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Have Your Say: Is Bigger Necessarily Better?

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by Paul Jeffrey, Jul 22, 2017.

  1. Paul Jeffrey

    Paul Jeffrey
    RaceDepartment Editor-in-Chief Staff Premium

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    Have Your Say - Sim Racing Hardware.jpg
    We all like our toys, but does high end equipment in sim racing translate to better lap time? Discuss.


    The basic requirements to go sim racing in any sort of reasonable fashion are simple - games machine (either PC or console) / wheel & pedals / monitor (or TV) and the sim itself.

    However as you immerse yourself more in the virtual sport we all love, the desire to improve and expand ones equipment becomes ever stronger, in some cases leading to the purchase of several thousand pounds worth of hardware in the form of direct drive wheels, high end pedals, virtual reality headsets and even full motion rig setups.

    Now it is in no doubt that immersion can be improved with equipment, but does it buy you speed?

    Our question today is:

    Does high end hardware increase your performance out on track?

    The question of 'high end hardware' is open to your interpretation. We can include things like expensive wheels and pedals / motion rigs / VR / 4K monitors or whatever you want that is over and above a basic, entry level sim racing setup.

    Have fun debating and leave a comment below!
     
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  2. chargingcar

    chargingcar
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    I believe so yes :)
     
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  3. Jimlaad43

    Jimlaad43
    Nice apex, I'll take it! Staff Premium

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    G29 on an Ironing board is all I need. It's adjustable and easy to out away.

    40" TV screen does the job, and a comfy armchair means I don't need any other fancy equipment to enjoy myself and race for fun.
     
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  4. Azure Flare

    Azure Flare
    Forever a backmarker Premium

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    It can in certain circumstances, but it won't compare to how much bigger your e-peen will be.
     
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  5. simon nicholson

    simon nicholson
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    I've been racing in assetto corsa with vr for over a month now and my lap times have got considerably quicker. :)
     
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  6. Gopher04

    Gopher04
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    Nope, some of the fastest sim racers I've known over 20+ years have had quite basic setups, it can make you abit quicker sometimes, because some hardware ie, wheel and pedals can give yourself a better feel, but overall it's like most things it's a natural gift like in the real world, or alot of practice hours and learning. Big rigs like in the pic, just help you get right into that sim world and just make more enjoyable.
     
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  7. Patrick van der Meulen

    Patrick van der Meulen
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    For pedals, yes, to some extent. For wheels, maybe, but certainly in lesser extent. All the rest is just immersion. If you can and will afford it, great, why not. If you can't or won't afford it you won't really miss it.

    And I always think of it as this: good load cell pedals will make you be able to be more consistent. And being more consistent will make you faster in the long run. And with wheels, if you can set them up properly I sure believe a DD wheel will have it's benefits for feeling better feedback and enabling to give even more refined input. But at steep costs.

    And as @Gopher04 says, you would be surprised on which setups aliens have won championships. Sometimes almost beyond basic.
     
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  8. Glaurung

    Glaurung
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    Pedals may give some time gain with vintage cars without abs and performing heel&toe.
    Not sure about wheels but I've been always with a full stock G27 so it's just my opinion.
    Definitely bigger monitors or VR can help in lap time consistency because of better peripheral perception.
     
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  9. Stephen O'Sullivan

    Stephen O'Sullivan
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    I've definitely got faster since moving from a cup of tea to a mug.
     
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  10. RasmusP

    RasmusP
    AC Stuff and G27 help Staff Premium

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    I wouldn't say it makes you quicker in general.
    But I would say it makes you quick faster.:cool:

    When I practice with a plan, a strategy etc. (1x a month or something) I really see the limits of my equipment (G27, single 27" screen, Wheelstand Pro, Real Head Motion and a chair on wheels).

    - the G27 doesn't provide the very little details in a clear way like I felt when testing a T300. So I recognize the rear stepping out a bit later. With more practice I learnt (and still learn) how to feel the little details earlier.
    Same goes for brakes and throttle. I already modded them and with more practice I am getting better. Of course it's possible to become an Alien with it but with a proper Loadcell it's way easier to build up the muscle memory :)

    - The screen is too little. I am sitting about 70cm away with my head (desk, wheelstand, me) and without the look to apex (RHM plugin for AC, pCars and AMS built in) I get dizzy in tight turns.
    The problem with look to apex is that you don't see when the car starts to slide. With the fixed camera you see when the car is altering it's line.
    Again: with more practice I learn how to recognize it better!

    - the chair: I have to fixate my chairs wheels and I always end up in a slightly different position. Nothing really I can do about bit but in my opinion a still standing setup with a more massive chair so you are always in the same position would actually help! Plus my chair starts to spin around it self when I step on the brakes. Also not that great for muscle memory.


    But in the end I won't get 2 seconds faster just with a better setup. It would be easier to become better but it won't make me better instantaneous! To show how much practice does: In our AC Club Races I got 3rd and 4th on a Track I really practiced on for over an hour and I got almost last when I didn't. :p
     
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  11. The Flying Hun

    The Flying Hun

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    It can increase driving competence if one ugrades from very inferior wheels and pedals to significantly better ones, say you upgrade from a 450° spring-mounted wheel to a 270° FFB. But ugrading from something like a G27 to a Thrustmaster or Fanatec device, most likely will not make most drivers faster.

    More decisive for improving your driving, is the quality of the brake pedal. Still, no reason to expect miracles and wonders.

    What it does when you upgrade, is that immersion, comfort/luxury feeling and enjoyment feedback get a boost. Is it worth the money? Everybody decides for himself, there is no general answer that fits all. What is worth it for the one, guy, must not be worth it for the other guy. Everybody does as he likes it best, and what is within the limits of what he can afford.
     
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  12. The Flying Hun

    The Flying Hun

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    I meant upgrading from a 270° spirng mounted wheel to a 900° FFB wheel, of course. Software does not let me edit .
     
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  13. ears

    ears

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    The law of diminishing returns right?

    Spending £150 to go from an Xbox controller to a G27 will result in a huge increase in enjoyment,, immersion and connectedness. Spend another (guessing) £700 on some high end pedals and equipment and the jump in performance will probably not be so big.

    VR is slightly different. Preferences probably come into play. My opinionn would be that £400 on a VR headset will bring significantly more speed and consistency than £600 on large triples. But those who want ultra HD 4K graphics may not be prepared to make the sacrifice for it.
     
    Last edited: Jul 22, 2017
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  14. 2stains

    2stains

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    I went from ps4 with Fanatec GT2 to high end PC @4k and CW v2 and have gained immersion x10 but nothing has really changed in lap times (i might be slower now because i'm always admiring the picture quality at ultra @ 4k) lol
     
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  15. Jempy

    Jempy
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    When you meet nearly "alien" drivers ... with a stock G27 and a single screen ... you finally understand such an equipment can make some drivers slightly quicker ... but it's not the main point .... the driver is ! ;)

    Just for a question of better view, however, a triple screen config surely helps for better curves apprehension and better driving line.
    A good seat surely also gives a better driving position than a single office chair. :whistling:

    But everything depends on your aim .... and of course your own ... resources
    NB and of your beloved .... wife ?? :roflmao:
     
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  16. Will Mazeo

    Will Mazeo

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    If it makes you faster or not I don't know and personally I don't care. I do wish I had a dedicated simrig tho simply because I'd drive a lot more if I had one instead of having to move my wheel to the desk all time. So many times I wanna drive but end up cliking on other games instead because it's easier lol
     
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  17. MinDer_K.

    MinDer_K.

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    1 screen < triple screen < VR; I improved my lap times and driving in general.
    I mean with triplescreen you have more field of view (which is cool to look at the apex), but still in 2D. VR adds depth, distances are finally judgeable; it's easier to determine where to brake without looking speedometer or trackside.
    Also I greatly improved my drifting skill with VR and I can now tandem without touching the car in front.

    I had some wheels and "quality" of FFB can varry between games:
    I spent a lot of time on Gran Turismo Series, got a DFGT on GT4 and it was a blast. Then I got G25 and G27 (previous one always broke) and the feeling on GT5 was perfect.
    Meanwhile, there were rumors that people with controllers were faster than wheels' drivers, never been proven.
    But when GT6 came out, the story was different: PoDi had develloped this one with T500RS in hands and I was desapointed by the poor FFB's quality of my Logitech. I also thought my FFB became weak because of intensive use. I felt I was a spectator moving my wheel left and right in front of my screen.
    Then I purchased Assetto Corsa (PC) and rediscovered how amazing was my wheel. Then I bought a T300RS and didn't noticed a big difference with the G27.
    Yes, a good FFB wheel can make you go faster, but I don't think a 1500€ or more wheel will make me more faster.
     
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  18. Chris

    Chris
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    @Dave Stephenson @Bram or anyone for that matter!
    Does anyone remember the video from a few years back with the guy doing a parody SimRig tour? With his "Sparco" seat which was just a stool, and a cell phone taped to the steering wheel?

    I want to find this vid so badly! Probably the best simracing video ever :roflmao:
     
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  19. Lars Hansen

    Lars Hansen
    Buggered if I know..... Premium

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    Can it make you faster? Yes.
    Moving to a better wheel made me feel more connected to the car.
    Moving to a bigger screen enabled me to use correct FOV.
    Better pedals made me more consistent.
    And finally, a dedicated sim cockpit simply made me want to practice more often.

    Having said all that though, the most important piece of kit is still going to be the guy behind the wheel.
    It's like shooting at a range. You can get the best rifle and sights money can buy, but if you can't shoot it ain't gonna help ya much. :)
     
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  20. chargingcar

    chargingcar
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    Yeah that would be awesome sounds great find it man :D