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Featured Canadian GP: Drivers weigh in on Verstappen comments

Discussion in 'Formula 1' started by Seb Scott, Jun 5, 2015.

  1. Yes - Should've been a race ban

  2. No - The penalty was justified

  3. Shouldn't have had a penalty - It was a racing incident

Results are only viewable after voting.
  1. Seb Scott

    Seb Scott
    Formula 1 Reporter

    Verstappen Grosjean crash.jpg
    Max Verstappen has been put under extreme scrutiny following his accident with Romain Grosjean at the Monaco GP, which prompted the safety car and indirectly caused Lewis Hamilton to pit and concede victory to Nico Rosberg.

    Verstappen originally hinted Grosjean brake checked the 17 year old rookie, "I braked in the same spot like the lap before but he clearly braked 10-15 metres earlier. When it is that close, you have no room. He caught me by surprise.

    "I realised at the moment he braked, but by then it is too late because you don't expect someone to brake that early.”

    Verstappen was asked in the press conference what he had heard and replied - you could argue rather sarcastically - "I learned the cars are pretty strong, so I'm happy about that. I didn't have any injuries or a lot of problems after that. But what happened will not change me as a racing driver.”

    The Toro Rosso seems to have upset some drivers with this comment, however as a rookie, Verstappen needs to establish himself as a driver and not let external sources influence him as a) a driver and b) a personality.

    "I will keep fighting, especially when you want to fight for the points, I will still go for it. I will not change my driving style."

    If he was to be put in the same situation, Verstappen said he would do the exact same thing again, although he’d have made a couple of tweaks to his plan of attack.

    "I was attacking, I wanted to respond, especially after the pitstop we'd had, maybe I would have turned a bit earlier to the right, tried to avoid it a bit more, maybe tried to do it on another lap.”

    Romain Grosjean has told the media Verstappen should learn from it, admit he has made a mistake, and the Frenchman did expect an apology. Grosjean is probably the best driver on the grid who is able to empathise with Verstappen. When you consider his comeback to Formula One in 2012, he received a race ban from the 2012 Belgium Grand Prix due to a first lap incident and earned himself the nick name from Mark Webber: “First lap nut case”

    "I've made mistakes, quite a lot of them, been treated as a 'first-lap nutcase' - thank you Mark - which hurts a little bit," said Grosjean.

    "But I've learned from them, they have made me much stronger, I've been on the podium, so there's no problem of having a crash or doing a mistake in a race.

    "The only key is to admit to it, learn from it and apologise to the people you crash into."

    Grosjean was asked if Verstappen had apologised and he shook his head saying "It's disappointing we went to the stewards after the grand prix, I tapped him on the back and he could have said 'I'm sorry. But to then say he brake tested me is completely wrong because I braked later than the lap before.”

    It seems Grosjean is trying to be supportive towards the Dutch driver, accepting the crash and emphasising Verstappen needs to learn ”As I say, as long as you learn, you are allowed to do mistakes. Max is really, really talented, and what he has been doing is quite impressive, but he has made a mistake. I find it disappointing he hasn't learned from it.”

    "The only thing I wish is he learns from it and then I'm sure he is going to have very successful races.”

    When Jenson Button was asked about the incident he said "He's obviously inexperienced, it's easy to go and jump on the bandwagon with that,” Button, also tried to send a bit of advice to Verstappen, on his open straight forward comments, especially concerning brake testing.

    “I think, the thing is, you've got to be very careful with what you do say in the press. To point the finger at someone and say that they brake tested you, that's serious. I don't think that happens in motorsport these days, we're all grown-ups and we don't do things like that in Formula 1.”

    Button was asked his opinion on Verstappen’s remarks "It was a surprise, yes. Obviously emotions run high in this sport, but looking at the talent that we have in the sport, we're all very intelligent guys.

    "We know the dangers of this sport and we'd never do anything like that.”

    Felipe Massa, another veteran driver was also asked his opinion, "I was asked what I thought, and I thought he should be penalised because what he did was wrong,’

    "When you are in your first year, 17 years old, and you do something like that, if you are not penalised it's completely wrong.

    "The FIA needs to be strong in a proper way, and that's what they did, but that's what I said, and I don't change my mind. That's what I believe.”

    Should Verstappen have been given a race ban or at least a much harsher penalty than a five place grid drop? Should he be penalised for saying he’s not really learned anything and that he would do it again?
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 5, 2015
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  2. keep these silly comments up drivers and marchals and nobody will bother to look even more at F1, to much whining, its boring as it is atm, let them fight it out on track, I long for the times they smack each other on the head with the helmet, so much more fun. hell moto- gp have more noise and there are plenty off open wheel races classes that match f1 in speed, what have become off the king class.
    I'm off this weekend to blancpain at zolder close racing with a bit off rubbing, lol
    • Agree Agree x 2
  3. The reason why he has been put under scrutinized so much, especially by fans is because it helped contribute to Hamilton not winning a processional race. Was punish someone for racing just because both of them were fighting for position?
    I've seen the replay and Grojean looked very unstable in the braking phase of the move.
    • Agree Agree x 1
  4. Sk3ptik0n

    Premium Member

    I don't want to defend Verstappen, he was too aggressive, but I too got the impression the Grosjean was a bit squirrely just before the impact.

    It would be great if F1 could have some sort of graphical representation of what a car does on track, like for instance record when someone hit the brakes on one lap and compare it to the next lap. Maybe one day they'll invent some magical device like that.

    I don't think Grosjean "brake checked" Verstappen, but rightly so he was willing his car to increase its girth. He could have braked a bit earlier too, maybe trying to throw off the timing of his opponent.

    All of that would still not justify an inside pass at that turn. It's just not a good percentage move (even though if I recall he managed to pull it off earlier. He should have realized the bottle was empty).

    As far as blaming Verstappen for Hamilton loss, that seems ridiculous to me. That's entirely on the Mercedes strategy. The fact Verstappen created the safety car situation is just part of racing.
  5. Thats... a joke right? Pretty sure they could do that within a measure of accuracy with telemetry right now.
  6. Sk3ptik0n

    Premium Member

    Yes, it is a joke. In this and other articles they make it sound like it was an event they couldn't possibly check on. "He stopped 15 yards sooner than the last lap" or some nonsense like that. If I were innocent of that, I'd simply publish a screenshot of the telemetry and be done with it.

    Not that it would transfer the fault to Grosjean.
  7. Martin Maaskant

    Martin Maaskant
    Premium Member

    For me it was a racing incident. If Max is to blame... well I only can judge that by seeing all the telemetry data which I don't have. IMO if you want to see battles on the circuit then this sort of things will happen. If the FIA will continue this kind of penalty's then drivers are scared to overtake each other. I think this whole thing is blow out of proportion due the age of Max. There was another "dangerous" move by Ricciardo on Räikkönen. IMO also a racing incident but this one isn't penalized. Thus Max an Daniel please continue what you are doing and gives us some entertainment.
  8. If you read my statement carefully I said it "helped contribute to Hamilton's pit" think of it this way that strtegy rethink would have never happened if for no safety car. Otherwise I completely agree wit your ideas and statements.

    I actually think where Grojean braked he probably wouldn't have made it round the corner possibly causing the pair of them to hit each other anyway in the first place. although I can't predict the future and it never happened so it can't really be a considered possibility.
  9. Joel

    #NR6 Premium Member

    I think it's quite obvious why people are upset. Changed the winner of the race from a favourite to a non-favourite. Completely mental.

    It was purely a racing incident. We have seen this happen before. The 5 place grid penalty is stupid. It's not like he did it in "purpose" it was fully and "accident" and accident=incident which in this case is a racing. Incident. I don't think Max was driving dangerously, it just came a bit unexpected.

    Anyways, let's focus on Montreal now :)
    Last edited: Jun 6, 2015
    • Agree Agree x 5
  10. Andrew

    Global Moderator Staff Premium Member

    The pivotal radio message was not broadcast during the race, but can be heard in the edited highlights of the Monaco Grand Prix video on the official Formula One website. It includes the following exchange between Hamilton and race engineer Peter Bonnington:

    From To Message
    Peter Bonnington Lewis Hamilton Safety Car, Safety Car. So we are staying out.

    Lewis Hamilton Peter Bonnington Are you sure it’s the best thing to stay out? These tyres have lost all their temperature. Everyone’s going to be on [super-softs] now.

    Peter Bonnington Lewis Hamilton OK. Copy, copy. Box, box.
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  11. Allan Ramsbottom

    Allan Ramsbottom
    i canny increase the speed captain.. Premium Member

    Romain Grosjean cant say anything about racing incidents..

    Romain Grosjean, brake tested Verstappen...clear to see and payed the price...
    And as for someone claming Verstappen was aggresive,ha ha this is formula 1, that was monaco..maybe you should watch some old senna,prost,mansell battles....THAT was racing..
  12. <modedit show a little respect> Grosjean actually brake later than the previous turn, also there were after the 100 mark ! and Verstappen was going way too fast for that mark, not to mention how are you going to overtaken from the inside of that turn... specially when you need the full width of if. Please stop being an idiot and clawing on Grosjean for no good reason. Btw the penalty was given to Verstappen not Grosjean ! so that clearly shows who's to blame.
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 7, 2015
  13. Chris Stacey

    Chris Stacey
    Ted Kravitz Appreciation Society Staff Premium Member

    Obviously the driver behind holds the responsibility not to run into the guy in front under normal circumstances, but I don't really think either guy is to blame.

    Apparently the data showed that neither of them broke any earlier or later than they had done previously in the grand prix. I think Vestappen was just too eager to get by and positioned his car wrong.
  14. Martin Maaskant

    Martin Maaskant
    Premium Member

    Well eager means that he was planning to overtaking him at that corner. Verstappen stated that he was not planning to overtaking him. I tend to believe that because he was to far away to make it.
  15. fair penalty, they got it right.
    but there's too much fuss continuing about the mistake - move on.
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  16. I think its fair to say this was completely Verstappen's fault however, I have a feeling he's already had a long talk with his team and the consensus is that they probably like his driving style and attitude and are ok with him being aggressive. The kid has a lot of potential.
  17. Martin Maaskant

    Martin Maaskant
    Premium Member

    The incident in Montreal does not help Grosjeans case about his driving. That doesn't mean that Verstappen is not to blame about the Monaco incident but it proves to me that Grosjean is mighty quick to point the finger to another driver.
  18. Martin Maaskant

    Martin Maaskant
    Premium Member

    And it isn't to bad that other drivers know that you are aggressive. It helped M. Schumacher a lot with cutting through traffic in his days. I can remember in the early days of his career he drove into a lot of people when they did not move out of the way quick enough.