke can't do. Let's give Populous a shot, see what they can come up with. They modified Silverstone and proposed a good few changes to the sandpit with blue runoffs (I won't call it Abu Dhabi), so we should give them a shot at track design.
  20. Tilke can make good tracks, Korea and India are good examples. But using the terrain as the basis would create more classis tracks like Spa, Nurburgring, Sao Paulo.. Just look at India, it was completely flat before the build. The track is great but it looks artificial.

    And Bottas should get a seat, he really has the talent.. Kimi is probably gone already, not much to say after the Abu Dhabi negotiations seemingly stopped. Renault is still interested but they have a list of drivers where he is not at the top so... One interesting twist there is, Kovalainen could be driving for Renault next year, he's contract has the buyout option.