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Discussion in 'Simracing Team Challenge' started by Xosé Estrada, May 17, 2010.

Penalty for RPM car?

Poll closed May 19, 2010.
  1. No penalty

    0 vote(s)
  2. +15 sec

    0 vote(s)
  3. +30 sec

  4. +60 sec

  5. No points

    0 vote(s)
  6. No points / no qualy in next race

    0 vote(s)
  7. No points / DQ for next race

    0 vote(s)
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  1. Xosé Estrada

    Xosé Estrada

    Disadvantaged car: Jack Keithley
    Team: DHR

    Reported car: Dragos Haba
    Reported Team: RPM


    Heading into turn one on the first lap, Dragos Haba attempts a pass on Jack Keithley on the inside, but carries to much speed into the corner, runs to the middle and wide, and runs Into Jack on exit which pushes him into the wall, causing terminal damage.

    There was plenty of room on the inside, almost two cars width of space, and if Dragos had slow down more and kept the inside line the passing attempt could have been made cleanly, but due to him carrying to much speed into the corner and not using the space on the inside more it put Jack out of the race before he managed to complete a single corner.
  2. Ross Balfour

    Ross Balfour
    #99 | Roaring Pipes Maniacs

    Similiar situation to the FOR vs COR incident, Jack turned in on Dragos when Dragos already had the position into the corner. Will be interesting to see if other teams agree :p

    We will give our verdict soon.
  3. Dragos has already admitted he was at fault for the incident as it clearly shows in the video. Jack gave him plenty of room, just Dragos carried to much speed into the corner thus caused the incident ruling jack out of the race. Jack never turned into Dragos, he took a very wide line, and if he had run wider he would of run into the wall on his own accord or lost more positions.
  4. Ross Balfour

    Ross Balfour
    #99 | Roaring Pipes Maniacs

    Yeah, Dragos is at fault, of course he is. But he did have his car ahead of Jack's into the corner and ran slightly wide. RPM will vote No penalty or 15 seconds. But that will have the same outcome.
  5. I don´t use to opinate in that matters, but I don´t find the similitude between that incidents.

    In the FO & COR accidents it looks like the COR car goes into the apex early and maybe more than necesary, even when it is clear the FO cars brakes earlier to give him room, as it is clear the COR team is ahead when reaching the corner. Here is not the same as the car in the inside clearly is ahead because he breakes later than the car in the outside line, and it makes Dragos go wide and sending the DHR car on the tyre wall. Look on the DHR car line into the corner, to me it looks like there is space enough to pass without touching him.

    Appart of it, and letting it up to every team´s consideration, remember when you judge an accident is not only the manouver what you have to judge, it is also the consecuences for both cars, specially the damaged one. And if you compare both incidents, there are relevant diferences. Just my opinion.

    Appart of it, please, try to post your decision and vote, trying to don´t open a long discussion for every incident report. :tongue:
  6. fully supported 200%, thought we had all learned from Sugo-Reports ...
  7. Ross Balfour

    Ross Balfour
    #99 | Roaring Pipes Maniacs

    Sorry Davido, I have a habit of ranting a bit :wink:
  8. No problem Ross! :) I know it is normal when you are representing a team, so I understand.

    But it is important to grant a fast and good function of the WAR system, specially now wh have consecutive weeks of racing.

    Thans guys!
  9. lol, i don't see the problem in discussing a incident. I find it very good reading, there is no right or wrong just different opinions :) .
    Also the team filling the incident gives his opinion, so the reported team has a equal right to gives his. And that they don't agree is kinda logic :D. So abit of :chat: doesn't hurt :) :) as long as its no :pcbeat:
  10. Hmm. I think Haba would also clipped the wall if he didnt uses Jack his car to make the corner.
    I say its not the intention offcourse. But he is real lucky that Jack is there. Personal i dont like these moves in the first corner of a 90 min race on a street track.
    Penalty should be applied imo also with the damage involved. Dont know wich one yet.

  11. Offcourse Jack turns in, otherwise its straight into the wall without any contact. ;)
  12. I think this one is difficult to judge. Not because it's hard to decide if it's a race incident or not.. because to me it is clearly not.

    To me it looks like the DHR car is doing everything to avoid an accident while the RPM car is braking waaay to late and might possibly hit the wall himself if hitting the Porsche hadn't slowed him down. However I'm not at all sure about penalty since I cant remember seeing this kind of incident before.

    I DONT care about the resulting injury of an incident. To me it's wrong doing or it's not. If its wrong it should be penalized, if not there should be no penalty. That's why I always award a "punt" +15 sec. To me this is worse. It looks like a gamble that didn't pay off having bad results for the DHR car.

    Since DMSv is in the title race with RPM and what to me would be a reasonable penalty could change the outcome of the race DMSv will abstain from voting in this matter.
  13. Xosé Estrada

    Xosé Estrada

    You can't John :tongue:
  14. Also should look at

    2.- Effect would be the damage and the lost time and positions.

    In this case the incident could of had a big influence on the race result, because if Jack had not been there maybe Dragos would of been in the wall instead or if the incident did not happen at all maybe the top 3 could of looked differently, also the incident might have lost us our chance to regain the 3rd spot.

    The effect of each incident plays a big role on what penalty to apply, as David points out, this is apart of STC voting and must be taken into consideration.
  15. For the record, I think this i wrong.

    But since the rules require all teams to vote..

    Knowing that Dragos Haba isn't a dirty driver; +60 sec
  16. Blue Flag voted +30 secs. There is ample room left by Jack. This is l1t1 of a 90 minutes race which, like the last one or two turns 90 minutes later, merrits special attention. We have been advised to take extra care in every single warm up before the races. In real life racing we figure it would have been a drive through, so +30 is close to that.
  17. Ross Balfour

    Ross Balfour
    #99 | Roaring Pipes Maniacs

    Yeah exactly effect, we would get the win taken off us...AGAIN. Its the same as every other incident that normally gets +15seconds, but we seem to get more dished out to us. Not exactly fair is it.
  18. on our forum, COR mates says exactly what written by Echart, especially considering that appened in the first lap: +30 sec penalty
  19. It was an unfortunate incident. I can see that Dragos is heavy on the brakes, BTW I would have liked to have had Dragos' view in this incident too. I can see Dragos begins to turn but has to come straight for some reason. I do feel he could have made the corner if he had not made contact but..

    This is the first corner on the first lap and everyone seems to be capable of looking out for all around them. I know Dragos could out brake Jack but this is just bad luck.

    AnE had some VERY split votes, I had 3 tied votes on this, and so have gone for the mean of the three.

    On a more personal vote, Ross I know you and AnE have come to blows but I was not part of AnE back then and do not judge you on any preconceptions based around my team. I would be just as harsh on any driver who makes this mistake. That is everyone except David Garcia, then I would be harsh :cool:
  20. Thank you Michael, I love you too :tongue:
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