The Sim Index

Kazumi · Jan 23, 2013

And you can’t really criticise a racing game for not being a pure simulation if it was never written as one (CM F1-2012).

Source: http://simtorque.wordpress.com/

Well, I do get your point, sometimes things need to be put into perspective. However I think people are more then allowed to critisize that Codemasters F1 games aren't perfect as a simulation. If games like, say, Grid 2 and pCars are not made as simulation, we can still critisize their quality as "pure" simulation or that they are not created as one.

On a smaller scale think of Forza Horizon which concept is "less simulation" then the main Forzas. People know it's the concept and the devs and publisher were open about it from the beginning ("action racer") but it still allows both critisizing the outcome and the concept itself. On the other hand you can also positively critisize that they succeeded realizing that concept to some extent. So it just has to be put into perspective

SimTorquer · Jan 24, 2013

You can criticise their quality as a sim, but why would you? All you are criticising is that it is not meeting your needs which is unfair if it wasn't designed to in the first place.
By that logic I could buy a Subary Impreza STi and criticise it for not being a Lamborhghini Aventador.
I think this is where the problem comes in with some sim-racers. They seem to expect that all racing games should be written for them and THEN dumbed down for the masses.

I would prefer to have this discussion on my blog, obviously, so feel free to post your feelings there and I`ll be happy to respond.

David Ignjatovic · Jan 24, 2013

SimTorquer said:
I think this is where the problem comes in with some sim-racers. They seem to expect that all racing games should be written for them and THEN dumbed down for the masses.

ah, a true awakening has occurred!!

Kazumi · Jan 25, 2013

Wait. They shouldn't be dumbed down at all

Racing games (not sims) are overall of higher quality when they actually have the goal not to be sim, like Blur or Driver, not to mention racing games that don't feature cars at all. These games don't have to be compared to or rated as sim, of whatever purity. Then I agree they can be good at what they are supposed to be.

But the middle ground of Codemasters, TDU or games who are much closer to sims or actually just dumbed down but based on "pure" sim engines - they could benefit from more sim-like handling (bonus -> FFB for wheel users as more sim-like in most cases also means improved FFB, and the other way around)

Personally I also like "arcade" racing games, they are an obvious choice for local splitscreen multiplayer and on portables for me. But maybe let's get back to topic

David Ignjatovic · Jan 29, 2013

Yes I love simulators, yes I played nearly all others sim (GTR2, LFS, Rfactor2...), YES Ilove PCARS wich is a real simulator.

A VR comment.....a comment that doesn't make any sense to me.
By what criteria is he judging this as a real sim in comparison to the other sims he mentioned?

Real sims could disappear if people don't pay attention.

David Ignjatovic · Feb 25, 2013

re- Assetto Corsa and rf2.

First AC.
Off to an impressive start with the tech preview, the overall package at a technical level is very good.
That said, the Lotus is quite boring{unlike rf2's Corvette}, but the important criteria has been met, ie, it's an outstanding sim that will be loved by many once it hits the shelves+ let's not forget the impact of the modders and Kunos's own updates

To be honest I'm simply excited by the thought of the full game release......plenty of desirable cars and a decent number of tracks that could redefine plug and play for G27/Logitech owners.

Speaking of G27, AC works exceptionally well with it and was very easy to set up.

Where does the Lotus stand on the sim index.....it must be in the top of the charts by virtue of it's mix of physics/FFB and steering precision, plus it's GFX and sound detail are good as well.
Are we on the verge of a bunch of Kunos Ferrari's and BMW's.....is this really going to happen, I feel like I'm in a dream state at the prospect of driving the full release.
Can't wait!!!!

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Now we get to ISI's rf2 Corvette, and amazingly, this could be one of the best sim cars ever.....well I guess that's not so surprising, but ISI are definitely hit and miss with rf2 IMO, but the new Corvette is an immersive champ.

rf2 has punchier sound than Assetto Corso, granted AC is far from finished, either way, the Vette sounds and drives good....in fact, the Vette is not only one of the best sim cars, it's one of the more exciting cars to drive{using bog stock b146 G27 profile}.

The powerful V8 Corvette is prone to oversteer but is actually quite controllable, and it really does everything well, and it isn't as tail crazy as the Nissan GTR.

I think ISI need to raise their game and fix the physics issues on the GTR and even the megane feels a bit centre sprung.

I honestly think Assetto Corso is going become the most respected sim ever as the physics philosophy of Kunos makes sense to me....rf2 OTOH has too many issues other than the suspect physics to make me care much.

Every time ISI release a new car,the ISI forum fannyboys go apeshit{granted the Vette is worthy of it's praise}, but IMO, many of the rf2 cars have issues that don't make sense or are built around the physics philosophy of "the harder it is to drive, the more realistic".......well, so be it, the MP is still dead 13months later as is the mod scene.

David Ignjatovic · Feb 25, 2013

From now on, any game or car in any game that fails to work properly with my G27 will be deemed as Arcade.

In rf2, the Nissan GTR has dodgy rear grip, as such it's prone to unrecoverable spins, but the 370 GT4 and the Corvette GT2 both have good to very good rear wheel behaviour, so it seems to me that the issue with the GTR is physics not controller related, IOW, the GTR is a sim car with poor physics, specifically the rear end behaviour.

Most traditional sims all work well with my wheel, but the quality of the cars themselves can vary, either way, the best sim cars are precise and believable, whereas arcade "games" always have either major controller issues or major physics issues, or both.

David Ignjatovic · Jul 18, 2013

So I've bought GTR2 on steam for a few bob, patched it and installed P&G......and what I've noticed is that GFX and FFB are better than the demo and the GTR2 carpack mod 4 RACE07, so some of the GTR2 cars like the 360 Modena will score 9.4+ on sim index.

Buy GTR2 asap and use G27 or greater.