Discussion in 'Presto GP' started by Valerio Vinassa, May 14, 2014.
short thread please
I was battling with Valter, he had better straightline speed and i had the cornering so it was tight. Finally he made enough mistakes so i could get a chance for a pass. We went side by side in T1, touching wheels (IMHO, that was allright) then T2 he got sligthly ahead as i was already looking for T3 entry where i held the inside line (My front tires at level with his rear tires).. He turned on me and i got no room or time to react. It ended up with my pushing him sideways until we separated. I can't take all the blame on this incident, i had the inside and we were side by side. I must've been on his blindspot since he just turned on the inside like i wasn't there. I ended tooking the curb almost with 4 tires trying to avoid him. It was too late, pitmaneuver i believe it is called. I did not wait since at the time i didn't think it was my fault, still don't think i should've had to.
Really sorry Valter, i was counting that you knew i was there and give me room, there was a gap and i took it. I'm betting you felt angry after that, i would've. But i had that line and i had even practiced this exact situation so i knew i can keep it and that anyone on that line on the outside can't. Was looking for wheel to wheel until mid corner and then final pass before or at T4 depending what the opponent can do.. The angle how it happened didn't require a lot of touch but by the trajectory, it was bound to happen. The same thing happened with Nelson on one of the practice starts where i cut him off believing there was no one on the inside when there were.
This is a case where i think we need 3rd party opinion aka our fellow drivers. I'm sure Valter has different view on this (i would in his shoes...) Because i did not wait and the little line of when one has to yeild. We did have great battle until then thou, didn't notice lap counter until lap 6..
EDIT: screenshots just before and at the moment of impact and at "point of no return". notice where my front tires are pointing me.
no incidents to report
I believe that in online race is hard understand where drivers/cars are, example Kennett must try the overtake and Valter must defend the position every turn is so and for avoid this someone must lift the feet or left the room, for me who is in front have the command and in these moment who drive ahead sure don't look the mirrors so more attention (lost tenths I know) have to take who is back because is more easy take a evaluation.
1 incident when lapping bob at the last chicane, bob was very slow through the last chicane and i ran into the back of him allowing reik a chance to attack, similar happened to reik earlier so the time loss was cancelled out in our fight but it lost both of us a bit of time.
No incidents to report
That sounds familiar...
Same incident like David.
I closed up on Nelson at the last chicane. I was afraid David could get into my slip stream so I was too much in a rush to leave this section. That made me slightly touch Nelsons rear before he had a chance to move over (not sure if Nelson lifted instead of going on as quick as possible).
However I take full responsibility for this, because it's just my bad luck to arrive at a slower driver there. It's not my right to move you over. Instead I should accept the following driver gets a chance to make a move on me. That's racing. So I'm very sorry Nelson and please don't feel under pressure once I appear in your mirror again. Just drive as fast as you can until you decide to give room in a safe place.
No incidents to report
I'm glad you could go on after that contact. I thought you were further back. I can see now that you had the LF wheel on my inside. Sorry if I slowed you down mate. I got no damage from the incident.
@Kennett Ylitalo Reminds me of a certain incident...
I do believe Valter thought you were further back, but leaving a tad of breathing room just in case would have prevented the incident.
IMHO, whenever you (and by you in this case I mean Valter) have a car near, you should try (at least try) to give room for it even if it means not taking race line and losing speed. But it is clear that my point of view is not shared by all.
I enjoyed the fight fully, it was awesome. Had to think for 6 laps where i can make that overtake, that was pretty much the only place, you were too fast thru T9, no room in the last chicane.. I had practiced for this thou, leaving T2 just tad wider to get attack on T3 inside. Looking for the next battle
I knew I should have spent another half hour composing my view on your incident (on your request, you are welcome) to make sure you would not misinterpret it.
Everybody here agrees that we always should leave room if you have someone on your side. What I said is that in the turn where you and tito made contact you would not be able to go side by side with the speed you (plural) kept and someone would have to pull out.
If I was to answer the question who failed to leave room I would say both or neither. Look at the video again; how much further to the right could tito be? You can just as well argue that you didn't leave him enough room, forcing him to balance on a knifs edge. If you freeze the pic at the point of contact you can see half of Tito's car is on the curb!
EDIT: I remember you argued you left him lots of room in the first turn, if you look at it from the other side, consider how much room tito is leaving you compared to how much you leave him when you make contact.
L7 Come a little too far out in the last corner and lost the grip in the rear and kissed the wall, end of race
I said I tried to leave room and... no ****, he left me a lot of room on the first turn when he had the inside...
Doh, really, I give up on this.
and he didnt have to leave you room on the second turn because, ermm you shouldve yielded, whats so hard to understand that one of you needs to yield?, this aint rocket science although we might get somewhere if we started talking about that.
man suck it up, everyone disagrees yet your still adamant, if i was to leave every time someone disagreed with me id be leaving 4 times a season since season 2, enough has been said about the incident if your just not getting it you probably never will.
no incidents to report
I think I see what Alberto is saying the problem is, as at the next corner where Tito resumes racing line and there's his no space argument, but I don't think you can say someone never left you room when your car isn't really. The incident happens before you guys get to there and I think even if hypothetically Tito had managed to race leaving space and the next turn it would have made no difference to the 1st incident and it would have still happened.
Way to avoid this would be in my opinion either Alberto leaves more space, if this had happened and both had made it through side by side of the 1st turn we could consider/discuss what possibly could have happened next turn but will be a lot of guess work. Like what if was more room would Tito had to ride kerb so hard or would Alberto be actually along side if the slower wide line taken, important thing to remember is I believe fully that neither Alberto or Tito tried to make the incident and both are just trying to have some close racing, accidents will happen.
I think by way you posted it obviously still bothered so felt I should maybe post to, I usually like to see people come to some agreement, actually Kennett and Valter have shown this above exactly, but I know myself its not always possible.
Sometimes you can swear blind that what you arguing for is 100% correct even if majority disagrees its maybe best to agree to disagree no hard feelings and move on I seen no reason for you to quit, dont give up! Alberto keep racing
Back to Barcelona .....
I see it Valter just like you said, turned in not thinking Kennett was there, way to avoid would be to try and be aware where battling car is and if uncertain, presume the car close up along side. Obviously this may still not have avoided as Valter thought he wasn't that far up but can only try to be mind your surroundings.
No incidents to report.
alberto !!! first of all I wanna say that I'm not a pro driver!!! but in our incident i believe that we can give space each others but not in all the turns... in our incident I believe that we can play the position until we had to go left.... there was only one line to stay on track... I had no place to go!! anyway I'm sad you stop to race because we had the same time lap more or less
I'm sorry for my negative tone in my previous post, it was written in affection.
Point is that there will always be situations where drivers see situations differently, all we can ask from each other is to give an honest and objective view and respect each other for doing that.
The last thing I want is for you to quit racing with us, we need to be able to disagree from time to time and still be friends
true story :
another true story..
up until a few seasons ago i was the worst here for never seeing the point of incident threads, i always looked for someone to blame before sitting down and thinking about all that couldve been done different, the guys here will vouch for this, prolly all got more than annoyed with me constantly seeing the worst in everything, since then ive managed to lighten up, see things from a more objective point of view and in turn its made me appreciate the group we have here even more that we can all have opinions but they never get to the stage we argue (well not anymore for me ).
another true story stemming from incidents and disagreements was that myself and tim started off on the wrong foot i feel back then, i reacted stupidly to incident reports and for a few seasons it seemed we had an incident every race, now i get on great with tim and all that crap is in the past so shows that even if you disagree regular you can still have a good relationship with your competators and friends in the league.
i may sound harsh in some posts, especially the last one and im sorry for that but i saw some digs directed at nico and after all hes done for us and continues to do i didnt feel it was fair, afterall he gives his own time to help us with these incidents that hes very rarely involved in himself.
stick around alberto nobody wants you to leave or sit out the season, its just a disagreement, moving forward is all that matters
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